Looking for greener grass in another state

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Originally Posted By: GMFan


We have been looking at moving for work in the Charlotte, NC area however are looking to settle south of Charlotte in South Carolina for cheaper cost of living. We would be making the move in ~3years once my father retires from his construction job.

Questions for those who have made the move from North to South:

1. Do you regret it or was it a good decision?

2. Have folks in the south been accepting of tax fleeing New Yorkers or did you feel like an Okie in The Grapes of Wrath? We do not want to live in a place where there would be hostility toward us. We are not from New York City but to most people 'New York' mind as well be the same thing.

3. Was the adjustment difficult or easy?

This would be a huge decision for our family and we know that once we made the move it would be pretty much impossible financially to move back if we regretted our decision. Even if we determine moving down South isn't for us we have also been considering Pennsylvania and Delaware.

I have had a good friend of mine who was struggling to find jobs around here and recently made the move to San Antonio, TX absolutely loves it. He went to trucking school and is driving big rigs and has never turned back. I've had numerous other friends who have moved throughout the country and have told me the move was worth it.

Thank you for any input.


GMFan- I lived in N.C. for almost 20 years in the Charlotte area. To be exact, I lived 20 miles west in Gastonia (a moderate sized town down I-85.) I've also lived in Salisbury and Raliegh N.C. I have also worked in Ft. Mill, S.C. (just south of Charlotte, down I-77.)

If you are seriously considering the Charlotte-metro area (I consider it: Lake Norman, Huntersville, Gastonia, Ft. Mill, Rock Hill, and other 'smaller towns'.) I would lean heavily to living in South Carolina.

Growing up in N.C., I too became 'disenchanted'- as you say- with how the state "was run." Side note- I've also lived in Porltand, OR and Vancouver, WA (currently reside there). And the cost of living in N.C. is JUST as much as out here in so-called "heavily blue", "heavily regulated", "heavily taxed" western states. So, I would steer clear of N.C.

Depending on how much the sale of your current property is and let's say $275K (totally arbitrary and hypothetical, probably more since you are in N.Y.)... you could buy quite a bit of land and house in upstate S.C.

I would analyze the job situation as the area is heavily dependent on financial institutions, some tech, some construction (well there was prior to 2008, like all places.)

Besides the banks, large employers in the area are John Deere, BMW, Freightliner, Michelin, Duke Power, and others.

Traffic isn't too bad venturing north on I-77 N. from S.C. From Rock Hill or Ft. Mill or Tega Cay (Nice community on a lake) it's probably 30 minutes to go 15 miles @ 8am... commute back @ 5pm is probably 45min.

Traffic from Huntersville, N.C., (North or Charlotte; another Nice community, lot of NASCAR folk live in this area) down I-77 S is a totally horrible. 45-65 minutes to and from @ 8am and 5pm.

The commute from Gastonia, N.C. up I-85 N can be brutal as well 45 min. to over an hour at 8am... worse at 5pm back. Some nice towns in Gaston Co. (again, west of Mecklenburg Co.) are Belmont and Cramerton and much shorter commute times than from Gastonia.

Honestly, I would place equal emphasis on moving to TX as to the Carolinas. Actually, I would move to TX before the Carolinas, just due to the economy of the state, but that's me.

So to your questions...

1.) I can't answer this because I moved away to get married.

2.) I would say people in North Carolina are more 'accepting' to yankees than people in S.C. BUT there are good people everywhere and bad people everywhere. That's what I've learned from moving so much. (The place that seems to have the most 'bad' people is D.C. was SO glad to get outta that place.) I honestly feel though, the # of northern folk who have moved into the Charlotte area VASTLY out number the home-born commoners. I could be wrong but I rarely worked with or met at church people who were "from N.C.".

3.) Moving adjustments are ALWAYS difficult. It takes 2 years before a new place starts to feel normal. It does for me any how.

Best of luck.
 
