If it warms up faster then it is thicker.
Mobil 1 ESP 0w30 observations
- Thread starter Kennedy01
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That’s absurd. Even if you could ascribe such an observation to the one isolated variable of the oil (and you cannot) the physics of this cannot be accurate. Blenders and manufacturers are eeking out sub 1 MPG improvements between grade and here you’re claiming an order of magnitude improvement in the same grade. It’s a miracle.
But as I noted there’s no way to determine this in everyday driving. There are far too many more significant and uncontrolled variables other than the oil all of which push the smaller variable of the oil into the noise.
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No it isn’t. Read up on the tens if not a hundred variables you cannot control. User @Tom NJ (someone who knows what he’s talking about) has several good posts on this related to fuel choice, but the principle applies directly to oil as well.
Not, it's not a miracle. It's the difference between a stuck ring pack and reduced compression and freed rings that seal better. I'm not sure why this is so hard to understand. VRP is the only oil I've used where after one oil drain interval you could FEEL the difference.
A corrected mechanical problem that the oil facilitated. Not something that is inherent to the grade and not necessarily reproducible by others that may not have the same issue.
Patman
Staff member
When I switched my Honda over to QSUP last spring I immediately started noticing quite a bit better MPG however it was also at the same time that they switched back to the summer blend of fuel in my area. So one might have assumed it was the oil when in fact it was another factor.
EDIT: I never said it was due to the grade, you are arguing with yourself.
In 18 years of owning and maintaining the engine in question and having performed EVERY oil and filter change in that period, I'll be my own judge about what this vehicle's trends and baselines are and how they differ.
This isn't a case of Jack Ryan saying he knows Captain Ramius and guessing on "crazy ivan" direction. I actually do know this engine and how it behaves in my duty cycle in my environment using my fuel and my oils.
If that's not good enough for a random stranger on the internet, I do not care even a tiny bit.
Me neither.
Forums would be better if everyone who embarrasses themself would then say something like I’m sorry or I hadn’t considered that. When one calls a statement absurd, one better be 100% sure one has it all figured out. It’s risky behavior.
Stuck rings have major consequences for efficiency and oil consumption.
Stuck rings have major consequences for efficiency and oil consumption.
depends what it did beforen from 60 to 63 mpg is a 5% increase. from 30 to 33 10%. I do expect the active ingredient in R&P to be attracted to metal surfaces, and that could mean it reduces friction like an Ester would. But I don't see getting to a 5 or 10% increase in mileage unless there was a serious compression loss before.
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truck starts faster with new oil? I guess I should start drinking this in the mornings
Sorry I was traveling all day today from Houston.
I did misinterpret what was said. I was wrong.
Having said that, help me out here. If the problem was a “stuck ring pack”, how does correcting that improve fuel consumption? I thought that problem influenced oil consumption.
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It might not. I’m assigning causation to correlation.
What I have observed is 1) VRP is cleaning my engine. 2) I am getting 3mpg better on average in similar duty cycle usage with the same drivers using the same fuel and ostensibly similar driving techniques.
Yes, it’s possible that my engine just randomly started cleaning itself and that the VRP was coincidentally in the crankcase when it happened. It’s also possible that my van started getting better MPG after a couple hundred miles of switching to VRP and yet the switch to VRP had nothing to do with it— perhaps my wife and I just started driving differently or I got some special winter fuel that give better rather than worse MPG.
But I don’t know, it seems pretty improbable to me.
Sometimes things just are, whether we can entirely explain them or not.
It seems as though you are picking a preferred answer to an observation rather than one that has the evidence.
I guess I just spent too many years as a research technologist where the mathematicians were the first ones to look at your data. They were ruthless and knew a lot more than you thought they did. It made you be very sure about what it was that you were sending them.
I am serious about what cleaning the ring pack actually does. I understand oil consumption, but I do not understand an improvement in fuel economy.
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That's a fair point, I don't know exactly what is coming out of the pump when I buy gas, and we did go from 70 degrees days to forty degree days over the course of about four days.
Good man, kschachn. With stuck rings causing increased leakage of air pressure into the crankcase, it takes more fuel and air to get the same amount of useful work/power from the engine. It would be great to have compression measurements from when the rings were stuck and after they are not stuck, so we could begin to make a crude estimate of the fuel efficiency improvement. That could help corroborate fuel economy measurements. As you know, fuel economy data is noisy and it’s impossible to keep every other factor constant. Pairing that with compression readings would help with understanding what’s going on. One would have to keep the variables as constant as possible with the compression tests too.
Switching the VR&P topic slightly - I believe a max OCI using VR&P and a good oil filter is important . Run an OCI too long using VR&P and you will introduce deposits which you have been trying to clean . Unless all driving is interstate / highway driving - I suggest to keep VR&P OCI’s at between 3,000 to 4,000 miles … This is not an oil you want to play long drain games with .
Patman
Staff member
We don’t have any evidence of this being the case. Valvoline themselves says to follow the manufacturer of your vehicle for the OCI and in the case of my Civic the oil life monitor signals a change at 9-10k. So they are well aware that many vehicles out there might be doing this kind of OCI and if they were concerned then they would just recommend going no further than 7500 miles.
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