mobil 1 filters cost $12 compared to ac deco at $3.50. I'm running mobil 1 5w-30 and plan on changing it out at 3000 or 4000 miles. Is the mobil 1 worth the price at this milage?
mobil 1 oil filters worth the price?
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Patman
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The Mobil 1 filters definitely keep the oil cleaner than an AC Delco does. The AC Delco
stops mostly 25 microns and larger, while the M1 stops as low as 10.
As far as your oil change interval, you could easily push that Mobil 1 oil to 5 or 6k and beyond. Changing
it at 3k is too soon. EDIT-I'd be a bit worried about 5w30 lasting 5-6k though. I notice it
tends to thin out in a hard driven car. Maybe you should switch to 10w30 before going with
the longer intervals. Definitely do an oil analysis though!
[ August 26, 2002, 05:20 AM: Message edited by: Patman ]
stops mostly 25 microns and larger, while the M1 stops as low as 10.
As far as your oil change interval, you could easily push that Mobil 1 oil to 5 or 6k and beyond. Changing
it at 3k is too soon. EDIT-I'd be a bit worried about 5w30 lasting 5-6k though. I notice it
tends to thin out in a hard driven car. Maybe you should switch to 10w30 before going with
the longer intervals. Definitely do an oil analysis though!
[ August 26, 2002, 05:20 AM: Message edited by: Patman ]
5 to 6k sounds feasible. But would you guys go that long even under warranty? I'm a DIY'er so I'm curious. You know how the dealers will make every attempt to undermine your warranty claim.
They are probably the best out there but changing out the Mobil 1 and the Mobil 1 filter out at 3K is overkill. I would definitely for for 5K minimum and 10W-30 as patmann suggested.
Mine does, 3000 under severe service schedule B. I have a 2001 model year
Patman
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I think Ken is saying that under the normal service schedule that all car makers oil change recommendations are higher than 5k, but are more like 7500 or more.
The manuals pretty much make it idiot proof.
If you do any of these things... Then its severe service, but most people will do at least one of those things.
The way I figure it, if you spend 1/2 the time in the city, and 1/2 the time on the highway, then you are between severe and normal.
So if your severe service interval is 3k and your normal interval is 7500, then using a simple formula (3000 x 50%) + (7500 x 50%) = 5250 you arrive at a little more realistic interval adjusting for your particular mix.
Many cars these days have an oil change light, or an oil life monitor, and that is exactly what these things do. They compute the amount of severe conditions and the amount of light duty, and give you a real figure. The only problem is that it can't take into account the fact that you are using a better oil than the factory spec oil, so it will be very conservative, if you are running a premium oil and filter.
I am very interested in the next generation of oil monitors, the one that will actually measure the oil itself, instead of the conditions.
If you do any of these things... Then its severe service, but most people will do at least one of those things.
The way I figure it, if you spend 1/2 the time in the city, and 1/2 the time on the highway, then you are between severe and normal.
So if your severe service interval is 3k and your normal interval is 7500, then using a simple formula (3000 x 50%) + (7500 x 50%) = 5250 you arrive at a little more realistic interval adjusting for your particular mix.
Many cars these days have an oil change light, or an oil life monitor, and that is exactly what these things do. They compute the amount of severe conditions and the amount of light duty, and give you a real figure. The only problem is that it can't take into account the fact that you are using a better oil than the factory spec oil, so it will be very conservative, if you are running a premium oil and filter.
I am very interested in the next generation of oil monitors, the one that will actually measure the oil itself, instead of the conditions.
Pat what percent of the particles are removed at the 10 micron level? I would guess not very much, maybe 30-40%.
Most effeciency numbers are given at nominal and absolute.
Absolute:
An indication in microns of the largest particle that will pass through a filter element under controlled test conditions where the average filtration (BETA) ratio = 75.0 (98.7% efficiency).
Nominal is 50%
Here is the info from mobil 1:
Also note that the above list the effeciency in the 10-20 micron range(pretty broad huh?) So in essence it could remove 99% at 20 microns and only 50% at 10 microns and still list a combined effecincy of 96% in the 10-20 micron range.
I would rather have them list the effeciency rating at a specific micron level or at least a close one like 18-20, or 10-12 or something like that.
I believe that the Mobil 1 filter and the Amsoil filter are very close in construction and the information I have on the Amsoil is that it is 94% at the 18-20 micron range.
[ August 28, 2002, 02:40 PM: Message edited by: msparks ]
Patman
Staff member
Actually, from what I have heard, the Mobil 1 is 98% efficient at 10 micron particle removal!
