With lead that high, it is obviously not bearing wear. If it was bearing wear, you would also see elevated copper, aluminium, and tin. It is most likely leaded gasoline. Well that's the good news, the bad news is that your CAT is a goner.
MObil 7500 7500 miles 2002 4 cyl Camry
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If the lead came from gas - then I would say it took more than one tank.....where do you buy gas? From the same place?
One tank of leaded fuel wouldn't kill a cat.....but a few in a row might. Maybe get your tailpipe invasively (sp?) snooped.
One tank of leaded fuel wouldn't kill a cat.....but a few in a row might. Maybe get your tailpipe invasively (sp?) snooped.
We've pretty well covered our bases:
Antifreeze retested and confirmed negative.
Lead retested and confirmed high - 676 ppm.
Microscope shows no metal particles.
As others have said this oil does have a sodium additive.
It does not have an antimony additive.
High lead can come from fuel, especially aviation gas.
Most fuel additives no long contain lead.
High lead can come from oil additives.
In this case I suspect it is related to the presence of water, perhaps something unique about this additive package but I don't really have the answer. This is a good candidate for Terry's services.
My recommendation is to cut open the filter to check for metal (I doubt there is any as this is probably not a wear related phenomena). Re-sample now and again in 1000-2000 miles if that sample is normal.
Antifreeze retested and confirmed negative.
Lead retested and confirmed high - 676 ppm.
Microscope shows no metal particles.
As others have said this oil does have a sodium additive.
It does not have an antimony additive.
High lead can come from fuel, especially aviation gas.
Most fuel additives no long contain lead.
High lead can come from oil additives.
In this case I suspect it is related to the presence of water, perhaps something unique about this additive package but I don't really have the answer. This is a good candidate for Terry's services.
My recommendation is to cut open the filter to check for metal (I doubt there is any as this is probably not a wear related phenomena). Re-sample now and again in 1000-2000 miles if that sample is normal.
I suppose it would take nine tanks of leaded gas to kill a cat.
Stinkman was I incorrect in my assumption that Sb indicated an Antimony presence? I'm just wanting to understand.
I know this is a good oil, but I have elected not to run it, because I though it might make analysis difficult for now.
I don't even want to see if Terry can be confused with this oil for now, so I stay with a more conventional package. GM you know.
Want some salt wid dem fries?
I know this is a good oil, but I have elected not to run it, because I though it might make analysis difficult for now.
I don't even want to see if Terry can be confused with this oil for now, so I stay with a more conventional package. GM you know.
Hi Haley
We frequently see low levels of elements that are not expected and this can be due to a variety of reasons such as noise, interference, etc. In this case I would say there is no antimony additive in this oil. The ones that do have it show levels around 10-30 ppm or so.
Sodium can make it difficult to interpret the results since as you know it is one of the things we use to screen for coolant. Many of the new coolant contain potassium so that can take the place of sodium as a screening indicator. I haven't seen any new oils with potassium.
The best thing in catching these types of problems is to have a good trend established and by sampling at regular intervals. The use of additives, mixtures of oils, changing oil brands and sampling at different intervals all make interpretation more difficult. One of the worst is not telling the lab how many miles the oil was use.
We frequently see low levels of elements that are not expected and this can be due to a variety of reasons such as noise, interference, etc. In this case I would say there is no antimony additive in this oil. The ones that do have it show levels around 10-30 ppm or so.
Sodium can make it difficult to interpret the results since as you know it is one of the things we use to screen for coolant. Many of the new coolant contain potassium so that can take the place of sodium as a screening indicator. I haven't seen any new oils with potassium.
The best thing in catching these types of problems is to have a good trend established and by sampling at regular intervals. The use of additives, mixtures of oils, changing oil brands and sampling at different intervals all make interpretation more difficult. One of the worst is not telling the lab how many miles the oil was use.
Here is the report:
[ May 19, 2005, 07:24 AM: Message edited by: Stinky Peterson ]
[ May 19, 2005, 07:24 AM: Message edited by: Stinky Peterson ]
allright guys, Let me muddy the water a little more. I have just had a cat failure about 2000 miles ago. It is to be replaced under an extended warranty so perhaps some leaded fuel did get thru the pipeline. My wife just buys gas , well you all know how women are, wherever. Will resample at about 1000 miles. Will keep everyone posted. Thanks for all the info guys.
GregH
GregH
I didn't think you could by leaded gas anymore?
Is there anyway your wife can remember where she had filled up and which one most often? I would notify the Georgia EPA and maybe US EPA.
Stinky, there are products that boost octane and make other claims that contain tetra-ethyl lead (sp?). It's available. Just do a search on the net on "leaded gasoline".
I don't know if an unscrupulous supplier could profit or not by spiking low grade fuel. If so, it probably happens.
I wonder if anti-seize or some other material possibly containing lead was used during the cat work that might have penetrated the oil passages. Did they remove the exhaust manifold? Change any gaskets?
one time on my ex 1988 4 cyl Camry I had a 999 lead. Check the intake plumbing and the fit of the air cleaner to make sure it seals. do another run with the oil and analyise again.
Run Chevron or Amoco for the next 3000 miles and retest for Pb. If you see it at around 30-60 ppm, you know you've been buying leaded gas. The residual Pb will be from the small # of old oil that does not drain out....
Lead is still the cheapest and most effective octane boost and valve lubricant available. Who ever sold you this fuel should go to jail.
TS
Lead is still the cheapest and most effective octane boost and valve lubricant available. Who ever sold you this fuel should go to jail.
TS
Yes leaded gasoline is still produced and sold in the US. Several companies make leaded racing gasoline but it shouldn't end up at any gas station a consumer can fill up at. One race track here in Texas has leaded gas for sale.
About 5 years back I saw a "100 octane racing fuel" pump at a little gas station out in the country I was filling up at.
I don't think your wife would have accidentally used that pump. The stuff was $3.00/gallon, and this was back when 87 octane was $1.20.
I don't think your wife would have accidentally used that pump. The stuff was $3.00/gallon, and this was back when 87 octane was $1.20.
Probably Sunoco, they sell a 100 octane unleaded race fuel at some of their locations (one about 30 mins. from my house).
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