Is there a difference between licensed ATF and approved ATF?

[GON]

Reading another thread reference Mercon LV, the discussion seems a bit unclear if approved for use is different than licensed.

An example is LiquiMoly ATF 1800. It states it is approved for use for Ford Mercon LV, yet it provides no license number. I am using this fluid in my 2007 F350 which calls for Mercon LV, and thought being approved it was Ford's approval. Now I am not so sure. BTW, I do like this fluid, and it is light golden in color (not red).

 

[BlueOvalFitter]

If it's Ford approved/spec'd it will have the Ford approval/spec number on the container. I didn't see it with all of the other auto makers specs on the container in your pic.
Ford only approves a few other ATF fluids besides Motorcraft; Castrol, WM ST, and probably a couple more, at the most. I only use Ford approved Mercon V in my trans. I usually use MC, but have used Castrol and WM ST in the past with NO problems at all.

 

[SZR48207]

Wasn't there a situation back in the day where 3rd party mfrs could only sell a Mercon V type fluid if they paid Ford for the rights to claim that spec on their product? I could see this as being "licensed".

Approved would then mean a fluid meets the technical specifications but does not mimic the OEM formula?

 

[Oro_O]

Licensed or approved implies the original formula developer's formal approval, through one mechanism or another. They may be technically different, but for all practical purposes, the same.

The real difference you look out for is "recommended for use in..." That is when the refiner/marketer is basically saying: "We don't think it will do harm, though it may not be ideal, and we have no license or approval for it."

 

[2EHA]

DexVI and Merc LV is the easiest possible route for a multi vehicle fluid to get any kind of manufacturer’s approval, Castrol and Valvoline have both done it.

ZF and Aisin certainly don’t really bother (they have their own line of aftermarket service fluids) and the OEMs that employ their transmissions don’t care.

 

[kschachn]

One must also be careful to distinguish between a license, an approval and a specification. For some "meets" is okay but for others it's not okay. There are very few approvals for transmission fluid, many are specifications with the rest being licenses.

 

[SoNic67]

Products that are licensed "Mercon" have a license number and formulation is identical with Ford Motorcraft Chemical and Lubricants one.
"Approved for use" is different - the formula is different, but testing for conformity with specification was done by Ford Motorcraft.
"Meet specification" is the oil manufacturer responsibility to do internal testing. Or not.

MERCON - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Mercon is not synthetic, is made of Group 3 "hydroprocessed base oils and specially designed performance additives". So, IMO, a licensed Mercon cannot be synthetic.

FCSD Chemicals and Lubricants

 

[GON]

Products that are licensed "Mercon" have a license number and formulation is identical with Ford Motorcraft Chemical and Lubricants one.
"Approved for use" is different - the formula is different, but testing for conformity with specification was done by Ford Motorcraft.
"Meet specification" is the oil manufacturer responsibility to do internal testing. Or not.

MERCON - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Mercon is not synthetic, is made of Group 3 "hydroprocessed base oils and specially designed performance additives". So, IMO, a licensed Mercon cannot be synthetic.

FCSD Chemicals and Lubricants

Thanks- you posted the information that cleared it up.

The LiquiMoly states it is full synthetic, which explains why it is approved but not the same formulation as the non full synthetic Mercon LV.

 

[kschachn]

Products that are licensed "Mercon" have a license number and formulation is identical with Ford Motorcraft Chemical and Lubricants one.
"Approved for use" is different - the formula is different, but testing for conformity with specification was done by Ford Motorcraft.
"Meet specification" is the oil manufacturer responsibility to do internal testing. Or not.

I'm so lost on this. So Ford tests and approves a fluid that doesn't meet their published specification?

 

[SoNic67]

I'm so lost on this. So Ford tests and approves a fluid that doesn't meet their published specification?

The specification compliance of any oil can be verified via performance testing. For a cost of course.

That's a different issue from the licensed oil formulation - that is oil manufacturing related. The specification compliance is here met by following the exact licensed oil formulation.

 

[kschachn]

Okay but Ford isn't doing the testing and approval then. In this scenario the fluid is "approved" for use by the testing entity or the blender.

All of which assumes the testing facility knows the exact specifics of the manufacturer's specification.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Licensed or approved implies the original formula developer's formal approval, through one mechanism or another. They may be technically different, but for all practical purposes, the same.

The real difference you look out for is "recommended for use in..." That is when the refiner/marketer is basically saying: "We don't think it will do harm, though it may not be ideal, and we have no license or approval for it."

This.

On the OP's bottle, it says Dexron VI and Mercon LV under "approvals" but then has a separate line that has L-M "also recommends this product in" and listing a bunch of other specs.

Since the Mercon LV is listed as an approval rather than a recommended for use in, it is likely licensed

Does Ford have a list of licensed Mercon LV brands? I know GM has an approval list somewhere

 

[Hall]

as the non full synthetic Mercon LV.

Mercon LV is synthetic

On the OP's bottle, it says Dexron VI and Mercon LV under "approvals" but then has a separate line that has L-M "also recommends this product in" and listing a bunch of other specs.

Since the Mercon LV is listed as an approval rather than a recommended for use in, it is likely licensed

It's very poorly worded. Like you, the way I read it is that it is approved (or licensed) by Ford since then they list a separate group of transmissions that they (LiquiMoly, the company) consider their fluid okay to use in.

 

[Hall]

Products that are licensed "Mercon" have a license number

Listing the license number would definitely be nice for the consumer and smart for the manufacturer (of the fluid) to put on their labels, but is it mandatory ? I guess only Ford and lubricant companies know the answer.