LS1 Camaro and Auto RX

[SargeGTO]

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Worst used oil analysis I ever got in the LSX motors were with 0-30's.

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Funny how the vast majority of LSXs do just fine on it.

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You mean the vast majority of LS1's posting used oil analysis here. That isn't vast friend. Quite the opposite holds true out in the real world. Now I will never say no LSX engine wont perform nor have a good UOA on a 30 weight. Ain't true. Some will. I clearly state the cars we see with LSX engines perform very well and are consistently showing excellent wear. There is a horrible UOA in this sites UOA section also utilizing Amsoil 0-30 in a built LS1. Even Pablo recommended Amsoil 5-40 or 10-40. So bottom line is this, in my humble opinion. Tune your oil. used oil analysis help but are not the end all by any means. Defensable data reflecting power and fuel burn efficiency, componenet wear upon inspection, and yes butt dyno check points such as noise, smoothness etc. will drive the oil choices and weight of those chosen oils. By the way I answered your PM about the Hendricks spinner assemblies. Hope that helps!

 

[SargeGTO]

I would further ask you how you explain the exact same engine manufactured at the exact same place to the exact same specs and being shipped to other parts of the world and GM specs 40 weights and in Australia some are spec'd with 20-50. You don't think CAFE has anything to do with the spec of 30 weight here in the states do you? Go on any Holden forum and try and peddle 30 weights. Good luck

 

[427Z06]

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Worst used oil analysis I ever got in the LSX motors were with 0-30's.

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Funny how the vast majority of LSXs do just fine on it.

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You mean the vast majority of LS1's posting used oil analysis here. That isn't vast friend.

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So you have a vast LS1 database of used oil analysis you'd like to share with us?

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Quite the opposite holds true out in the real world.

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You mean, "your" real world. You can type all the folklore you want, but unless you can provide a credible statistically valid data, you're just blowing smoke like everyone else with an opinion.

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Now I will never say no LSX engine wont perform nor have a good UOA on a 30 weight. Ain't true. Some will. I clearly state the cars we see with LSX engines perform very well and are consistently showing excellent wear.

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Then what the heck is your point?

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There is a horrible UOA in this sites UOA section also utilizing Amsoil 0-30 in a built LS1. Even Pablo recommended Amsoil 5-40 or 10-40.

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Here's your problem...you have yet to comprehend the difference between a properly built factory engine, and an aftermarket build. Two entirely different animals.

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So bottom line is this, in my humble opinion. Tune your oil. used oil analysis help but are not the end all by any means. Defensable data reflecting power and fuel burn efficiency, componenet wear upon inspection, and yes butt dyno check points such as noise, smoothness etc. will drive the oil choices and weight of those chosen oils.

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No doubt, that's what some of us try to explain to people here. In this particular case, the owner of a stock LS1 is already using near 40 wt oil with a HTHS of 3.5 - that's a decent step up from the factory spec 30 wt with a HTHS of 3.1 so you can't argue he's not trying to tune his oil.

Further, this particular engine is something of a oddball since it was already taken apart because it was defective. Unless one was there to see how it was repaired, no telling what one is dealing with. Using this as an example that all LS1s need 40 wt oil is fool-hearty at best.

Finally, going thicker is the typical knee jerk reaction of an amateur. I've seen to many cases of going thinner with a different chemistry showed improvements in used oil analysis where simply going to thicker oil didn't.

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By the way I answered your PM about the Hendricks spinner assemblies. Hope that helps!

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Yes, thanks. I let you know you what I find out.

 

[SargeGTO]

For your reading pleasure. Nothing really new here...some ruinning Castrol 10-60, but most LS1's down under running 10-40 or 20-50. Or should I say "the vast majority", LOL J/K
http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=64756&highlight=oil+viscosity

 

[SargeGTO]

Just noticed you must join and log in. Sorry. Well. Bottom line is the LSX owners in Australia (probably more LS1's there than here or close to it) strongly support 10-60/20-50/10-40 oils. For a reason.

 

[SargeGTO]

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Worst used oil analysis I ever got in the LSX motors were with 0-30's.

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Funny how the vast majority of LSXs do just fine on it.

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You mean the vast majority of LS1's posting used oil analysis here. That isn't vast friend.

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So you have a vast LS1 database of used oil analysis you'd like to share with us?

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Quite the opposite holds true out in the real world.

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You mean, "your" real world. You can type all the folklore you want, but unless you can provide a credible statistically valid data, you're just blowing smoke like everyone else with an opinion.

