But the states shouldn't be offering big tax breaks to lure them away. It's like the Civil War all over again lol. And unions could unionize the southern state workers, but those workers tend to be brainwashed against it and want to work for less I guess.
Labor unions
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Originally Posted By: Doog
Public workers unions are 100% totally a complete corruption tool used by politicians to garner votes and are the cause of many cities going bankrupt.
yes. They are indeed.
The unions collect huge sums of money that is payed to corrupt leadership that does what IT wants, not at all representing the workers beliefs or ideals. And in many cases selling them all down the river for something the leaders desire.
They even got a federal law passed to ALLOW them to be thugs!
Public workers unions are 100% totally a complete corruption tool used by politicians to garner votes and are the cause of many cities going bankrupt.
yes. They are indeed.
The unions collect huge sums of money that is payed to corrupt leadership that does what IT wants, not at all representing the workers beliefs or ideals. And in many cases selling them all down the river for something the leaders desire.
They even got a federal law passed to ALLOW them to be thugs!
No union exists for the betterment of its members and/or the workers. Once you realize that you never forget it. They exist for the perpetuation of the union itself and for the betterment of the leadership.
Non-unionized workers in the south and elsewhere are not brainwashed. This is exactly what they are not, it is the other way around.
No one helps the union cause by making such a ridiculous statement, you only show that you have an agenda.
Non-unionized workers in the south and elsewhere are not brainwashed. This is exactly what they are not, it is the other way around.
No one helps the union cause by making such a ridiculous statement, you only show that you have an agenda.
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Human resource departments and management can be pretty thugish itself though.
My uncle still carries the .30-06 he dug out of the sleeper on his Kenworth...I have only heard of HR firing people, never firing AT them!
Dude, he can even have that in Mass.?
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Human resource departments and management can be pretty thugish itself though.
My uncle still carries the .30-06 he dug out of the sleeper on his Kenworth...I have only heard of HR firing people, never firing AT them!
Dude, he can even have that in Mass.?
Our contract is up Sep. 1 . we are a small private company with only about 25 union members but are part of a much bigger local including some Government employees.
My employer is pro-union believe it or not. They like the fact that all employee costs are fixed for a set amount of time (usually 3 years) and discipline is spelled out plainly.
Sometimes it works out both ways, everybody knows where they stand.
It should be interesting to see what happens since now anyone can opt out starting in September.
My employer is pro-union believe it or not. They like the fact that all employee costs are fixed for a set amount of time (usually 3 years) and discipline is spelled out plainly.
Sometimes it works out both ways, everybody knows where they stand.
It should be interesting to see what happens since now anyone can opt out starting in September.
Open markets are saying that unions are not productive while organizations with a captive income stream seem to like them.
Originally Posted By: kschachn
No union exists for the betterment of its members and/or the workers. Once you realize that you never forget it. They exist for the perpetuation of the union itself and for the betterment of the leadership.
Non-unionized workers in the south and elsewhere are not brainwashed. This is exactly what they are not, it is the other way around.
No one helps the union cause by making such a ridiculous statement, you only show that you have an agenda.
That's a ridiculous assertion. In your first sentence, replace unions with management and it would be correct.
If all unions were doing was trying to preserve themselves and get union dues, no employers would give one iota if the union was there. The fact that most employers are very against unions and are continuously striving to bust unions (along with pensions, and benefits, pay), is evidence that the unions musst be doing something more than just taking union dues from employees.
But of course a union has to preserve itself first and foremost before it can do anything. According to some's logic nothing they do can be right. If they take a strong stand, they're accused of being greedy and not "productive" enough and every thing else bad. And if they make concessions and compromise with management, then they're accused of not working in the interest of their members but just themselves. What a joke.
Many of the non-unionized workers are brainwashed and foolish or just too scared and desperate to make a stand in their own interests.
No union exists for the betterment of its members and/or the workers. Once you realize that you never forget it. They exist for the perpetuation of the union itself and for the betterment of the leadership.
Non-unionized workers in the south and elsewhere are not brainwashed. This is exactly what they are not, it is the other way around.
