Is Amsoil Playing with Me??

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
Pablo, please understand this is nothing against you. I understand what you mean about Amsoil not getting emails, but I sent 12 total and the only ones not answered was the ones that only concentrated on their testing methods? So basically they consider any threatening emails Spam?


No, that's not what I said. You said you sent them from one or two particular email addresses - I suggested they are in their SPAM folder and have not even seen them yet. I doubt they purposely didn't answer any emails.

Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
I not only talking about the Redline. It says on the Amsoil site compared to 30wtXX how am I supposed to know what that xx means? They say RP 5/30 but no mention if its the XPR series, they say Valvoline 10/30 but not if its VR1 synthetic or Dino, or the Non Street or Street VR1 if it is even VR1 they are comparing with, they say Brad Penn, but which one? Penn Grade, or the Race Oil?


Where is this "xx"? I didn't see that. All the oils evaluated are the race oils offered by the listed companies.

 

[Pablo]

Also - please understand. Amsoil is not "playing with you". It's simply not their way. I have been a dealer for 11 years and Amsoil does not play with customers. Sometimes they are a little technology challenged. Sometimes around the holidays they don't have enough staff for the phones. Just temporary issues. But, again, you knew I'm a sponsor - and if I don't know an answer off hand, I will find out. I will dig deeper when necessary.

Amsoil has not really done a "comparo" with the oils anyway. Just a quick 4 ball wear test using the test specification and parameters listed. The other companies haven't done any comparison that I have seen.

I know enough about evo's and have enough friends with evo's and other Mitsubishi's to help with lubricant and Amsoil questions. I'm not sure at all what the gig is with those Amsoil guys on that board. You can just tell them to contact me, but I doubt that's worth your time (I understand). But seriously I'm here to help. I see nothing wrong with your choice of Redline.

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

Well, I had a bad experience with Amsoil. Just wanted to post if others had too. Thats all. My post isn't really about the oil "comparo" itself, since I wasn't there, or ANY Amsoil rep on these boards or any other to see the tests, I would have to say they are about as accurate as any manufacturers "claims".

To me, the post was about TOP, what does TOP mean? "Treatment of People". To me, there are just too many people jumping on the Amsoil Bandwagon to make a buck. They don't care if its good oil or not. Many of them don't anyway. Its all about a side job in a tough economy to earn a buck. I can respect that.

I just don't like when I put up a question that questions Amsoil and then I get bashed saying that I don't know anything about oil and frakley been called an idiot on the other forums. Granted, the folks HERE on THIS forum have a nicer approach and are more williing to help. BUT this is not the only web site blog I visit. I mean on one forum I got into a online debate over the XL line of Amsoil where I was degrated by the Rep for statiing that XL was a Group 3. The guy tried to belittle me on the forum. Instead of saying, yeah, your right it is a Group 3, BUT its still....you know?

Anyway, you know when you go to a restaurant and the service is horrible, and your like, man I really like this place but the service just stinks. You just don't go back. No matter how good the food is. Does that make sense?

Maybe after my run with Redline I will try the RD30. I do my testing on oil for about a year before I decide to stay with it, or dump it. I have many variables that I use. I don't depend soley on UOA's for my decision. My testing consists of but not limited to the fallowing: Dyno testing, Boost Response, Oil Temps, Oil Pressure readings, UOA's and data logging. I record all of these and place them into a spreadsheet and compare to other oils that I have used in the past. Including Amsoil that I used in my first Evo back in 2003. I realize that Amsoil has also updated their formulas to why I was interested in trying it again. That is where my whole "experience" started. Its very unfortunate for Amsoil because I report my findings to the Evo Forums, Car Clubs, Expos, etc that I attend with my car, not to mention Track events and car gatherings. Redline just treated me much better and they earned my business. Thats all I have to say. Its not about Redline vs. Amsoil. Both Oils are excellent. It all boils down to TOP (as I mentioned above) to me.

I would like to actually Thank the Amsoil Site Sponsors in BITOG for not bashing me like so many other Amsoil dealers have. I will spread the word to folks that are interested in Amsoil to come here and ask you guys. I am not going to bad talk the oil. Just the folks that tried to sell it to me.

