It's AMSOIL®, not Amsoil

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Originally Posted By: dbias
I've ran AMSOIL, Mobil 1 Extended Performance and Castrol Edge and Ravenol for 10k OCI in all signature vehicles.... and used oil analysis showed no difference of note. So the main difference really comes down to price, availability and attractive packaging?
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The difference may be in how much gunk collects in the ringlands.

Certainly wear control (ppm iron) on a used oil analysis will be similar across full-syn brands, yet how are those pistons doing? We can't see them. Not on a used oil analysis.
..No sludge formation, sure. Black and/or junky stuff on the pistons, possibly. Some think low NOACK helps keep pistons cleaner, amount of boron, use of all-PAO/POE with little or no GroupIII, etc....
 
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Of course, until you run them for the OCI they are intended for, you will not see a difference.

Even then, how would you see a difference? Is there something I could observe that would differentiate the Amsoil vs. Mobil 1 Extended Performance after 15,000 miles?
 
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Of course, until you run them for the OCI they are intended for, you will not see a difference.
Even then, how would you see a difference? Is there something I could observe that would differentiate the Amsoil vs. Mobil 1 Extended Performance after 15,000 miles?
Yes (and you know this), a used oil analysis will give you the health of the oil such that you can tell if the cost of the oil was worth it and/or it can be ran longer. Running any of these oils listed for 10K is a waste of money. Any oil can do a 10K OCI in a normally running engine, unless there is something special about the engine (modern diesel, turbo, etc.)
 
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Yes (and you know this), a used oil analysis will give you the health of the oil such that you can tell if the cost of the oil was worth it and/or it can be ran longer. Running any of these oils listed for 10K is a waste of money. Any oil can do a 10K OCI in a normally running engine, unless there is something special about the engine (modern diesel, turbo, etc.)

Yes but just the TBN would show the health, correct?
 
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Yes (and you know this), a used oil analysis will give you the health of the oil such that you can tell if the cost of the oil was worth it and/or it can be ran longer. Running any of these oils listed for 10K is a waste of money. Any oil can do a 10K OCI in a normally running engine, unless there is something special about the engine (modern diesel, turbo, etc.)
Yes but just the TBN would show the health, correct?
Along with viscosity and TAN. My point is running those oils mentioned for 10K is worthless unless there is a special requirement to do so. To state there is no difference between Amsoil and M1 at 10K is true--you would not see any difference between those two or any other oils at 10K--unless there is something special with the engine. At >15K out to 25K you would likely see a difference--else what is the point of buying an extended drain oil to not extend?
crazy.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Wolf359


How about some real numbers then? Is it 10% better than Mobil 1 0w40? 20%? 50?

If you do the math and can get Mobil 1 0w40 for $12.88 for 5 quarts after rebate, can get you the same or more miles per cent/quart with amsoil?

I mean if it's 50% better, then maybe it'd make sense to pay about $20 for 5 quarts. But you know it's more than that. Isn't it way more? A quick search shows $12.80 a quart. So it's about 5 times more expensive than Mobil 1. So is there math that shows it's 5 times better?


I never said it was less expensive, but if cost is your only measurement, have at it and Godspeed!

But I do like your idea of doing some math:

So let's say you make $50k per year. Your time is worth approximately $25 per hour. Going to WalMart, we'll say, only takes an hour. You burn about $5 worth of gas (and other maintenance) on the way there. So now your 5 quart bottle is worth $42.88, or $8.57/quart. But you're smart and buy two 5 quart jugs, which brings your cost to only $55.76, which is $5.57 per quart after rebate. Not bad.

I get a case of 4 gallons of 5w30 Signature Series for $138.40, or $8.65 per quart. Delivered to my door there is no additional cost. More expensive per quart but ---

What's your OCI? You didn't say but if you are going 7500 miles and I'm going 15k, then cost per mile makes AMSOIL the winner. And if the SS is used to its full potential (arguably we'll need a used oil analysis or two along the way, initially reducing the advantage as we dial it in) then the disparity is even greater.

Then there's the environmental discussion, which I'll mention but won't get into.

Of course in order for an extended OCI to happen, each person has to decide for themselves if they're willing to extend their OCI, which many aren't comfortable with.

If I was doing short OCIs, I would also look for the least expensive oil I could find. But I'm not, so I specifically am trying an oil designed for longer drains. THAT's the advantage here. AMSOIL is not the least expensive oil at purchase time; the savings comes through using it to potential.
 
