Is Honda Z1 really not that good?

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Originally Posted By: sayjac
^Sooooo, does that mean that Z-1 while not the best, could be the best for a Honda? Which would be all I'd be interested to know. And, when you do a (1)drain and refill what could mix with the Z-1, if there is something better?


Depends on what you compare it to. I'm sure there are fluids that have better base and additives, but AT is designed with a specific friction properties in mind and if the ATF doesn't match this characteristic, it could be bad.

Currently using Maxlife but doesn't seems to be as good as Specialty Formulation's ATF Z1. Haven't tried other fluids yet.
 
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
One thing I like about using the less expensive ATF is that I can clean the magnetic drain plug more often.

It seems that the Honda drain plug gets very dirty at only 30K miles.


IMO it seems like Honda used Fe based friction material and rely on the magnetic drain plug to catch the worn clutch pack material. If this is true, then it would make perfect sense that they don't have a serviceable filter.
 
Gogozy:

I did the maxlife via 3 drain-fills in one afternoon. Poor-man's flush. Did my accord same day w/ the M1+LG Black. This was...2-3? years ago so I'm not certain of the bottle color; I remember the bottle definitely said honda compatible or some such.

Within three months the AT started to act a little different. Not enough to be alarming, just holding gears longer and lightly banging into gear.

Then my wife started complaining. But when I'd test drive it, it'd do just fine. Until at about 5-6 months it consistently got stuck in gear, especially if there was a hill climb, and couldn't upshift. At some point it'd slam HARD from a 5k rpm to the next gear with no easing in... I was worried about motor mounts it was so violent.

Flushed Z1 back in and the problem gradually, and *almost* completely, subsided.

The M1+LG in the accord never gave me a problem. Be careful about the LG dose. More LG=more slippage. It was quieter, but I took a mpg hit immediately. I ultimately settled on Z1 + ~3/4qt M1, no LG in the accord and it worked well, felt good, shifted quickly, without flaring into 2nd, without banging into gear.

Mike
 
meep:
thanks. maybe i shall just skip Maxlife and go straight to the Amsoil or Redline D4. on the subject of Z1, does anyone think Honda change the formula on their Z1 in recent years?
 
I just used the amsoil in my element and it shifts a lot better. smoother, faster, more precise. When its cold it shifts firmer than the z1 but I think thats because its a thicker viscosity. I read on here that amsoil is coming out with some sort of lighter wt version soon??
 
Originally Posted By: PandaBear
Originally Posted By: Donald
Amsoil ATF is better but more expensive.


How?


Being synthetic it can withstand heat better, good for 50K severe and 100K normal. Everyone who has put Amsoil in a Honda has said it shifted better. Cannot remember anyone on forum who has changed back from Amsoil to Z1.
 
I did a drain and refill with Z-1 on my Accord last week. I was surprised that the magnetic drain plug had so much ferrous material since I installed a Magnafine at the last change. I added a half a bottle (about 5 or 6 oz.) of LG red with the 2.5 qts. of fluid and now I'm hoping I didn't overdose it. This is a 2001 4cyl. with the problematic BAXA A/T. It feels the same as always which is pretty good. My wife and I drive the car gently because the A/T is known to be weak. I'm using LG red and Magnafine filter hoping to extend the life of the A/T.
 
Well when you change the Magnefine you can pop it apart and look at the magnet and filter media.

If you look at some posts from me from last summer you will see I ran a text of a UOA before and after the install of a Magnefine. I had high AL in the ATF for my Camry and the Magnefine did not help.

I still think the Magnefine is a good filter for cars where you do not have room for a spin on filter that filters to a better micron rating.

Have you considered Amsoil or M1. I would go with a better ATF rather than adding LG to mediocre Z1 ATF.
 
The A/T has 84K and its never been replaced. I have changed the fluid using Z-1 approx. every 20K. I just drain and refill < 3 qts. each time. I use the LG because I believe it improves the fluid and LG red doesn't change the fluids friction properties (I think). So far so good. I have one more change of fluid in my stash so when I hit approx 120K it will most likely get Amsoil.
 