Jeff

 

[demarpaint]

"TOP" IMO can really hurt a company. There are a few oil companies I will no longer deal with as a result of "TOP" [no names mentioned to avoid a flame war]. You're also correct that there are some reps on other sites that are totally clueless representing products, making false claims. It is a shame they can't be held liable for spewing false info. Hitting someone in their wallet can often be as good as or better than smacking them upside their head. I wish there was a way of reporting dealers to some authority making out and out false claims, and they'd get fined. It would take a lot of nonsense posted on these boards away. You can't stop a consumer from voicing an opinion but it would be great to stop a rep from spewing false data. The Amsoil reps here are first rate, and know the products they are selling. Not true on some of these other boards! JMO

 

[Ben99GT]

Amsoil XL-7500 Q&A: http://www.amsoil.com/articlespr/article_xl7500.aspx

Originally Posted By: Amsoil
Q: AMSOIL will be using a different formula for its XL-7500 Motor Oils. Why did AMSOIL change the formula?

A: Our XL-7500 oils are the oils of choice in the retail oil change market, and primarily because of warranty concerns the customers in this market require API-certified oils. In order to obtain API SL/ILSAC GF-3 certification and still remain cost-competitive with the other oils sold at retail oil change outlets, we had to change to Group III basestocks. To obtain API certification with our top tier basestocks would have priced our Dealers out of the market.


I guess the guy arguing with you over XL's group III base stocks isn't reading Amsoil's literature.

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
Amsoil XL-7500 Q&A: http://www.amsoil.com/articlespr/article_xl7500.aspx

Originally Posted By: Amsoil
Q: AMSOIL will be using a different formula for its XL-7500 Motor Oils. Why did AMSOIL change the formula?

A: Our XL-7500 oils are the oils of choice in the retail oil change market, and primarily because of warranty concerns the customers in this market require API-certified oils. In order to obtain API SL/ILSAC GF-3 certification and still remain cost-competitive with the other oils sold at retail oil change outlets, we had to change to Group III basestocks. To obtain API certification with our top tier basestocks would have priced our Dealers out of the market.


I guess the guy arguing with you over XL's group III base stocks isn't reading Amsoil's literature.

Obviously. So True. It just amazes me that "I" get bashed on other forums for being right. Wow. You just made me feel that much better. Thank You for that link. Just for myself to know.

Jeff

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

I tried to talk to the Amsoil guy on one of the forums I go to and now he is ignoring me. Haha. Won't return my PM's or acknowledge me in the forums. Not that I am surprised. I just think its silly. He mocks people for not knowing about oil, but then when confronted that Amsoil XL is a group 3 not a group 4 oil as HE stated on the forum, instead of saying, "oops I made a mistake" he says "I don't need to check ALL amsoil oils are group 4 or better". Geeze. See, Amsoil you can't have Joe Blow sell your oil and expect a great customer experience. You can't give a couple of seminars and all of a sudden these folks are oil gurus? Amsoil, if your listening, don't concentrate so much on getting your oil out to the masses in this way. All it does is upset potential customers. I am trying Redline over Amsoil for this particular car, just for that reason. Lost me as a customer, and I am sure you (Amsoil as a whole) are losing many others.

 

[kcfx4]

do you want frys with that?

 

[Malo83]

Amsoil, pfffft! why bother

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
See, Amsoil you can't have Joe Blow sell your oil and expect a great customer experience. You can't give a couple of seminars and all of a sudden these folks are oil gurus? Amsoil, if your listening, don't concentrate so much on getting your oil out to the masses in this way. All it does is upset potential customers. I am trying Redline over Amsoil for this particular car, just for that reason. Lost me as a customer, and I am sure you (Amsoil as a whole) are losing many others.



While I agree, they don't care. I don't even think taking a seminar is required. You are now the third person I've read about this week who won't use Amsoil because of one of their dealers. Amsoil has a rep on another board that must jump into every thread to plug Amsoil, so much so that people won't use the product because of him, and have mentioned it in threads. Two of the members post here or have posted here. I won't join the site as a result of him. You'd think Amsoil would monitor these boards and warn dealers, or send them their $35 back and fire them! LOL They don't and it appears they won't. Bad dealers can hurt a product, and this dealer on the other board has proven it just by the comments of others who won't use the product as a result of him. It's a shame for the most part it has a great rep and some good products. Amsoil would do better if they watched their dealers online actions a bit, or send them here for lessons. JMO

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
See, Amsoil you can't have Joe Blow sell your oil and expect a great customer experience. You can't give a couple of seminars and all of a sudden these folks are oil gurus? Amsoil, if your listening, don't concentrate so much on getting your oil out to the masses in this way. All it does is upset potential customers. I am trying Redline over Amsoil for this particular car, just for that reason. Lost me as a customer, and I am sure you (Amsoil as a whole) are losing many others.


I agree there are some rotten dealers out there. These guys don't last long. One question you can ask them if they are T-1 certified. But it's really a minority, not ALL or EVERY dealer - most are actually quite soft spoken.

Amsoil has many great customer service experiences every day. There is a reason Amsoil continues to grow, set new records, introduce new products, gain customers.