Nothing will outperform Mobil 1 oil filters with the exception of the Amsoil filter by a small margin.The PureOne is just a tick under the M1. M1 filters have gotten pricey these days, up by about 2 dollars.
I think the Normal/Severe oil changes are a way to give the manufacturer an extra margin of comfort in terms of the vehicle reaching its "Sorry - no more warranty, buddy" I therefore believe in self preservation and choose to do what I think is best for me and my vehicle. Even Mobil has said that you can run your vehicle up to the maximum period of the milage/time irregardless of your driving conditions. As was mentioned oil analysis will prove that the oil is in acceptable condition. However as far as the manufacturer is concerned: I have enough filter receipts and oil receipts, that I can give them anything they want. Do I feel guilty about deceiving them?? :freak : uh-no.
Here's what Mobil says about their M1 filters:
"The Mobil 1 High Efficiency Oil Filter has a single-pass efficiency of 98 percent for 10- to 20-micron contaminants vs. an average of 85 percent for conventional filters.
"The multiple-pass test is similar to the single-pass, except oil is repeatedly passed through the filter. In a circulating system, the oil flows through the filter many times, so multiple-pass filtration is often used as the more important comparison vs. the single-pass result. The contaminant used for multiple-pass testing is a standardized test dust. The Mobil 1 High Efficiency Oil Filter has a multiple-pass efficiency of 96 percent vs. an average of 82 percent for conventional oil filters."
Amsoil doesn't test their filters with the multiple-pass test. I asked them.
Ken
The PureOne filter seems to have a better cost to benefit ratio for a rated filter.
I do have a question for someone from Amsoil. Does Amsoil publish micron filter rates?
If I remember correctly from when I was searching for the best buy in oil filters (December 2001) PureOne and Mobil 1 were the only companies that published hard data. Amsoil used bar graphs or pie charts.
My eight hours of statistical analysis taught me to not trust anything less than the hard data. Bar graphs and Pie charts are to soft or as they say spinable.
I do have a question for someone from Amsoil. Does Amsoil publish micron filter rates?
If I remember correctly from when I was searching for the best buy in oil filters (December 2001) PureOne and Mobil 1 were the only companies that published hard data. Amsoil used bar graphs or pie charts.
My eight hours of statistical analysis taught me to not trust anything less than the hard data. Bar graphs and Pie charts are to soft or as they say spinable.
How important is a silicon anti-drainback valve?
I've heard the nitrile rubber (black) ones do not stay very flexible in the cold.
I've heard the nitrile rubber (black) ones do not stay very flexible in the cold.
Purolator states on their boxes that they use the J806 test (multiple pass) but I haven't seen the numbers. Anyone have them?
David
Patman
Staff member
A Purolator tech rep told me their Premium Plus filters score a 96% on the multipass test. So the PureONEs would (or should) be better than this.
Purolator sez:
"The Multiple Pass Test of Life and Weighted Average Efficiency (SAE J806) tests a series of oil filter performance variables using a constant flow of contaminated oil through the filter. It measures the media's ability to remove fine dust from oil over an extended period of time-not just the first pass through."
"For the record, however, PureONE ranked #1 in both Multiple Pass and Single Pass Efficiency Tests.
Multiple Pass Test Single Pass Test Rank
PureONE 96% 99.7% #1
--end quote--
Ken
"The Multiple Pass Test of Life and Weighted Average Efficiency (SAE J806) tests a series of oil filter performance variables using a constant flow of contaminated oil through the filter. It measures the media's ability to remove fine dust from oil over an extended period of time-not just the first pass through."
"For the record, however, PureONE ranked #1 in both Multiple Pass and Single Pass Efficiency Tests.
Multiple Pass Test Single Pass Test Rank
PureONE 96% 99.7% #1
--end quote--
Ken
Patman, since you have the purolator catalog, maybe you can answer this question?
I read an oil filter study on another board, I believe it was on a Ford Truck Forum, but the study showed that the bypass valve on the Pure one was on the bottom and on the dirty side. Due to this, Ford does not recommend them. The motorcraft's supposedly have theirs on the top clean side so that if the filter does go into bypass, it bypasses only clean oil. I know several other filters are built this way like the AC Ultraguards.
I have also read on this board a long time ago, that the Pure One's were very good, but more flow restictive than others.
I ask these questions because in about a year I will run out of my stock pile of Ultraguards for both my GM & Ford vehicles and am looking ahead to when I need to switch to another brand.
Its a shame that AC did not market the ultraguards well enough to keep them in production. IMO, they are one of the best out there!
Patman
Staff member
Kevin, I'm not sure if the Purolator catalog shows a cutaway of their filters, or describes the location and design of the bypass valve, but I will check when I get home.
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