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Now I will never say no LSX engine wont perform nor have a good UOA on a 30 weight. Ain't true. Some will. I clearly state the cars we see with LSX engines perform very well and are consistently showing excellent wear.

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Then what the heck is your point?

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There is a horrible UOA in this sites UOA section also utilizing Amsoil 0-30 in a built LS1. Even Pablo recommended Amsoil 5-40 or 10-40.

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Here's your problem...you have yet to comprehend the difference between a properly built factory engine, and an aftermarket build. Two entirely different animals.

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So bottom line is this, in my humble opinion. Tune your oil. used oil analysis help but are not the end all by any means. Defensable data reflecting power and fuel burn efficiency, componenet wear upon inspection, and yes butt dyno check points such as noise, smoothness etc. will drive the oil choices and weight of those chosen oils.

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No doubt, that's what some of us try to explain to people here. In this particular case, the owner of a stock LS1 is already using near 40 wt oil with a HTHS of 3.5 - that's a decent step up from the factory spec 30 wt with a HTHS of 3.1 so you can't argue he's not trying to tune his oil.

Further, this particular engine is something of a oddball since it was already taken apart because it was defective. Unless one was there to see how it was repaired, no telling what one is dealing with. Using this as an example that all LS1s need 40 wt oil is fool-hearty at best.

Finally, going thicker is the typical knee jerk reaction of an amateur. I've seen to many cases of going thinner with a different chemistry showed improvements in used oil analysis where simply going to thicker oil didn't.

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By the way I answered your PM about the Hendricks spinner assemblies. Hope that helps!

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Yes, thanks. I let you know you what I find out.

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Lol.Just saw this. Not sure where your going here. As I emphatically state this is my opinion. So your tirade is misplaced at best. What you want to get into a Bobistheoilguy UOA war? Silly and a waste of time. You offer your opinions and I'll offer mine. You post a few used oil analysis from here and I'll post a few and many other ls1 owners "opinions" on the subject. Then what do we do?

 

[427Z06]

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I would further ask you how you explain the exact same engine manufactured at the exact same place to the exact same specs and being shipped to other parts of the world and GM specs 40 weights and in Australia some are spec'd with 20-50. You don't think CAFE has anything to do with the spec of 30 weight here in the states do you? Go on any Holden forum and try and peddle 30 weights. Good luck

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Sarge...this argument is so old and lame, I'm surprised you would even mention it. I really thought you we're smarter.

May I suggest you do a little reading about Ford modulars and 5w20. Same argument was used for these engines. Then when "real world" data is actually reviewed, we find that Ford wasn't blowing smoke up our keisters.

http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=753141
http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=765552
http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/s...0490#Post790490

And for the final pièce de résistance, all talk of viscosity is meaningless unless it's accompanied by a temperature parameter.

 

[Volvohead]

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Back to the Auto RX. . . .

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First, if your want to use the ARX, then by all means use it. It won't hurt anything. Worst case is you'll clean something that isn't all that dirty. I doubt GC left all that many deposits, but with your general engine situation, who knows.

But I agree with 427 on this one. You got yourself a less than perfect build on this engine. Could be the valvetrain. Could be the cylinders. It happens. But it is not the end of the world and even at those wear rates, that engine can still last a very long time. And I also agree that a thicker juice will help here. I would steer towards the 40 weight HDEOs, and even consider a 50 if you plan to do any track work.

 

[427Z06]

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Just noticed you must join and log in. Sorry. Well. Bottom line is the LSX owners in Australia (probably more LS1's there than here or close to it) strongly support 10-60/20-50/10-40 oils. For a reason.

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And what is the reason?

 

[Bob Woods]

"I have been using a highly reguarded adviser here on this forum for several years and 45,000 miles. I have done everything he has told me to and spent several hundred dollars paying for his advice" Chris B

You mean to say there are people charging for oil advice just like bad financial advisers?

 

[427Z06]

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...Not sure where your going here. As I emphatically state this is my opinion. So your tirade is misplaced at best. What you want to get into a Bobistheoilguy UOA war? Silly and a waste of time. You offer your opinions and I'll offer mine. You post a few used oil analysis from here and I'll post a few and many other ls1 owners "opinions" on the subject. Then what do we do?

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It's not a "tirade" and I won't waste any effort on a "Bobistheoilguy UOA war" or silly debates. My only concern is that we try to keep a reaonable amount of credibility to assertions. Too many myths and old wive's tales floating around in cyberspace. I'd just like to see that kept to a minimum here since that's why Bob first created BITOG.