No one helps the union cause by making such a ridiculous statement, you only show that you have an agenda.
That's a ridiculous assertion. In your first sentence, replace unions with management and it would be correct.
If all unions were doing was trying to preserve themselves and get union dues, no employers would give one iota if the union was there. The fact that most employers are very against unions and are continuously striving to bust unions (along with pensions, and benefits, pay), is evidence that the unions musst be doing something more than just taking union dues from employees.
But of course a union has to preserve itself first and foremost before it can do anything. According to some's logic nothing they do can be right. If they take a strong stand, they're accused of being greedy and not "productive" enough and every thing else bad. And if they make concessions and compromise with management, then they're accused of not working in the interest of their members but just themselves. What a joke.
Many of the non-unionized workers are brainwashed and foolish or just too scared and desperate to make a stand in their own interests.
It may very well be doing more than just taking dues.
The question is, is the union providing value or just being an irritant to the company.
Union status, or lack of it doesn't make for virtue. There are probably unions more virtuous than management. There are probably companies out there that are more virtuous than the unions representing the rank and file.
You appear to paint with very broad brush strokes and engage in logical fallacies that cannot possibly be supported.
Some examples are your rants about folks who don't agree with you are "brainwashed" or similar language.
Seems everything is black and white with you.
Labor = always good, Management = always bad. Domestic car = always good, foreign car = always bad. Domestic car owner = always discerning, foreign car owner = always brainwashed.
It's not that simple.
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Originally Posted By: kschachn
No union exists for the betterment of its members and/or the workers. Once you realize that you never forget it. They exist for the perpetuation of the union itself and for the betterment of the leadership.
Non-unionized workers in the south and elsewhere are not brainwashed. This is exactly what they are not, it is the other way around.
No one helps the union cause by making such a ridiculous statement, you only show that you have an agenda.
That's a ridiculous assertion. In your first sentence, replace unions with management and it would be correct.
If all unions were doing was trying to preserve themselves and get union dues, no employers would give one iota if the union was there. The fact that most employers are very against unions and are continuously striving to bust unions (along with pensions, and benefits, pay), is evidence that the unions musst be doing something more than just taking union dues from employees.
But of course a union has to preserve itself first and foremost before it can do anything. According to some's logic nothing they do can be right. If they take a strong stand, they're accused of being greedy and not "productive" enough and every thing else bad. And if they make concessions and compromise with management, then they're accused of not working in the interest of their members but just themselves. What a joke.
Many of the non-unionized workers are brainwashed and foolish or just too scared and desperate to make a stand in their own interests.
The question is, is the union providing value or just being an irritant to the company.
Union status, or lack of it doesn't make for virtue. There are probably unions more virtuous than management. There are probably companies out there that are more virtuous than the unions representing the rank and file.
You appear to paint with very broad brush strokes and engage in logical fallacies that cannot possibly be supported.
Some examples are your rants about folks who don't agree with you are "brainwashed" or similar language.
Seems everything is black and white with you.
Labor = always good, Management = always bad. Domestic car = always good, foreign car = always bad. Domestic car owner = always discerning, foreign car owner = always brainwashed.
It's not that simple.
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Originally Posted By: kschachn
No union exists for the betterment of its members and/or the workers. Once you realize that you never forget it. They exist for the perpetuation of the union itself and for the betterment of the leadership.
Non-unionized workers in the south and elsewhere are not brainwashed. This is exactly what they are not, it is the other way around.
No one helps the union cause by making such a ridiculous statement, you only show that you have an agenda.
That's a ridiculous assertion. In your first sentence, replace unions with management and it would be correct.
If all unions were doing was trying to preserve themselves and get union dues, no employers would give one iota if the union was there. The fact that most employers are very against unions and are continuously striving to bust unions (along with pensions, and benefits, pay), is evidence that the unions musst be doing something more than just taking union dues from employees.
But of course a union has to preserve itself first and foremost before it can do anything. According to some's logic nothing they do can be right. If they take a strong stand, they're accused of being greedy and not "productive" enough and every thing else bad. And if they make concessions and compromise with management, then they're accused of not working in the interest of their members but just themselves. What a joke.
