If the American car companies fail, who will make America's automobiles. This is especially problematic if the United States ever finds itself in a war with Japan again for whatever reason. Who will supply us with military trucks, and civilian automobiles? The French? The Germans? What do you guys think of the bailout in light of this.
If the American Car Companies Fail...
- Thread starter parimento1
- Start date
- Status
As much as I make fun of particular types of American cars, and I even drive one foreign car, I do not want GM, Ford, or Dodge to go under. All kidding aside, any decent person wants to see his fellow Americans working, and without GM, Ford, etc., there would be some really bad times ahead. There are simply too many institutions built upon supplying the Big 3 with many goods and services.
Last edited:
Well said, Saturn Fan. That's why we should support the Big 3 by purchasing from them. Regardless of perception, the Big 3 make quality autos. I will not drive an import car. I have no problems with my Ford Fusion and would buy another one if I had to. I grew up riding in nothing but American and I will drive nothing but American. Just my view.
you never know...we live in a world today where everything is outsourced to other countries.
I also will only buy from American companies but times are changing...my Aveo was built in South Korea with 85% of its parts being made from there and 13% made in Canada. The 2% left over...who knows? None of the assembly took place here either so who did I really help by walking into my local Chevy dealer?
I mean by buying American you are helping the American company by helping them to generate profits. Even if the parts and labor are not American, the profits still go to Ford or GM or Chrysler. Other American car companies have failed...why not these? AMC, Studebaker, Packard, just to name a few all failed here in the US. Why not Chrysler, Ford or GM?
Great thread and many solid points here guys. I do have a little bit of conflicting feelings about owning a car like my Corolla. Sometimes I feel bad that ultimately the proceeds from my 14,000 go back to Japan instead of here, but how much of that money really goes there? I mean the car was made in Fremont, CA by American workers making a great wage. The salesman, an American worker, got a great commission from me I am sure. I don't even know if there is many authentic Japanese parts on this Corolla.
It would be nice if there were a breakdown of where my money went.
It would be nice if there were a breakdown of where my money went.
Originally Posted By: parimento1
I mean by buying American you are helping the American company by helping them to generate profits. Even if the parts and labor are not American, the profits still go to Ford or GM or Chrysler. Other American car companies have failed...why not these? AMC, Studebaker, Packard, just to name a few all failed here in the US. Why not Chrysler, Ford or GM?
If the parts and labor aren't American you are using your dollars to tell them that you approve of their moving jobs off shore. That is the wrong message.
I mean by buying American you are helping the American company by helping them to generate profits. Even if the parts and labor are not American, the profits still go to Ford or GM or Chrysler. Other American car companies have failed...why not these? AMC, Studebaker, Packard, just to name a few all failed here in the US. Why not Chrysler, Ford or GM?
If the parts and labor aren't American you are using your dollars to tell them that you approve of their moving jobs off shore. That is the wrong message.
Ford was nearly two years overdue in WWII getting their assigned bomber plane in production and it significantly delayed the offensive war effort. They still move slowly 65 years later when we need smaller lighter cars to cut our hemhorraging of dollars overseas for oil. I don't see how maintaining the status quo is patriotic... or, for that matter, how Detroit three management stays employed...
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: eljefino
Ford was nearly two years overdue in WWII getting their assigned bomber plane in production and it significantly delayed the offensive war effort. They still move slowly 65 years later when we need smaller lighter cars to cut our hemhorraging of dollars overseas for oil. I don't see how maintaining the status quo is patriotic... or, for that matter, how Detroit three management stays employed...
Oh come on! Mitsubishi was definitely on-time slapping together a paper-thin tin-can called the Zero to run suicide missions into Pearl Harbour though, so that puts them in the green, right? Makes me want to run out and buy an Eclipse right now!
VW was the official brand of Nazi Germany! The Bug was produced as one of Hitler's promises, to provide affordable transportation to all Germans!
History is fun, I don't see how buying Japanese cars; you know, the country that seemingly attacked your country of residence completely unprovoked is patriotic either, especially since YOU are the one who has decided to bring up things from the WWII era......
Ford was nearly two years overdue in WWII getting their assigned bomber plane in production and it significantly delayed the offensive war effort. They still move slowly 65 years later when we need smaller lighter cars to cut our hemhorraging of dollars overseas for oil. I don't see how maintaining the status quo is patriotic... or, for that matter, how Detroit three management stays employed...
Oh come on! Mitsubishi was definitely on-time slapping together a paper-thin tin-can called the Zero to run suicide missions into Pearl Harbour though, so that puts them in the green, right? Makes me want to run out and buy an Eclipse right now!
VW was the official brand of Nazi Germany! The Bug was produced as one of Hitler's promises, to provide affordable transportation to all Germans!
History is fun, I don't see how buying Japanese cars; you know, the country that seemingly attacked your country of residence completely unprovoked is patriotic either, especially since YOU are the one who has decided to bring up things from the WWII era......