 

[427Z06]

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"I have been using a highly reguarded adviser here on this forum for several years and 45,000 miles. I have done everything he has told me to and spent several hundred dollars paying for his advice" Chris B

You mean to say there are people charging for oil advice just like bad financial advisers?

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Yes, the real world is tough sometimes.

 

[SargeGTO]

So your used oil analysis from here and some Ford report is gospel and final? I don't think so friend. I'm not so arrogant to believe a report or a used oil analysis posted is the final say so on anything. As you seem to be the self appointed BITOG spokesperson I'll retort that real world experience and sharing those experiences in the proper context is equally invaluable. And sharing used oil analysis utilizing 0-30 in LS1's that reflect less than stellar wear is invaluable. And sharing global LS1 oil viscosity choices is invaluable. And I'll do it in a professional manner without being a pompous #@$%! about it. Fact is there is no one oil viscosity that is perfect for these motors. This guy ask and was offered opinions and you take off on this I am the spokesman for BITOG and we all must post lots of used oil analysis and Ford reports and totally dismiss anyone who offers an opinion based on experience of any kind. You put whatever Ford recommends in your motor and change viscosities every time a new used oil analysis is posted and I'll stick with used oil analysis,engine builders,gear heads experience and my personal experience to make my oil viscosity choices. The internet is full of "experts". I listen and learn with the rest. However I will always maintain a touch with reality and the real world experiances
of the LS1 community for sure.

 

[Patman]

The one thing I will add to this discussion is that if an LS1 owner doesn't do used oil analysis, and is looking to protect his hard driven engine, you're better off to recommend they try something a little bit thicker like a 5w40.

Keep in mind these engines run very high oil temps when pushed hard, so you're better off to err on the side of caution. Most people with LS1s who ask me for oil advice drive their cars very hard, doing road racing, autocrossing, drag racing, and a lot of them living in hot climates like Texas. The chances of them destroying their motor with a 5w40 are pretty slim, but put 5w20 in an LS1 and run 300F oil temps, and you can kiss that motor goodbye pretty quick. And truth be told, most of these guys probably won't go more than 100k before pulling the motor apart to do stuff to it anyhow. If their motors were to blow, they'd use it as an excuse to build a bigger one.

 

[dailydriver]

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So your used oil analysis from here and some Ford report is gospel and final? I don't think so friend. I'm not so arrogant to believe a report or a used oil analysis posted is the final say so on anything. As you seem to be the self appointed BITOG spokesperson I'll retort that real world experience and sharing those experiences in the proper context is equally invaluable. And sharing used oil analysis utilizing 0-30 in LS1's that reflect less than stellar wear is invaluable. And sharing global LS1 oil viscosity choices is invaluable. And I'll do it in a professional manner without being a pompous #@$%! about it. Fact is there is no one oil viscosity that is perfect for these motors. This guy ask and was offered opinions and you take off on this I am the spokesman for BITOG and we all must post lots of used oil analysis and Ford reports and totally dismiss anyone who offers an opinion based on experience of any kind. You put whatever Ford recommends in your motor and change viscosities every time a new used oil analysis is posted and I'll stick with used oil analysis,engine builders,gear heads experience and my personal experience to make my oil viscosity choices. The internet is full of "experts". I listen and learn with the rest. However I will always maintain a touch with reality and the real world experiances
of the LS1 community for sure.

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Sarge, did the poor 0w30 used oil analysis you've encountered include A LOT of (or mostly) GC, or was it "other" thinner 0W-30s??
Could the Aussie LSx owners be going for the heavy stuff because of the high ambient temps encountered there (as some have inferred)? I am only asking as real, straightforward questions, open for thoughtful discussion, NOT to start ANY kind of flame war or anything!!
Lord knows, we have enough "enemies" and haters on here already, just by the virtue of us driving GM domestics. Do we really need to

each other??

 

[Modulistic]

Sarge is 100% right.

 

[SargeGTO]

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So your used oil analysis from here and some Ford report is gospel and final? I don't think so friend. I'm not so arrogant to believe a report or a used oil analysis posted is the final say so on anything. As you seem to be the self appointed BITOG spokesperson I'll retort that real world experience and sharing those experiences in the proper context is equally invaluable. And sharing used oil analysis utilizing 0-30 in LS1's that reflect less than stellar wear is invaluable. And sharing global LS1 oil viscosity choices is invaluable. And I'll do it in a professional manner without being a pompous #@$%! about it. Fact is there is no one oil viscosity that is perfect for these motors. This guy ask and was offered opinions and you take off on this I am the spokesman for BITOG and we all must post lots of used oil analysis and Ford reports and totally dismiss anyone who offers an opinion based on experience of any kind. You put whatever Ford recommends in your motor and change viscosities every time a new used oil analysis is posted and I'll stick with used oil analysis,engine builders,gear heads experience and my personal experience to make my oil viscosity choices. The INTERNET is full of "experts". I listen and learn with the rest. However I will always maintain a touch with reality and the real world experiences
of the LS1 community for sure.

