Is Mazda's SkyActiv the best GDI system?

[SkyActivG]

Originally Posted By: itguy08
Originally Posted By: SkyActivG

Don't even get me started on Ford. The Ecoboost is called Ecoboast by some magazines. The CMAX Hybrid is an absolute joke. Ford tried to out do the Prius but the CMAX only gets 37mpg thats worse than the current Civic Hybrid that uses the outgoing IMA system!


Well, their GDI system works as advertised, has been extremely reliable and the engines put out tons of HP and torque in a flat pattern. Yes, they are not the fuel sippers they were portrayed as but I can get 25-26MPG highway in a 4300lb AWD sedan I'm fine with that.

Sorry if I interrupted your Mazda Love Fest but you asked if Mazda's is the best? It's good but not proven to be the best yet.


You didn't interrupt anything. This thread was established by me to ascertain how SkyActiv stacks up against other GDI systems. It's nice to have opinions about other GDI technologies.

 

[cchase]

This thread sounds more like a self-aggrandizing boast-fest than a genuine interest in DI technologies as implemented by various manufacturers.

Mazda has had serious fuel dilution issues in the past with their DI implementations. It doesn't make them any worse than anyone else but it certainly doesn't warrant referring to EcoBoost as "EcoBoast" (which has little to do with how EcoBoost stacks up against competitors and more to do with bashing Ford). That's just trolling, plain and simple.

To answer your question, no, Mazdas SkyActiv is not the best GDI system on the market. It's just another DI implementation that happens to be cleverly marketed.

 

[SteveSRT8]

I happen to love Mazda's focus, but I simply find that the whole 'skyactiv' thing is greatly over-hyped. It is nothing more than ordinary tech, just well marketed and implemented. As far as I know there is nothing new about it at all.

And to me NONE of this DI is very well proven yet. I find it interesting how some mfgrs are making it work well and others are not. That shows we still have a way to go yet...

 

[KrisZ]

Originally Posted By: SkyActivG
You didn't interrupt anything. This thread was established by me to ascertain how SkyActiv stacks up against other GDI systems. It's nice to have opinions about other GDI technologies.


This thread will establish nothing because there are multiple ways to skin the proverbial cat.
Yes, Mazda's way of dealing with intake deposits is interesting, but as was pointed out already, Ford's GDI engine don't seem to have deposit problems either and numerically they have a lot more GDI engine in the field than Mazda can ever imagine.
GM also seems to have a good track record with their DI engine, same with Toyota. They only sore thumb that seems to get the most attention is VW group DI offerings and then people seem to group every other GDI offering with VW’s problems. Fact is that by now even VW reduced significantly intake deposit problem.

Mazda’s DI engines sure seem to deliver on the promises, i.e. great fuel economy without sacrificing driving dynamics, but they are not the best thing in town nor is any other engine from other manufacturers. They all have something different to offer because people’s needs/preferences are different.

 

[Zeus33]

Originally Posted By: cchase
Mazda has had serious fuel dilution issues in the past with their DI implementations.


Does this apply to the 2014 Mazda 6, or was it the previous generations?

 

[Eddie]

Mazda EARLY di ENGINE USED IN THE cx7 HAD SOME DILUTION ISSUES BUT, ACCORDING TO used oil analysis IT DIDN'T EFFECT THE WEAR VALUES. Ops caps. The Skyactive engines have shown little problems with fuel dilution other than isolated cases of very sort run vehicles. My 2014 CX5 has shown no indication of problems in a used oil analysis. To bad some people get their head stuck on early problems and can;t let go years later. To bad for them. Ed

 

[cchase]

Originally Posted By: Eddie
Mazda EARLY di ENGINE USED IN THE cx7 HAD SOME DILUTION ISSUES BUT, ACCORDING TO used oil analysis IT DIDN'T EFFECT THE WEAR VALUES. Ops caps. The Skyactive engines have shown little problems with fuel dilution other than isolated cases of very sort run vehicles. My 2014 CX5 has shown no indication of problems in a used oil analysis. To bad some people get their head stuck on early problems and can;t let go years later. To bad for them. Ed


If you are referring to me, I was not "stuck in the past" and clearly indicated that I was aware it was a past issue by my wording:

Quote:
"had serious fuel dilution issues in the past with their DI implementations".