American car model lines could be reduced 90%. Saturn is the only GM line worth saving. Honestly, where does Buick fit in going toward the future? WWII/Boomers are the only people buying that ~type~ of car. I think the best medicene would be a total collapse and remake of the American car as basic transportation.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
My parents are in their mid 50's, and my mom drives an Expedition, dad drives a Town Car. They both HATE small cars. They also make well upwards of 6-figures. There are MANY well-to-do boomers who like larger, luxurious vehicles. I believe GM has just released a new BUICK to cater to that market, stating that it is the safest crossover ever produced.... Of course in a segment this infantile in nature, that's hardly a difficult claim to make, but I digress...
Simply because one cannot comprehend various types of vehicles actually SELLING, does not mean they should not look beyond their personal loves and vices to understand who these vehicles are meant to appeal to.
As I said in another thread, I'm going to go look at an Excursion tomorrow. How does that fit into the "big scheme" of things? The status quo is not a constant... What is in vogue right now, may not be next year. GM is not going to drop everything just to make economy cars for the same reason Toyota did not just continue on making economy cars and not try to make large trucks.
It is the (perceived) QUALITY of domestic products that have pushed many buyers to the Japanese brands, not simply the quantity and types of vehicles being produced. And even though that quality issue may very well be null and void now, the consumer will not be so quick to return, since they are being treated right elsewhere. Meanwhile, these companies are bleeding-out, and it truly has been (at least partially) their own undoing......
Simply because one cannot comprehend various types of vehicles actually SELLING, does not mean they should not look beyond their personal loves and vices to understand who these vehicles are meant to appeal to.
As I said in another thread, I'm going to go look at an Excursion tomorrow. How does that fit into the "big scheme" of things? The status quo is not a constant... What is in vogue right now, may not be next year. GM is not going to drop everything just to make economy cars for the same reason Toyota did not just continue on making economy cars and not try to make large trucks.
It is the (perceived) QUALITY of domestic products that have pushed many buyers to the Japanese brands, not simply the quantity and types of vehicles being produced. And even though that quality issue may very well be null and void now, the consumer will not be so quick to return, since they are being treated right elsewhere. Meanwhile, these companies are bleeding-out, and it truly has been (at least partially) their own undoing......
I think what I was saying is in the spirit of the notion- do one thing and do it well. American cars (apparently) have no commonality, sorta blowing in the wind compared to Asian and German cars which have specific design goals and targets (even inasmuch as reputation- to answer the above post).
I'm conflicted about this too. I doubt anyone wants to see American car companies fold; I know I don't. I also don't want to see Japanese, German, or Korean companies fold because it's best for all of us if the industry has a lot of intelligent competition.
That said, I'm not sure any arguments about buying American just to buy American really hold much water. Pretty much all the world's auto manufacturers have demonstrated that they're willing to outsource their manufacturing. My Honda was built in Canada, and many of them are built in Ohio. My friend's Toyota Matrix was built in California, IIRC right alongside its "American" counterpart, the Pontiac Vibe.
Presumably the reason the companies, including our own domestic ones, are building their cars outside their home countries and using globally source parts is because they feel they can gain some value from the process. If American companies (and, again, foreign ones too) find it appropriate to shop globally for value then what's wrong with American consumers doing the same thing?
That said, I'm not sure any arguments about buying American just to buy American really hold much water. Pretty much all the world's auto manufacturers have demonstrated that they're willing to outsource their manufacturing. My Honda was built in Canada, and many of them are built in Ohio. My friend's Toyota Matrix was built in California, IIRC right alongside its "American" counterpart, the Pontiac Vibe.
Presumably the reason the companies, including our own domestic ones, are building their cars outside their home countries and using globally source parts is because they feel they can gain some value from the process. If American companies (and, again, foreign ones too) find it appropriate to shop globally for value then what's wrong with American consumers doing the same thing?
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Ford used to have great commonality. It would blow your mind as to how many parts are interchangable between my Town Car and my '87 GT Mustang.
They have deviated from that a bit as time has gone on, but GM is by far the worst in terms of deviation.... BUT, GM has an absolutely MASSIVE product line; with divisions that are designated as unique brands, and as such, have their own bloody parts. Saturn is a great example. But it has always been that way. Oldsmobile and Buick both had their own engines for the longest time.... And this was never an issue back then.
With the small segment of the car market the Asian manufacturers used to hold, compared to the Big Three, they only offered a few models, so it was very easy to focus on the quality of that product. Toyota is a prime example of what happens to that quality when the company's product line and market share grows.... They experience what it's like to be GM.... and their quality has slid.....
Not a justification of what happened to the American manufactures, but seeing that it has now affected Toyota, it should at least open people's eyes to WHY it happens......