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint

While I agree, they don't care. I don't even think taking a seminar is required. You are now the third person I've read about this week who won't use Amsoil because of one of their dealers. Amsoil has a rep on another board that must jump into every thread to plug Amsoil, so much so that people won't use the product because of him, and have mentioned it in threads. Two of the members post here or have posted here. I won't join the site as a result of him. You'd think Amsoil would monitor these boards and warn dealers, or send them their $35 back and fire them! LOL They don't and it appears they won't. Bad dealers can hurt a product, and this dealer on the other board has proven it just by the comments of others who won't use the product as a result of him. It's a shame for the most part it has a great rep and some good products. Amsoil would do better if they watched their dealers online actions a bit, or send them here for lessons. JMO


Amsoil does care. And can and does terminate relationships. If that board is being ruined by some crazed sponsor, why doesn't the board ban him? Amsoil has rules and they have enforcement policies. But they don't have the personnel to watch EVERY chat site on the internet - that's impossible. Amsoil can't ban dealers from being site sponsors - well I guess they could, but that would be insane.

The simple fact is that the Amsoil model does work. Look at the size of the company now. I think it's up to the boards to keep unruly sponsors of ANY product in check. In fact - the market seems to working. As you guys state, these jokers are turning people off. Yes it does give Amsoil a black eye. I wish I had a simple remedy. I will start a dialog with Amsoil HQ and see where it goes.

We need to think outside the web for a minute - many more oil sales are made or lost outside our little sphere than inside. Castrol stays pro because of some doofiss with a dipstick, many oils are pushed by knowledgeable sales staff oil experts at any given auto parts store or Target or Walmart. And frankly the masses have never heard of or don't care about Redline, Royal Purple, Amsoil, etc They just buy the jingle in the head or what they guess is best, with not a lot of input.

BITOG for lessons? That's funny!!

 

[demarpaint]

Pablo- I don't belong to Noria, but I've read threads there, the dealer I'm referring to resides there. I think he was banned here, otherwise he'd be in every thread that mentions the word oil. People have actually posted there they'd never use Amsoil because of him, reading the threads I can see why.

I'm pretty sure if his sales are good Amsoil isn't going to tell him to quiet down or pull his dealer status, but then again I don't know how Amsoil works. Makes no difference to me since I don't belong to Noria.

 

[Pablo]

Yes he is nutty. I don't know if anyone reported him. But - ya know he wasn't a sponsor there, and had some freedom to say what he wants as long as he isn't representing himself as AMSOIL proper.

It's a fine line - people may THINK he "works" for Amsoil (he doesn't), but as long as he doesn't say (ie make junk up) "We say the formula is blah-blah-blah and you can go 100,000 miles without checking the oil and Amsoil warranty will cover you" - he's not violating a thing. Oh, I'm sure it bugs some people to hear that extended OCI's actually do work out just fine for some - but that's just offending the prejudices of others and frankly par for the course.

 

[Ben99GT]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I think he was banned here, otherwise he'd be in every thread that mentions the word oil. People have actually posted there they'd never use Amsoil because of him, reading the threads I can see why.


Tim Vipond? That guys spams the [censored] out of numerous message boards, and has a bad attitude about it.

 

[demarpaint]

Yes that's him, I just had a look over there. He is flat out annoying. I don't think it has anything to do with extended drains or the Amsoil concept, it is his constant scanning and jumping in with an Amsoil product that gets people twisted I think. His product is the very best and nothing else will work attitude.

Then he was fighting people for using a UCL like TCW3, because car makers are against it. LOL. There are other things car makers are against too, so he's sort of a hypocrite IMO, but I won't go there. It's people like him Amsoil should talk with because when members of sites are complaining amongst themselves it is hurting the product. But then again who am I to say? Funny, myself, Ben, ADFD1, Trajan, and you Pablo are fully aware and annoyed by him, I bet there are hundreds of others too. Not good for the Amsoil image, rules or not. JMO

 

[Johnny]

Tim is/was a [removed] ex-Shell fuels employee. He is a very sharp individual but has absolutely no sales tact and as for as I know, never had any marketing training. Just the technical fuels business. Explains a lot of why he is the way he is.

To meet him in person he is actually a pretty nice guy.

 

[demarpaint]

I'm sure he's a nice guy, but someone should set him straight. He's not doing Amsoil any good with his constant plugs and rants about the product. Sometimes pushing as hard as he does has a negative effect.

 

[Johnny]

It always has a negative effect as for as I'm concerned, on any product.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Johnny
It always has a negative effect as for as I'm concerned, on any product.


+1 Welcome back Johnny! Happy New Year!

Frank