The point I was trying to make was to show the OP that simply because there was a recall on one model of Ford EcoBoost doesn't mean SkyActiv is somehow inherently superior, and that both companies (along with just about every other) have had DI teething issues.

 

[pbm]

I like both the Focus and the Mazda and am considering both...I would get a Focus with an M/T over an A/T. I know very little about the 6 speed A/T in the Mazda3 (2013 leftover would be my choice for $$$ reasons).
Can anybody tell me if the Mazda A/T is an inhouse design or do they use somebody else's unit?

PS: I think both Ford and Mazda have the DI issue pretty well sorted out. As the owner of 2 brand new Mazda's in my past life I can say they were/are good cars. I did however, always find the A/C system wanting...hopefully that's changed.

 

[UG_Passat]

Originally Posted By: SkyActivG
Originally Posted By: UG_Passat
Originally Posted By: SkyActivG


I have looked into various GDI systems. Hyundai's GDI is very spotty when comparing it to the Toyota GDI and SkyActiv. There seems to be an ongoing problems with carbon buildup on the intake vales in Hyundai's equipped with GDI. I have also read that Audi has also had carbon buildup issues with its GDI technology.

I have yet to find any articles about carbon buildup issues in Mazda's SkyActiv system. I would think that Mazda's system would be near flawless because Mazda is relying on this technology to catapult it to profits now that Mazda divorced Ford.


That's because Mazda is fairly new in the game. Once people get the miles/hours on their engines, then you'll see if Mazda addressed the intake valve deposits.

The current Toyota D4-S and Audi Twin-injection has both port & direct injection, so intake valve buildup is not an issue, unless you use non-PEA detergent fuel


SkyActiv isn't as new as most think. The carbon deposit issues from Hyundai's cheap GDI system are non existent according to Mazda forums and this article discusses why.

http://www.motoiq.com/MagazineArticles/i...technology.aspx


Hyundai "cheap" GDI is from the company that is implemented GDI the longest. Their GDI technology is licensed from Mitsubishi.

Let's see how Skyactiv is when engines are nearing 100,000 miles and over... see if they have to drop some coin to remove the intake manifold to clean the intake valves.

 

[Eddie]

Sorry cchase. I've been cranky today and it just came out.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: UG_Passat

Hyundai "cheap" GDI is from the company that is implemented GDI the longest. Their GDI technology is licensed from Mitsubishi.


Didn't Mercedes have GDI in the 1950's?

 

[bladecutter]

Originally Posted By: pbm
Can anybody tell me if the Mazda A/T is an inhouse design or do they use somebody else's unit?


All in house design, doesn't share any parts or design with any other a/t on the market.

BC.

 

[bladecutter]

Originally Posted By: KrisZ
Yes, Mazda's way of dealing with intake deposits is interesting, but as was pointed out already, Ford's GDI engine don't seem to have deposit problems either and numerically they have a lot more GDI engine in the field than Mazda can ever imagine.


Has it ever crossed your mind that Ford's technology with GDI is directly related to the technology and experience that they gained by having their ownership stake in Mazda for so many years?

BC.

 

[itguy08]

Originally Posted By: Bladecutter

Has it ever crossed your mind that Ford's technology with GDI is directly related to the technology and experience that they gained by having their ownership stake in Mazda for so many years?


Nope. They worked with Bosch for the fuel delivery system in the Ecoboosts. Did Mazda go at themselves or work with someone?

 

[itguy08]

Originally Posted By: SkyActivG

No because Fords system works entirely different and the internals are junk. Lets see how the Ford GDI motors will do with a compression of 13 US or 14 Japan


Fords system is mainly Bosch. Bosch high pressure pump and injectors, at least on the 3.5.

And by the way it holds up to 12 PSI of boost just fine.

It is anything buy junk as you claim. Ford has 2 million Ecoboosts in the wild and I'd bet many with over 100k now. I know I'm at 65k on my 2010 SHO. No issues other than a knock sensor.

 

[zloveraz]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: UG_Passat

Hyundai "cheap" GDI is from the company that is implemented GDI the longest. Their GDI technology is licensed from Mitsubishi.