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Yes (and you know this), a used oil analysis will give you the health of the oil such that you can tell if the cost of the oil was worth it and/or it can be ran longer. Running any of these oils listed for 10K is a waste of money. Any oil can do a 10K OCI in a normally running engine, unless there is something special about the engine (modern diesel, turbo, etc.)
Yes but just the TBN would show the health, correct?
Along with viscosity and TAN. My point is running those oils mentioned for 10K is worthless unless there is a special requirement to do so. To state there is no difference between Amsoil and M1 at 10K is true--you would not see any difference between those two or any other oils at 10K--unless there is something special with the engine. At >15K out to 25K you would likely see a difference--else what is the point of buying an extended drain oil to not extend?
crazy.gif



https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/amsoil.html
https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/mobil1.html
 
We should only concern ourselves with Brand names and not bother ourselves with details. We should all jump on the bandwagon of the brands with the largest number bullies and hope that oil protects our engines. Or not, either way.
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Yes (and you know this), a used oil analysis will give you the health of the oil such that you can tell if the cost of the oil was worth it and/or it can be ran longer. Running any of these oils listed for 10K is a waste of money. Any oil can do a 10K OCI in a normally running engine, unless there is something special about the engine (modern diesel, turbo, etc.)
Yes but just the TBN would show the health, correct?
Along with viscosity and TAN. My point is running those oils mentioned for 10K is worthless unless there is a special requirement to do so. To state there is no difference between Amsoil and M1 at 10K is true--you would not see any difference between those two or any other oils at 10K--unless there is something special with the engine. At >15K out to 25K you would likely see a difference--else what is the point of buying an extended drain oil to not extend?
crazy.gif



https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/amsoil.html
https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/mobil1.html
??? Your point?
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Yes (and you know this), a used oil analysis will give you the health of the oil such that you can tell if the cost of the oil was worth it and/or it can be ran longer. Running any of these oils listed for 10K is a waste of money. Any oil can do a 10K OCI in a normally running engine, unless there is something special about the engine (modern diesel, turbo, etc.)
Yes but just the TBN would show the health, correct?
Along with viscosity and TAN. My point is running those oils mentioned for 10K is worthless unless there is a special requirement to do so. To state there is no difference between Amsoil and M1 at 10K is true--you would not see any difference between those two or any other oils at 10K--unless there is something special with the engine. At >15K out to 25K you would likely see a difference--else what is the point of buying an extended drain oil to not extend?
crazy.gif



https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/amsoil.html
https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/mobil1.html


Thanks for that Shannow.

Has this paper been posted here before? I seem to recall....no matter it's still a decent test.

Looks like they've established that wear/mile drops as OCIs lengthen.

Was the Amsoil the SS? Didn't look like it.


Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
??? Your point?


Not to speak for him, but to me it seems he's pointing out what a waste it is to remove oil that's still good.
 
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Originally Posted By: Wolf359


How about some real numbers then? Is it 10% better than Mobil 1 0w40? 20%? 50?

If you do the math and can get Mobil 1 0w40 for $12.88 for 5 quarts after rebate, can get you the same or more miles per cent/quart with amsoil?

I mean if it's 50% better, then maybe it'd make sense to pay about $20 for 5 quarts. But you know it's more than that. Isn't it way more? A quick search shows $12.80 a quart. So it's about 5 times more expensive than Mobil 1. So is there math that shows it's 5 times better?


I never said it was less expensive, but if cost is your only measurement, have at it and Godspeed!

But I do like your idea of doing some math:

So let's say you make $50k per year. Your time is worth approximately $25 per hour. Going to WalMart, we'll say, only takes an hour. You burn about $5 worth of gas (and other maintenance) on the way there. So now your 5 quart bottle is worth $42.88, or $8.57/quart. But you're smart and buy two 5 quart jugs, which brings your cost to only $55.76, which is $5.57 per quart after rebate. Not bad.

I get a case of 4 gallons of 5w30 Signature Series for $138.40, or $8.65 per quart. Delivered to my door there is no additional cost. More expensive per quart but ---

What's your OCI? You didn't say but if you are going 7500 miles and I'm going 15k, then cost per mile makes AMSOIL the winner. And if the SS is used to its full potential (arguably we'll need a used oil analysis or two along the way, initially reducing the advantage as we dial it in) then the disparity is even greater.

