MB229.5 and MB229.51

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283
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England
Hi As anyone who has read my posts will have realised, my knowledge of all things on BITOG is in its infancy, but I am learning. Could anyone tell me the difference between mb229.5 and 229.51? Is the latter just an evolution of the former? I am thinking 229.51 evolved to 229.52. Many thanks. Tikka.
 
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MA
The 229.5 was basically for gas MB cars. MB 229.51 was for diesels and 229.52 was updated for diesel cars. If you have a gas car, you should use 229.5 although you can use 229.51 or 229.52.
 
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1,138
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Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted by Tikka
Hi As anyone who has read my posts will have realised, my knowledge of all things on BITOG is in its infancy, but I am learning. Could anyone tell me the difference between mb229.5 and 229.51? Is the latter just an evolution of the former? I am thinking 229.51 evolved to 229.52. Many thanks. Tikka.
Yes that's the evolution of MB oils. They are backwards compatible and forward progressing. wink
 
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3,574
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Ca.
Originally Posted by Wolf359
The 229.5 was basically for gas MB cars. MB 229.51 was for diesels and 229.52 was updated for diesel cars. If you have a gas car, you should use 229.5 although you can use 229.51 or 229.52.
Yup- - You can - but once you see the availability and price of 229.51 and .52 you will likely recoil in horror. UD
 
Here's one that is both 229.51 and 229.52

59EC0AB4-0EC8-46BC-8315-9EE57F95B233.jpeg


053619EB-A88A-4DA7-B2CF-7B6545D798F3.jpeg
 
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39,792
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Great Lakes
Originally Posted by Pelican
Originally Posted by Tikka
Hi As anyone who has read my posts will have realised, my knowledge of all things on BITOG is in its infancy, but I am learning. Could anyone tell me the difference between mb229.5 and 229.51? Is the latter just an evolution of the former? I am thinking 229.51 evolved to 229.52. Many thanks. Tikka.
Yes that's the evolution of MB oils. They are backwards compatible and forward progressing. wink
They are not backwards compatible. If your diesel engine calls for 229.51 oil, then you should not be using 229.5 oil in it.
 
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11,828
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PA
From a quick re-skim of the Afton Chemical Specification Handbook -- hopefully someone else will chime in if I've missed anything: 229.51 is 229.5 with lower SAPS limits and a few related tweaks. 229.52 is 229.51 with stricter requirements for oxidation, viscosity retention, cold viscometrics, and fuel economy. Also, 229.5 references ACEA A3 standards for elastomer compatibility, whereas 229.51 and 229.52 reference ACEA C3. All other requirements are the same for all three specs, though that doesn't mean all oils meeting all of those specs will perform exactly the same; different oils might beat the requirements by different margins.
 
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952
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Vancouver
Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by Pelican
Originally Posted by Tikka
Hi As anyone who has read my posts will have realised, my knowledge of all things on BITOG is in its infancy, but I am learning. Could anyone tell me the difference between mb229.5 and 229.51? Is the latter just an evolution of the former? I am thinking 229.51 evolved to 229.52. Many thanks. Tikka.
Yes that's the evolution of MB oils. They are backwards compatible and forward progressing. wink
They are not backwards compatible. If your diesel engine calls for 229.51 oil, then you should not be using 229.5 oil in it.
That would be asking the 229.5 to be forwards compatible, not the 229.51 to be backwards compatible.
 
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196
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Europe
Originally Posted by d00df00d
Also, 229.5 references ACEA A3 standards for elastomer compatibility, whereas 229.51 and 229.52 reference ACEA C3.
Acc. to ACEA oil seq. the limits for elastomer compatibility for categories a/b4 and c3 are identical. This one is interesting,
Quote
SRV (Schwing Reib Verschleiß) Test, PC Ring/Liner (MBN 10474, SRV Version 4 to be applied)
229.5 has a higher load carrying capacity limit ..and only 229.5 has min.demand for aged oil in this respect (page 196, v.2017.1)..while the others are "rate and report".
 
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SR5

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Down Under
MB 229.5 is full SAPS and based on ACEA A3/B4 and is for petrol (gas) engines. MB 229.51 and 229.52 is mid-SAPS (or maybe low-SAPS) and is for Diesel engines with DPF exhaust filters, but it can be used in petrol engines running low sulphur fuel.
 