Didn't Mercedes have GDI in the 1950's?


Yes the 300SL and before that in the 30's it was on Daimler Benz aircraft engines. The 1964 F1 Ferrari 168 that won the championship that year had DI also.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: itguy08
Originally Posted By: SkyActivG

No because Fords system works entirely different and the internals are junk. Lets see how the Ford GDI motors will do with a compression of 13 US or 14 Japan


Fords system is mainly Bosch. Bosch high pressure pump and injectors, at least on the 3.5.

And by the way it holds up to 12 PSI of boost just fine.

It is anything buy junk as you claim. Ford has 2 million Ecoboosts in the wild and I'd bet many with over 100k now. I know I'm at 65k on my 2010 SHO. No issues other than a knock sensor.



Something tells me that 12 psi might even be a bit more than 13 or even 14 to one compression!!!

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: itguy08

No because Fords system works entirely different and the internals are junk. Lets see how the Ford GDI motors will do with a compression of 13 US or 14 Japan


Fords system is mainly Bosch. Bosch high pressure pump and injectors, at least on the 3.5.

And by the way it holds up to 12 PSI of boost just fine.

It is anything buy junk as you claim. Ford has 2 million Ecoboosts in the wild and I'd bet many with over 100k now. I know I'm at 65k on my 2010 SHO. No issues other than a knock sensor.



Something tells me that 12 psi might even be a bit more than 13 or even 14 to one compression!!! Poor little Mazda cannot begin to imagine selling 2 million of ANYTHING...

 

[SkyActivG]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: itguy08

No because Fords system works entirely different and the internals are junk. Lets see how the Ford GDI motors will do with a compression of 13 US or 14 Japan


Fords system is mainly Bosch. Bosch high pressure pump and injectors, at least on the 3.5.

And by the way it holds up to 12 PSI of boost just fine.

It is anything buy junk as you claim. Ford has 2 million Ecoboosts in the wild and I'd bet many with over 100k now. I know I'm at 65k on my 2010 SHO. No issues other than a knock sensor.



Something tells me that 12 psi might even be a bit more than 13 or even 14 to one compression!!! Poor little Mazda cannot begin to imagine selling 2 million of ANYTHING...


Let's not forget about Ford's horrible recent reliability ratings. truedelta.com has listed a myriad of problems that the Ecoboost has. I think it's ironic that ever since Mazda became severed from Ford, the reliability of Ford has tanked. Ford is no longer using MZR derivatives which were very reliable but not very good in gas. MZR was a Mazda technology.

Let's also not forget the Taurus SHO vs the Infiniti G37. The Taurus did horribly for a turbo charged V6.

 

[itguy08]

Originally Posted By: SkyActivG

Let's not forget about Ford's horrible recent reliability ratings. truedelta.com has listed a myriad of problems that the Ecoboost has.


I wouldn't wipe my butt with truedelta.com. His "ratings" pretty much lump every little issue as a problem and that is the dumbest thing ever. A messed up trim piece is treated the same as a blown engine. It's not until relatively recently that he changed it up to actually somewhat reflect problem areas.

I'm no fan of Consumer Reports but I believe they don't have any issues with the quality of the Ecoboost engines.

Quote:
I think it's ironic that ever since Mazda became severed from Ford, the reliability of Ford has tanked.


Tanked? Really? Are you high?

Ford is 3 problems per 100 vehicles less than Mazda. And it's been widely reported that Ford's "quality" issues are more to do with My Ford Touch rather than powertrain issues.

They both (Ford and Mazda) make fine cars. Neither one is leaps and bounds ahead of the others WRT quality.

Quote:
Let's also not forget the Taurus SHO vs the Infiniti G37. The Taurus did horribly for a turbo charged V6.


Link please. And it's apples to oranges. I've owned an 04 G35 and now the 10 SHO. The G was a better handling car (it better as it was a 4 door 350Z), had better brakes. But the SHO is the better cruiser - it's a boulevard cruiser that had great acceleration (will blow the doors off my old G, and it wasa 6MT), decent handling (for a porker), and is awesome for long trips. We do a lot of long trips and they are way more comfortable in the SHO than the G. I'd buy another G as it was a great car too.