I also do not think it makes sense to have a stash of ATF. Several companies (M1 and Amsoil) keep changing and improving their ATF so best to get what you need but not several years worth.
 
I accumulated my stash of Z-1 with a $100 credit card that my Honda dealer sent a few years ago. The card could only be used at the Service or Parts departments of the dealership so I bought 12 qts. of Z-1 and a few oil filters.
 
Originally Posted By: pbm
I did a drain and refill with Z-1 on my Accord last week. I was surprised that the magnetic drain plug had so much ferrous material since I installed a Magnafine at the last change. I added a half a bottle (about 5 or 6 oz.) of LG red with the 2.5 qts. of fluid and now I'm hoping I didn't overdose it. This is a 2001 4cyl. with the problematic BAXA A/T. It feels the same as always which is pretty good. My wife and I drive the car gently because the A/T is known to be weak. I'm using LG red and Magnafine filter hoping to extend the life of the A/T.

where did you install the filter? after fluid leave AT, does it hit drain plug first then cooler then flow back to AT?
 
2007 Odyssey:
17,000 miles - drain and factory fill Z-1: Lots of metalic gunk on the drain plug and the metal flakes in the drain pan. I was prompted to change the ATF because the transmission started to feel like it was slipping out of overdive too easily -just didn't feel the same when new. Refilled with Z-1 with no notable change.

35,000 miles - cooler line flush with Castrol Import ATF, added Magnefine filter: Plug had same amount of metalic gunk when I drained the second round of Z-1. With Castol I notice an immediate difference - shifts felt firmer but not harsh, N to D shift lag decreased, overdrive seems to hold on longer on hills. There is still some Z-1 in there, so I will flush again with more Castrol and a new Magenfine in a few thousand miles. I may consider Redline D4 later but I'm happy with the Castrol right now.
 
Originally Posted By: gogozy
Originally Posted By: pbm
I did a drain and refill with Z-1 on my Accord last week. I was surprised that the magnetic drain plug had so much ferrous material since I installed a Magnafine at the last change. I added a half a bottle (about 5 or 6 oz.) of LG red with the 2.5 qts. of fluid and now I'm hoping I didn't overdose it. This is a 2001 4cyl. with the problematic BAXA A/T. It feels the same as always which is pretty good. My wife and I drive the car gently because the A/T is known to be weak. I'm using LG red and Magnafine filter hoping to extend the life of the A/T.

where did you install the filter? after fluid leave AT, does it hit drain plug first then cooler then flow back to AT?


A Magnefile filter should be installed in the return line between the cooler and transmission.
 
Originally Posted By: meep
I did the maxlife via 3 drain-fills in one afternoon. Poor-man's flush. Did my accord same day w/ the M1+LG Black. This was...2-3? years ago so I'm not certain of the bottle color; I remember the bottle definitely said honda compatible or some such.

Within three months the AT started to act a little different. Not enough to be alarming, just holding gears longer and lightly banging into gear.

Then my wife started complaining. But when I'd test drive it, it'd do just fine. Until at about 5-6 months it consistently got stuck in gear, especially if there was a hill climb, and couldn't upshift. At some point it'd slam HARD from a 5k rpm to the next gear with no easing in... I was worried about motor mounts it was so violent.

Flushed Z1 back in and the problem gradually, and *almost* completely, subsided.
Mike
It's stories like this plus my own personal experience that will keep me using Z1 in my daughter's 01 Civic. This year model that is noted for a major trouble spot in the tranny. Yet, at about 130k and 3 Z1 drain and refills, the car seems to shift fine with no issues. (knock wood)
LOL.gif
My attitude now is, if it's not broke don't try to fix it. I will say that the car has not been driven hard, at least not to my knowledge.

Did the last one myself and cleaned the magnetic drain plug. Fairly simple to do, and Z1 costs about $7 a quart.
 
Z-1 price posted purely as point of information. Everyone should use what they're comfortable with, for me that's Z1. I've had no issues based on my personal experience. For me there's no need to change, because it's worked fine. JMO
 
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