SR5

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Down Under
Quote
MB 229.3 For petrol and diesel engines. Minimum quality required ACEA A3 / B3 / B4 and MB 229.1. It can only certify 0/ 5 W-x oils. MB 229.31 Multigrade, low SAPS engine oil, advised for both diesel and petrol engines of Mercedes Benz, Smart and Chrysler. Only low viscosity engine oils which can realize a 1,0% saving on used fuel in the M111 Fuel economy test (CEC L-54-T-96) can get this approval. In this test the fuel savings are compared to the performance of the Reference oil RL 191 (SAE 15W-40). MB 229.5 MB sheet for energy conserving oils for certain car and van engines. Approved oils must meet ACEA A3, B3 and B4 specification and some additional demands by Daimler Chrysler AG. Oil must be on the approval list. MB 229.51 Low SAPS Long Life engine oil for diesel engines with particle filter meeting emission EU-4 -> standards. MB 229.52 Oils meeting this specifications must have lower ash content, at least 1% better fuel economy compared to the requirements of MB 229.31 and MB 229.51 and better oxidation stability for biofuel compatibility. Can also be used where an MB 229.31 or an MB 229.51 oil is required. Just like MB 229.5 and MB 229.51 this spec requires a long life oil.
From: https://www.oilspecifications.org/mercedes_mb.php
 
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2,230
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Southern Ontario
Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
Here's one that is both 229.51 and 229.52
I think you might find that any and all 504/507 certified oils have most/all MB certifications?
 

Tikka

Thread starter
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283
Location
England
Originally Posted by 21Rouge
Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
Here's one that is both 229.51 and 229.52
I think you might find that any and all 504/507 certified oils have most/all MB certifications?
Hi Yes I had noticed that oils do seem interchangeable. MB229.51, Dexos2 and LL04 seem to be present together a lot;
 

Tikka

Thread starter
Messages
283
Location
England
Hi Gents Thank you all for your patience and taking the time to help me out. It is sincerely appreciated. ,5 = Petrol and .51 = Diesel/Petrol. My Wife's Vauxhall (GM) takes Dexos 2 which seems to be all Vauxhall use now regardless of petrol or diesel engine.
 
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196
Location
Europe
Originally Posted by Tikka
.5 = Petrol and .51 = Diesel/Petrol. My Wife's Vauxhall (GM) takes Dexos 2 which seems to be all Vauxhall use now regardless of petrol or diesel engine.
No. All 229.xx are for diesel AND petrol engines (but having specific requirements).
 
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10,744
Location
Colorado Springs
Originally Posted by Rollins
Originally Posted by Tikka
.5 = Petrol and .51 = Diesel/Petrol. My Wife's Vauxhall (GM) takes Dexos 2 which seems to be all Vauxhall use now regardless of petrol or diesel engine.
No. All 229.xx are for diesel AND petrol engines (but having specific requirements).
MB 229.5 is not applicable to diesels unless you are talking about those MB diesels made prior to 2004.
 
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196
Location
Europe
Not quite so: https://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/d/d/en/Spec_223_2.pdf ..and DPF can be deleted. Then one can use even Heavy-Duty MB 228.5 oils... Those pre-2000 passenger car diesel MB engines will be around till the end of the world unless the legislators decide otherwise (and frankly these are the ones I care about). P.S. Tikka's om642 equipped Jeep has no DPF so he is free to choose whatever oil the OEM specifies in the above .pdf ,MB 229.5 included (and probably #1 choice).
 
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Messages
10,744
Location
Colorado Springs
Originally Posted by Rollins
Not quite so: https://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/d/d/en/Spec_223_2.pdf ..and DPF can be deleted. Then one can use even Heavy-Duty MB 228.5 oils... Those pre-2000 passenger car diesel MB engines will be around till the end of the world unless the legislators decide otherwise (and frankly these are the ones I care about). P.S. Tikka's om642 equipped Jeep has no DPF so he is free to choose whatever oil the OEM specifies in the above .pdf ,MB 229.5 included (and probably #1 choice).
I am not talking about deleting stuff, and I already mentioned pre 2004 (2004 was year when DPF in Europe was mandatory).
 
Messages
196
Location
Europe
Not true, edyvw . Concerning European Union LD you're at least 5 years off (and then EU is not the whole continent). Then we have different requirements for non-road machines(yes,they are different in US too),considerably lagging behind the on-road ones. As a curiosity - Austro AE-300/330 aircraft engines based on MB om640 still mandate 229.5 (which can be found here,Liqui-Moly is the supplier ) https://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevo...w&mark=austro&suchbegriff=austro https://www.diamondaircraft.com/en/...ne-oil-produced-by-liqui-moly-certified/ ..etc.
 
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