Make sure the job is lined up first and rent for a year and figure the place out.

The renting gives you a bail out in case it does not work out for you.
 
Originally Posted By: sciphi
I lived in Columbia, SC for 2 years in graduate school. I did not want to settle there despite having friends and frankly better job prospects. My female classmates, especially those from other states, reported consistent difficulty with getting anything resembling customer service when their cars broke, even at the dealers. They also said that they didn't feel safe going out after dark, even in the safer areas of Columbia where they lived. That was consistent between the native South Carolinians and the out of staters. As a male, I had no issues with customer service or feeling safe after dark, although there were some areas of Columbia I would definitely pass through as fast as possible no matter what the time of day. Folks definitely treated me better when I adopted a SC accent, and tried to fit in.

Whatever you do, don't go down there thinking it's all sunshine and smiles. The sunshine is strong enough to burn badly, and the smiles often conceal how they're thinking of screwing the Yankee.


You get that being southern in the north too.

When we visit my wife's family in Ohio, I have this game I play where I greet waitress, the person at the checkout, etc... with a friendly, "Hello" and a smile. 9 times out of 10 I will get this look I describe as the "horsehead" The person will jut out their front teeth, squint, and wrinkle their nose at me. No response.
In Georgia, that would be rude.
The one in ten that does return my smile and reply? Best guess is that they are from Kentucky, because the further away from Cincinnati one gets, the fewer and further between they are.

In Massachusetts, I was told to leave a bar because I was "Irish"
"We don't wan't no Irish in heeyah."
"I'm not Irish. I'm Scottish and Choctaw but I'm..."
"Oh no. You-ah Irish. We can tell."

The whole state seemed to be full of rules for "Spanish" (not Spaniards at all...Mexicans and Puerto Ricans), "black guys" (obvious who they are referring to), Italian, Irish, and Portuguese.

In Dallas, I can walk into a reggae bar and as long as I behave myself, no problems. Don't try that in Lowell.
 
Originally Posted By: dparm
I always come back to Illinois. Went to school out west, worked/traveled in a ton of places (MN, NY, NJ, DE, PA, DC), but still love Chicago and Illinois in general. It's very balanced and well-rounded.


Wow. I must be in a different place that is also called "Illinois"...

Very balanced and well-rounded. Huh?
 
I talk to a lot of people, both in NC/SC and New York. I regularly talk to people in the Charlotte area, Raleigh, Columbia, GSBO, etc. They all seem completely shocked at how expensive land and stuff up here is. They also all seem to quite enjoy their warm weather lol. Mostly a nice group of folks. Generally a lot nicer and politer than people from Buffalo/Rochester for sure.
 
Originally Posted By: Spazdog
During that time Detroit and Dallas reversed population numbers. Dallas soaring over a million and Detroit falling under a million.

There was even a phrase coined for it. "Blacktaggers". It's not as racist as it sounds. It had more to do with the color of the Michigan license plates.


LOL I work in construction, and we have (or used to have) a saying that we could always tell how the economy is doing in Texas by watching the license plates at our jobsites. There was a period (late 80s perhaps?) when it seemed every other car at a jobsite had Texas plates.

No longer applicable anymore since construction is still at rock bottom here. No recovery yet.
 
My employer sent me to Cary, N.C. for almost all of 2009 working in a small mill down by Moncure. The people I worked with and "rubbed elbows" with outside of work were very nice, polite. Can't speak knowledgably about taxes and such. My employer put me up in an extended stay hotel. Had the chance to stay there but came home instead. I regret doing that now. There seemed to be more transplanted northerner's around Cary than native's. The folks I met from the church I attended were ( I think) about 75% from some other state, mostly upper midwest. Research the area you are interested in thoroughly as much as you possibly can. Let us know what you decide.
 
I do not own a house/property. I rent. Property taxes here are $12-15k/yr and houses are $350k plus compared to SC where property taxes are $1,500/yr and 3 bedroom houses with 3 acres of property are $200k.