Then there's the environmental discussion, which I'll mention but won't get into.

Of course in order for an extended OCI to happen, each person has to decide for themselves if they're willing to extend their OCI, which many aren't comfortable with.

If I was doing short OCIs, I would also look for the least expensive oil I could find. But I'm not, so I specifically am trying an oil designed for longer drains. THAT's the advantage here. AMSOIL is not the least expensive oil at purchase time; the savings comes through using it to potential.


I'm actually still stocked up on Castrol 0w40 at $2/quart when Autozone did a clearance a few years ago. And when I go to Walmart, I'd never go there just to buy oil so your math is also off.

Your math is also a little off, if someone makes $50k a year, they're not going to walmart on company time, so either leisure time has a value of $0 or the actual value of time based on a 50k annual salary is either based on 24/7/365 or just waking time which is still lower than $25/hour.

Also you could easily just order the oil on Amazon, it doesn't qualify for the rebate, but it'd still mean you're paying double for the oil instead of 4-5x more. Mobil 1 was also spec for my car for 13k, but then later Mercedes changed it to 10k.
 
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Originally Posted By: Wolf359


How about some real numbers then? Is it 10% better than Mobil 1 0w40? 20%? 50?

If you do the math and can get Mobil 1 0w40 for $12.88 for 5 quarts after rebate, can get you the same or more miles per cent/quart with amsoil?

I mean if it's 50% better, then maybe it'd make sense to pay about $20 for 5 quarts. But you know it's more than that. Isn't it way more? A quick search shows $12.80 a quart. So it's about 5 times more expensive than Mobil 1. So is there math that shows it's 5 times better?


I never said it was less expensive, but if cost is your only measurement, have at it and Godspeed!

But I do like your idea of doing some math:

So let's say you make $50k per year. Your time is worth approximately $25 per hour. Going to WalMart, we'll say, only takes an hour. You burn about $5 worth of gas (and other maintenance) on the way there. So now your 5 quart bottle is worth $42.88, or $8.57/quart. But you're smart and buy two 5 quart jugs, which brings your cost to only $55.76, which is $5.57 per quart after rebate. Not bad.

I get a case of 4 gallons of 5w30 Signature Series for $138.40, or $8.65 per quart. Delivered to my door there is no additional cost. More expensive per quart but ---

What's your OCI? You didn't say but if you are going 7500 miles and I'm going 15k, then cost per mile makes AMSOIL the winner. And if the SS is used to its full potential (arguably we'll need a used oil analysis or two along the way, initially reducing the advantage as we dial it in) then the disparity is even greater.

Then there's the environmental discussion, which I'll mention but won't get into.

Of course in order for an extended OCI to happen, each person has to decide for themselves if they're willing to extend their OCI, which many aren't comfortable with.

If I was doing short OCIs, I would also look for the least expensive oil I could find. But I'm not, so I specifically am trying an oil designed for longer drains. THAT's the advantage here. AMSOIL is not the least expensive oil at purchase time; the savings comes through using it to potential.


Only life’s not linear … paid a pretty hefty price for a vehicle … it has OnStar that can tell me conditions like Oil Life from the country I am in now. If I can get it, the OEM can get it. I abide by the OLM. Now they may or may not know if I’m using Dexos approved … but bet the onus would be on me to prove what I used if there is a claim. Why EP -vs- whatever? Just feel with the higher grade base stock and oxidation control I don’t need to run used oil analysis to determine if it held up to the DI engine …
EP is $3/jug more, so $5/quart …PS: oil smells strong like gasoline with only 6k …
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: JLTD
Originally Posted By: Wolf359


How about some real numbers then? Is it 10% better than Mobil 1 0w40? 20%? 50?

If you do the math and can get Mobil 1 0w40 for $12.88 for 5 quarts after rebate, can get you the same or more miles per cent/quart with amsoil?

I mean if it's 50% better, then maybe it'd make sense to pay about $20 for 5 quarts. But you know it's more than that. Isn't it way more? A quick search shows $12.80 a quart. So it's about 5 times more expensive than Mobil 1. So is there math that shows it's 5 times better?


I never said it was less expensive, but if cost is your only measurement, have at it and Godspeed!