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Sarge, did the poor 0w30 used oil analysis you've encountered include A LOT of (or mostly) GC, or was it "other" thinner 0W-30s??
Could the Aussie LSx owners be going for the heavy stuff because of the high ambient temps encountered there (as some have inferred)? I am only asking as real, straightforward questions, open for thoughtful discussion, NOT to start ANY kind of flame war or anything!!
Lord knows, we have enough "enemies" and haters on here already, just by the virtue of us driving GM domestics. Do we really need to

each other??

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I agree with the flame wars allergies. I don't know why nor where that came from. The used oil analysis I reference was Amsoil 0-30. The Aussie temps are no worse than say South Texas or Florida on many days. However the real reason most run a 40/50 weight there is the wide open spaces and high speeds they run in their LS1's. That is the reason. I do not know many LS1/LS2 drivers that "putt putt" around town or on the open road. Thus my experience in the real world reflects a LSX owner utilizing thinner oils has issues. I totally agree with Patman. He put it right on the barrel head. XX-40 weight for these engines is the safe route. No doubt. And I will say again, I have also seen LSX blocks do very well with 30 weights. It depends on the conditions,driving habits etc. But if I had to recommend or respond to a question such as was posted here, I would recommend a quality 40 weight. This is a forum to discuss and share. I have not come in here and made blanket statements as gospel and have said my statements are my opinion only. And thank you guys for the PM's with support but I'm not "against" anybody here on this forum. But I appreciate the support.

 

[SargeGTO]

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Sarge is 100% right.

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LOL. A Austin Vette driver! Agreeing with me! Thanks Mod

 

[427Z06]

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So your used oil analysis from here and some Ford report is gospel and final? I don't think so friend. I'm not so arrogant to believe a report or a used oil analysis posted is the final say so on anything.

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Never said that...you seem to like to put words into people's mouths whenever your logic falls apart. You're the one that actually used that argument:

"Worst used oil analysis I ever got in the LSX motors were with 0-30's."

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As you seem to be the self appointed BITOG spokesperson I'll retort that real world experience and sharing those experiences in the proper context is equally invaluable. And sharing used oil analysis utilizing 0-30 in LS1's that reflect less than stellar wear is invaluable.

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Yes, in the proper context. But until you accept intellectually the differences in engines, such as between a proper factory build versus a problem child and an aftermarket build you'll inevitably end up with the wrong conclusions.

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And sharing global LS1 oil viscosity choices is invaluable.

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How so? Do you know why the manufacturer made the recommendation? Are you sure the engines and installations are identical? Do you think maybe manufacturers take in account what formulas are available in other parts of the world? Have you ever been up to Warren and witnessed disassembled engines that were run WOT for days on dynos with the factory recommendations?

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And I'll do it in a professional manner without being a pompous #@$%! about it.

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Pompousness begets like pompousness.

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Fact is there is no one oil viscosity that is perfect for these motors.

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Correct...you need to take in account the actual engine build into account.

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This guy ask and was offered opinions and you take off on this I am the spokesman for BITOG and we all must post lots of used oil analysis and Ford reports and totally dismiss anyone who offers an opinion based on experience of any kind.

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Nope...but you failed to mention your engines are aftermarket builds where appropriate. I simply pointed out that a proper factory build does just fine on GC.

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You put whatever Ford recommends in your motor and change viscosities every time a new used oil analysis is posted and I'll stick with used oil analysis,engine builders,gear heads experience and my personal experience to make my oil viscosity choices.

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I used the Ford situation as an example of naysayers and CAFE conspiracy theorists inventing a new reality. How can you be intellectual honest and use this as a counterpoint since you were the one that first mentioned CAFE?

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The internet is full of "experts". I listen and learn with the rest. However I will always maintain a touch with reality and the real world experiences of the LS1 community for sure.

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Good. Just don't let the alpha dogs of the community lead you down the wrong path. It's not unusual to find that some so called real world perceptions by real world experts shroud some eyes and brains from real world science and engineering.

 

[SargeGTO]

Unreal