I think I messed up. How badly?

[JohnG]

I bought a used 2018 (7100 mi) Mercedes Benz recently that has the new I4 Turbo, which some say comes with a gasoline particulate filter. I realize that this more or less requires the use of low SAPS motor oil. However, the operators manual only specifies MB 229.5 and 229.6 approval ratings on page #391. It does not specify an oil weight of any kind.
I also believe that MB should require 229.51 for this engine, which does appear on their website.
I live in Central Florida, so it can get pretty hot here. I run a lot of short trips (spelled fuel dillution), don't put many miles on each year, (3-4000 maybe) and change oil every January, whether it needs it or not!

After searching my local Walmart, Advance, and Orielly's and finding nothing with C1 or C4 rating and no ESP Mobil1, I decided to look online.
I chose Ravenol FDS, in 5W-30 grade which is listed on their website as MB 229.51, 229.6, it is written as a PAO oil that withstands high heat and does not rely on VII's to make its viscosity. It has a listed HTHS of 3.0 @150C a TBN of 10.1, BUT a SAPS level 1.2% weight. I purchased 2 5L jugs from Blauparts. This Oil is A1/B1 A5/B5 and SL/CF.

I believe I should have chosen their VMS grade 5W-30 with an HTHS of 3.51 @150C and a SAPS level of 0.8 %weight.

My question is, will using the FDS in this engine cause any damage using it in this engine for 2 oil changes, until I can get into the VMS .

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by JohnG
I bought a used 2018 (7100 mi) Mercedes Benz recently that has the new I4 Turbo, which some say comes with a gasoline particulate filter. I realize that this more or less requires the use of low SAPS motor oil. However, the operators manual only specifies MB 229.5 and 229.6 approval ratings on page #391. It does not specify an oil weight of any kind.
I also believe that MB should require 229.51 for this engine, which does appear on their website.
I live in Central Florida, so it can get pretty hot here. I run a lot of short trips (spelled fuel dillution), don't put many miles on each year, (3-4000 maybe) and change oil every January, whether it needs it or not!

After searching my local Walmart, Advance, and Orielly's and finding nothing with C1 or C4 rating and no ESP Mobil1, I decided to look online.
I chose Ravenol FDS, in 5W-30 grade which is listed on their website as MB 229.51, 229.6, it is written as a PAO oil that withstands high heat and does not rely on VII's to make its viscosity. It has a listed HTHS of 3.0 @150C a TBN of 10.1, BUT a SAPS level 1.2% weight. I purchased 2 5L jugs from Blauparts. This Oil is A1/B1 A5/B5 and SL/CF.

I believe I should have chosen their VMS grade 5W-30 with an HTHS of 3.51 @150C and a SAPS level of 0.8 %weight.

My question is, will using the FDS in this engine cause any damage using it in this engine for 2 oil changes, until I can get into the VMS .

Can you return it?
That engine as far as I know is not running on lower viscosity oils in any market. Personally, if I did t, I would switch it.

 

[TheLawnRanger]

I would buy from the MB dealer if you have to be that precise.

 

[CarbonSteel]

I have a 2018 C300 with the 2.0L turbocharged gasoline engine and it specifies 229.5 and 229.6, so I am not sure where the 229.51 came from as it applies to diesel engines. My C300 does not have a particulate filter on the exhaust and I thought this was certain 2019 models forward that have it--are you sure it has one? I run Pennzoil Platinum Euro 0W-40 in it (but that has become hard to find--I cleared out several WMs to acquire it). Walmart typically has M1 Euro 0W-40 and Castrol Edge Euro 0W-40 (both in 229.5) and I would consider one of those.

 

[kschachn]

What a mess. What your engine needs is an oil that has the approval required by the manufacturer, grade is irrelevant as is base stock composition. If after verifying that the owner's manual in your possession is the correct one for your vehicle, but you still believe it is listing the incorrect approval, then you should contact a dealer and ask them. The only Mercedes Benz approval Ravenol FDS has is 229.6, if that's not the one specified for your engine then it is not the correct one to use. Ravenol VMS has 229.31, 229.51 and 229.52 approvals. There are other oils that have those approvals as well so there are other options in terms of brands. I'm not sure where you got the approvals listed in your post.

What specific car do you have? I think 2015_PSD above has listed things correctly, if 229.5 is one of the listed approvals then Castrol 0W-40 at Walmart is an excellent choice as is Mobil 1 0W-40 (which is on rebate at the moment).

Originally Posted by JohnG
I bought a used 2018 (7100 mi) Mercedes Benz recently that has the new I4 Turbo, which some say comes with a gasoline particulate filter. I realize that this more or less requires the use of low SAPS motor oil. However, the operators manual only specifies MB 229.5 and 229.6 approval ratings on page #391. It does not specify an oil weight of any kind.
I also believe that MB should require 229.51 for this engine, which does appear on their website.
I live in Central Florida, so it can get pretty hot here. I run a lot of short trips (spelled fuel dillution), don't put many miles on each year, (3-4000 maybe) and change oil every January, whether it needs it or not!