For the time being I am living/attempting my best to live as cheaply as possible saving my money for a down payment on something. In the Northeast you either live at home with your folks until you are 30yrs old or you rent. Home ownership is unheard of around here until you are ~30yrs old and have a significant other also working.

To some folks $15k/yr in property taxes isn't much. To me it's not worth it...paying almost $1million dollars in the course of my life in property taxes isn't worth living here.
 
Well, I'll weigh in one more time with both a confession and an observation.

Like I said in a previous post, I grew up in Florida. My family has been in Florida since before the Civil War, (we even wore the grey and fought for the south). The town where I grew up was a small town (Google "Gotha Florida") with nothing but orange groves, cow pastures and woods for miles. Everybody knew everybody and it was a great place to grow up. Then Disney opened their theme park and all of that went away. Yankees moved in with their constant litany "the way we did it up north . . . " They did nothing but condemn us southerners and gripe about how bad it was here and how stupid we were. I grew up with a deep hatred for yankees and all things yankee.

Then I moved to Nebraska. I discovered a people that were warm hearted, friendly, caring and hard working. I loved it in the Sandhills of Nebraska. If it weren't so cottin' pickin' cold out there, I would have stayed. Then I got married and moved to Indiana - yankee central. I discovered a people that were warm hearted, friendly, caring and hard working. Once again, those cold, wet, icy winters ran me off. Then I moved to California. A whole new lifestyle. But the people I knew were fantastic. Moving to Alabama was like moving back to the Florida I knew years ago. Small town, (Leighton, 7 miles east of Muscle Shoals). Wonderful people and a great place to raise a faimly. I had intended on staying there the rest of my life. But then family responsibilites brought me back to Florida which is nothing like the place I grew up. One of my neighbors is from Chicago, across the street lives a family from NYC, (complete with very thick accent). We all get along great, (I still tease them about being yankees).

I guess the point I'm trying to make is this, what I have learned is whereever I lived, I try to find the good in that place. Don't try to make it like it was somewhere else. Go, enjoy, be positive, be friendly and people will be friendly and positive with you. Occasionally you will meet someone who is rude or hateful or arrogant, but over all, if you seek the good in people and places, you will be rewarded by finding the good in people and places.

The great thing about my NYC neighbor is he is a truck driver who works on his own cars and is pretty good at it. Whenever I start working on mine or he on his, we always end up with our heads together under the hood. Who would have ever though, a New York yankee and an ole Florida cracker having a few beers and twisting some wrenches together. It's all good

Just my humble two cents worth.
 
Originally Posted By: GMFan
To some folks $15k/yr in property taxes isn't much. To me it's not worth it...paying almost $1million dollars in the course of my life in property taxes isn't worth living here.


Can somebody comment on this? What is the house valued at? What is your tax rate? You said you are renting. Where are you getting these numbers from then? I am suspecting there is some misunderstanding.
 
Have you actually visited the inland places with $200k homes? Not talking the nice tourist areas. IMHO a very different place. I thought Ashville, NC and Greenville SC were okay due some diversity.
 
Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Originally Posted By: dparm
I always come back to Illinois. Went to school out west, worked/traveled in a ton of places (MN, NY, NJ, DE, PA, DC), but still love Chicago and Illinois in general. It's very balanced and well-rounded.


Wow. I must be in a different place that is also called "Illinois"...

Very balanced and well-rounded. Huh?


Chicagoans are pretty friendly. Can't say that for the rest of Illinois. Chicago seemed to be it's own place within the boundaries of Illinois. I do love Chicago and look forward to visiting there again. But I couldn't live there. More sales tax than here and state income tax, property tax, thumb tax, tax tax.....
But Chicago is an amazing city.
 
I noticed no mention of Michigan...
smirk.gif


Though that being said, while I love all the things that you can do it this state, the people around here are getting nuts.