Many of the non-unionized workers are brainwashed and foolish or just too scared and desperate to make a stand in their own interests.
Quote:
is evidence that the unions musst be doing something more than just taking union dues from employees.
The steep decline in private sector unions suggests otherwise.
is evidence that the unions musst be doing something more than just taking union dues from employees.
The steep decline in private sector unions suggests otherwise.
I don't think I'm really saying it's that simple and black and white. That's a strawman. But you know, in all those examples you gave it's a two-way street. Talking about simple and black and white, did you not read the comment I was replying to?
Originally Posted By: Tempest
Quote:
is evidence that the unions musst be doing something more than just taking union dues from employees.
The steep decline in private sector unions suggests otherwise.
You forgot the steep decline in compensation and employment. By your erroneous case and effect conclusions, those factors should be increasing.
Quote:
is evidence that the unions musst be doing something more than just taking union dues from employees.
The steep decline in private sector unions suggests otherwise.
You forgot the steep decline in compensation and employment. By your erroneous case and effect conclusions, those factors should be increasing.
And here in Wisconsin, public unions.
Just find out how many Wisconsin teachers are still paying dues now that union membership is optional.
Originally Posted By: Tempest
The steep decline in private sector unions suggests otherwise.
Just find out how many Wisconsin teachers are still paying dues now that union membership is optional.
Originally Posted By: Tempest
The steep decline in private sector unions suggests otherwise.
The money is going to run out similar to Greece.
It's always been my belief that unions show up due to the failure of management. Things change, and unions may no longer be necessary at the very same company.
However, consider pilots unions as a possible example of why they are still relevant. Airlines have traditionally treated many employees horribly. The union prevents bad behavior on part of the pilots and on part of the management.
Non union pilots have zero recourse when dealing with bad management. So, they will do little tricks like sitting on the ramp, waiting out very inconsequential weather, needlessly annoying and inconveniencing the pax. I know some that willingly fly through the tops of storms. But mostly they write up nuisance squawks.
However, consider pilots unions as a possible example of why they are still relevant. Airlines have traditionally treated many employees horribly. The union prevents bad behavior on part of the pilots and on part of the management.
Non union pilots have zero recourse when dealing with bad management. So, they will do little tricks like sitting on the ramp, waiting out very inconsequential weather, needlessly annoying and inconveniencing the pax. I know some that willingly fly through the tops of storms. But mostly they write up nuisance squawks.
Originally Posted By: TechnoLoGs
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Human resource departments and management can be pretty thugish itself though.
My uncle still carries the .30-06 he dug out of the sleeper on his Kenworth...I have only heard of HR firing people, never firing AT them!
Dude, he can even have that in Mass.?
Last I checked, it is legal everywhere to carry a spent rifle slug.
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Human resource departments and management can be pretty thugish itself though.
My uncle still carries the .30-06 he dug out of the sleeper on his Kenworth...I have only heard of HR firing people, never firing AT them!
Dude, he can even have that in Mass.?
Last I checked, it is legal everywhere to carry a spent rifle slug.
How did he know it came from a .30-06? Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not doubting your word but I am doubting if your uncle knew it came from a .30-06....unless he actually saw the shooter and could positively id the rifle and caliber. It would be more credible to say he dug a .30 caliber slug out of his cab. Off-topic but still caught my eye.
I've known quite a few HR people that should have been fired AT!
I've dealt with all types of unions during my career...good ones and bad. In my experiences, unions spend the bulk of their time protecting the same people over and over again. While unions aren't necessarily needed anymore, certain employees need them to remain employed....the rest of the work force pays dues so the union can continue to protect the ones that don't deserve a job anyway.
I've known quite a few HR people that should have been fired AT!
I've dealt with all types of unions during my career...good ones and bad. In my experiences, unions spend the bulk of their time protecting the same people over and over again. While unions aren't necessarily needed anymore, certain employees need them to remain employed....the rest of the work force pays dues so the union can continue to protect the ones that don't deserve a job anyway.
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