But I do like your idea of doing some math:

So let's say you make $50k per year. Your time is worth approximately $25 per hour. Going to WalMart, we'll say, only takes an hour. You burn about $5 worth of gas (and other maintenance) on the way there. So now your 5 quart bottle is worth $42.88, or $8.57/quart. But you're smart and buy two 5 quart jugs, which brings your cost to only $55.76, which is $5.57 per quart after rebate. Not bad.

I get a case of 4 gallons of 5w30 Signature Series for $138.40, or $8.65 per quart. Delivered to my door there is no additional cost. More expensive per quart but ---

What's your OCI? You didn't say but if you are going 7500 miles and I'm going 15k, then cost per mile makes AMSOIL the winner. And if the SS is used to its full potential (arguably we'll need a used oil analysis or two along the way, initially reducing the advantage as we dial it in) then the disparity is even greater.

Then there's the environmental discussion, which I'll mention but won't get into.

Of course in order for an extended OCI to happen, each person has to decide for themselves if they're willing to extend their OCI, which many aren't comfortable with.

If I was doing short OCIs, I would also look for the least expensive oil I could find. But I'm not, so I specifically am trying an oil designed for longer drains. THAT's the advantage here. AMSOIL is not the least expensive oil at purchase time; the savings comes through using it to potential.


I'm actually still stocked up on Castrol 0w40 at $2/quart when Autozone did a clearance a few years ago. And when I go to Walmart, I'd never go there just to buy oil so your math is also off.

Your math is also a little off, if someone makes $50k a year, they're not going to walmart on company time, so either leisure time has a value of $0 or the actual value of time based on a 50k annual salary is either based on 24/7/365 or just waking time which is still lower than $25/hour.

Also you could easily just order the oil on Amazon, it doesn't qualify for the rebate, but it'd still mean you're paying double for the oil instead of 4-5x more. Mobil 1 was also spec for my car for 13k, but then later Mercedes changed it to 10k.


Ok I guess I'm wrong to value your time off; only you can decide how valuable it is to you. I might go least expensive if not going for longer intervals. And price comparisons between wally oil sales and a small company's synthetic aren't really meaningful anyway, since they are such different ends of the spectrum.
 
Originally Posted By: JLTD

Thanks for that Shannow.

Has this paper been posted here before? I seem to recall....no matter it's still a decent test.

Looks like they've established that wear/mile drops as OCIs lengthen.

Was the Amsoil the SS? Didn't look like it.


Was ASL, so was signature series.

It was a good series of tests, but be careful with the lower wear per mile thing, as the authors pointed out, taking a sample every 1,000 and a filter every now and then made it eventually a perpetual oil change
 
https://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-product/m...etic-motor-oil/

Quote:
The Sequence IVA Engine Test, which must be passed to meet the industry-standard API SN specification, simulates extended periods of stop-and-go driving. For 100 hours, the test engine cycles between 50 minutes of idling and 10 minutes of elevated rpm – conditions that encourage engine wear. The camshaft is then measured for wear in 84 locations and an average score is determined. We used Signature Series 0W-20, the lightest viscosity in the line, to further increase the severity of the test. AMSOIL Signature Series Synthetic Motor Oil provided 75 percent more engine protection against horsepower loss and wear1 than required by the industry standard, extending the life of vital components like pistons and cams.


So they are claiming about the same as the opposition's "normal" oils...beating Sequence IVA by a handy margin.
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Originally Posted By: Shannow

https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/amsoil.html
https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/mobil1.html
??? Your point?


Back in the day, Mobil 1 was sold in Oz as a 40,000km oil (25k miles)...it never stopped being that, they stopped marketing that.

It's at least as good/equivalent as Amsoil in going 25k miles, and has been forever.

See link … it has been cut back to 20k … Drivers for the test tour are: nap, irv, racin4ds, and Arco.

https://mobiloil.com/en/article/why-the-mobil-advantage/mobil-1-performance/20k-road-trip
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
Originally Posted By: Shannow

https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/amsoil.html
https://www.brianschreurs.org/neptune.spacebears.com/cars/stories/mobil1.html
??? Your point?


Back in the day, Mobil 1 was sold in Oz as a 40,000km oil (25k miles)...it never stopped being that, they stopped marketing that.

It's at least as good/equivalent as Amsoil in going 25k miles, and has been forever.
Perhaps in Oz, but I would challenge whether the US version of M1 (regular or EP) could go 25K miles on an OC. At 17K my TBN was getting pretty low.
 
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