They have deviated from that a bit as time has gone on, but GM is by far the worst in terms of deviation.... BUT, GM has an absolutely MASSIVE product line; with divisions that are designated as unique brands, and as such, have their own bloody parts. Saturn is a great example. But it has always been that way. Oldsmobile and Buick both had their own engines for the longest time.... And this was never an issue back then.
With the small segment of the car market the Asian manufacturers used to hold, compared to the Big Three, they only offered a few models, so it was very easy to focus on the quality of that product. Toyota is a prime example of what happens to that quality when the company's product line and market share grows.... They experience what it's like to be GM.... and their quality has slid.....
Not a justification of what happened to the American manufactures, but seeing that it has now affected Toyota, it should at least open people's eyes to WHY it happens......
I am fortunate to have left Michigan and found work here in Wisconsin.I have as have many others seen what our failing automakers has left behind every small town in Michigan is suffering as the made the parts to assemble American cars.Even if you didn't work in the automotive industry you were and are effected.Here is the sobering truth of our auto industry.http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=121171
Americans haven't made a quality car since 1972.
I always bought Gm until they turned to [censored].
I rarely have repair bills on my Japenese cars.
The auto workers and their benefit package put the auto industry out of business.
So long.
I'll keep my Toyota.
I always bought Gm until they turned to [censored].
I rarely have repair bills on my Japenese cars.
The auto workers and their benefit package put the auto industry out of business.
So long.
I'll keep my Toyota.
Originally Posted By: XCELERATIONRULES
Americans haven't made a quality car since 1972.
C'mon...that's a huge exaggeration. Tell that to my father who owned his 1981 Monte Carlo for 15 years. You had to pry that thing from his hand. That is until he bought a 1995 Thunderbird, which also had to be extracted from him before he finally gave it up.
I have had ZERO problems with my 2006 Fusion. I think it's a great car.
Regardless of where a car is built, Ford and GM still employ 10 times as many workers as the Japanese companies. I'll buy American and have no worries. If you do your research, you can still buy a quality car from an American auto manufacturer.
Americans haven't made a quality car since 1972.
C'mon...that's a huge exaggeration. Tell that to my father who owned his 1981 Monte Carlo for 15 years. You had to pry that thing from his hand. That is until he bought a 1995 Thunderbird, which also had to be extracted from him before he finally gave it up.
I have had ZERO problems with my 2006 Fusion. I think it's a great car.
Regardless of where a car is built, Ford and GM still employ 10 times as many workers as the Japanese companies. I'll buy American and have no worries. If you do your research, you can still buy a quality car from an American auto manufacturer.
Do not many "foreign" car badges now have and have had manufacturing plants in the U.S.?
Two out of the three Toy's in our drvieway were "made" here, in KY, IIRC. Yeah, so all the parts weren't "made" here. Thank God.
I gotta agree with XCELERATIONRULES.
86 LeBaron GTS: couldn't hold an alignment; popped HG under warranty. High's: good brakes, the greatest buckets I ever sat in.
88 Voyager 4 cly. automatic: blew two tranmissions under warranty. Dealership service argumentative and total jerks.
90 Luminia van: Popped steering rack out of warranty for no good reason. Radiator rotted top OOWarranty for no good reason.
Bulletproof drivetrain tho. Noisy mutha.
I could go on with the Fords and other GM's we've had but suffice it to say we have been more than pleased with the lack of unexpected parts failures and with the bulletproof reliability in our "foreign" vehicles. I will never ever go back. They lost me and mine permanently, and I'm sure many many others. Just take a look at the dwindling market shares they've been suffering for decades. Proves it to me.
If any of them go out of business I will be saddened, but they did it to themselves with cheap components, lack of QC, frequent shoddy design and execution, and treating their customers like they were the enemy.
Two out of the three Toy's in our drvieway were "made" here, in KY, IIRC. Yeah, so all the parts weren't "made" here. Thank God.
I gotta agree with XCELERATIONRULES.
86 LeBaron GTS: couldn't hold an alignment; popped HG under warranty. High's: good brakes, the greatest buckets I ever sat in.
88 Voyager 4 cly. automatic: blew two tranmissions under warranty. Dealership service argumentative and total jerks.
90 Luminia van: Popped steering rack out of warranty for no good reason. Radiator rotted top OOWarranty for no good reason.
Bulletproof drivetrain tho. Noisy mutha.
I could go on with the Fords and other GM's we've had but suffice it to say we have been more than pleased with the lack of unexpected parts failures and with the bulletproof reliability in our "foreign" vehicles. I will never ever go back. They lost me and mine permanently, and I'm sure many many others. Just take a look at the dwindling market shares they've been suffering for decades. Proves it to me.
If any of them go out of business I will be saddened, but they did it to themselves with cheap components, lack of QC, frequent shoddy design and execution, and treating their customers like they were the enemy.
- Status
Similar threads