I'l wait it out for a while to see what happens, but there is a reason why I bought a cheaper house...so that if I want to go, I can.
 
Originally Posted By: sciphi
I lived in Columbia, SC for 2 years in graduate school. I did not want to settle there despite having friends and frankly better job prospects. My female classmates, especially those from other states, reported consistent difficulty with getting anything resembling customer service when their cars broke, even at the dealers. They also said that they didn't feel safe going out after dark, even in the safer areas of Columbia where they lived. That was consistent between the native South Carolinians and the out of staters. As a male, I had no issues with customer service or feeling safe after dark, although there were some areas of Columbia I would definitely pass through as fast as possible no matter what the time of day. Folks definitely treated me better when I adopted a SC accent, and tried to fit in.

Another thing that got me was how there was a fee on everything, and taxes on things that were not taxed up here in NY. If you wanted to do anything with a government agency there, get out your checkbook. And, vehicle taxes often ran into the thousands of dollars a year on multiple newer vehicles. Two close friends who lived nearby were surprised when they moved there that they owed $1500 in vehicle taxes on their two newish compact cars. Link to county tax assessors: http://www.sciway.net/gov/sc-county-tax-assessors.html That wasn't a one-time fee, that was a yearly tax on their cars. It does go down a little the less the vehicle is worth.

Whatever you do, don't go down there thinking it's all sunshine and smiles. The sunshine is strong enough to burn badly, and the smiles often conceal how they're thinking of screwing the Yankee.

And, telling folks you don't live in NYC gets old fast. If I had a dollar for every time somebody asked me how I liked NYC, I'd be rich. I stopped telling folks I was from NY very quickly to avoid the inevitable questions about NYC.

That's my experience. I'd not move back after experiencing it.



Petty decent observations. I live in the upstate of SC and what you recount is generally accurate.

While most folks here are tolerant of this Yankee (who originally was born in Maine, and had previously lived in the mid Atlantic for most of my 45 years (PA, DE, NY, ect)) I also more than occasionally get the feeling (even though I have been here now for a decade) that my accent gets me "pigeon holed" as a "outsider" even though I have never been an abrasive person.

If you get to know folks here long enough they will slowly accept you, but I have to say that the culture is very different from up north, and you can't ignore it. As a matter of fact the longer I've been here the more differences I notice.

I can honestly say that I will always be
"an outsider" here, no matter what I would do. LOL

Agreed also about the lack of business sense when it comes to customer service or being competitive in the retail environment. Being "diligent" and efficient, is looked at with suspicion generally.

But there are also some very nice people here to, some of the nicest I have ever encountered anywhere I have ever lived.

The weather here is very pleasant here in the fall and winter, but summer can be brutal. Although generally it is not much worse than the Mid Atlantic, it lasts a couple of months longer.
 
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When I liberated myself from college I deliberately chose to leave the rat race. Moved where jobs pay 1/2 but houses cost 1/4 so it all works out.

Some kind of tax is always going to get you and if it's not taxes it's gas for your long commute or heating or cooling your house. You can game the system, like living in a condo somewhere with high Real Estate but low/no income tax, but it'll probably be within 20% of being a wash.

I say go for it, rent a trailer or lousy apartment, and make a go of it. You won't find a job with an out-of-state address. Get a place you can keep making $9/ hr at a gas station so you aren't stressed.
 
I think it's only going to get worse in IL. The 67% income tax increase has done nothing to address the budget woes of IL, so look for more taxes here.

My daughter graduates High School in four years. Then it's escape from IL unless something changes for the better.

Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Originally Posted By: dparm
I always come back to Illinois. Went to school out west, worked/traveled in a ton of places (MN, NY, NJ, DE, PA, DC), but still love Chicago and Illinois in general. It's very balanced and well-rounded.


Wow. I must be in a different place that is also called "Illinois"...

Very balanced and well-rounded. Huh?
 
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