After searching my local Walmart, Advance, and Orielly's and finding nothing with C1 or C4 rating and no ESP Mobil1, I decided to look online.
I chose Ravenol FDS, in 5W-30 grade which is listed on their website as MB 229.51, 229.6, it is written as a PAO oil that withstands high heat and does not rely on VII's to make its viscosity. It has a listed HTHS of 3.0 @150C a TBN of 10.1, BUT a SAPS level 1.2% weight. I purchased 2 5L jugs from Blauparts. This Oil is A1/B1 A5/B5 and SL/CF.

I believe I should have chosen their VMS grade 5W-30 with an HTHS of 3.51 @150C and a SAPS level of 0.8 %weight.

My question is, will using the FDS in this engine cause any damage using it in this engine for 2 oil changes, until I can get into the VMS .

 

[atikovi]

Well, you're under warranty if the engine blows. Would Mercedes know if you used unapproved oil? Do you feel lucky?

 

[benjy]

i rarely follow manufacturers recommendations but for a costly car with a warranty + DIY upkeep using an approved oil + filter + keeping records is a good move IMO. i would join benz forums + look into what others are saying + doing although i am guessing that DIYers are fewer with higher end cars.

 

[Rand]

I would use m1 or pennzoil in a 5w40 or 0w40 that meets your requirements as stated in the manual.

 

[demarpaint]

Mobil 1 ESP 0W-30 and 5W30 fits the bill, if it's a 30 grade oil you're after. In a 0w-40 Mobil 1 ESP also meets the spec. If you're looking online Ebay and Amazon have it.

 

[dave1251]

Your engine will not explode especially with 3-4K OCI's. If you feel better change to a "approved" lube.

 

[Audios]

I agree, youll be fine for a reasonable interval.

 

[dbias]

Pretty certain you dont have a GPF. A couple runs of a high saps oil will not be the end of the world. This oil is for spec 229.6, not the 229.5 you need which the major foul being a HTHS of 3.0 not the 3.5 you need as soeced by 229.5.

Ravenol SSL 0w-40 is 229.5 oil that I've used in my Audi as it meets VW502, Porsche A40 etc.

I noticed that MB229.6 is located all by itself at the top of the oil selector and the rest of the MB spec are further down. Premature eclickulation?

 

[JohnG]

Thanks Guys! I got the GPF idea from somewhere on the BITOG website during a previous search, so hopefully that info was incorrect. Unless MB makes an I4 2.0 L turbo diesel, which I doubt.
Anyway, I've noticed that some of you think this engine requires a heavier weight oil. When the owners manual does not state a weight of any kind, only the MB specs 229.5 which this oil meets, how do you know that a 5W-40 is required?
And after all, is there a huge difference between HTHS 3.0 and 3.5 @ 150C?
Yes, I went with the 5W-30 to see what kind of fuel economy a 2.0 liter turbo might be capable of, and that's why I chose the 3.0 HTHS. I think Ravenol also makes 5W-30 oils with an HTHS of 3.5 @ 150C, so these numbers seem to be getting less and less relevant.

Would any of you like to venture a guess as to what MB spec 229.52 is? I know it's a low SAPS oil, but unsure if it is spec'd for gasoline or diesel engines.

Thanks again. I'll run this for a year to see how it does. If anything strange turns up I'll let you know. And change the oil immediately!

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted by JohnG
Anyway, I've noticed that some of you think this engine requires a heavier weight oil. When the owners manual does not state a weight of any kind, only the MB specs 229.5 which this oil meets, how do you know that a 5W-40 is required?
And after all, is there a huge difference between HTHS 3.0 and 3.5 @ 150C?
Yes, I went with the 5W-30 to see what kind of fuel economy a 2.0 liter turbo might be capable of, and that's why I chose the 3.0 HTHS. I think Ravenol also makes 5W-30 oils with an HTHS of 3.5 @ 150C, so these numbers seem to be getting less and less relevant.

What your engine requires is the proper approved oil, weight (or more accurately grade) is irrelevant. The Mercedes-Benz approval will dictate the minimum HTHS which can possilby be met under two or more different grades. However, since the HTHS must be a minimum there will be minimal differences between those grades and will not yield any measurable fuel economy difference. 5W-40, 5W-30 nor 0W-40 is required, only the approval.

 

[Rollins]

Originally Posted by JohnG
Thanks Guys! I got the GPF idea from somewhere on the BITOG website during a previous search, so hopefully that info was incorrect. Unless MB makes an I4 2.0 L turbo diesel, which I doubt.

They do.

Originally Posted by JohnG
Anyway, I've noticed that some of you think this engine requires a heavier weight oil. When the owners manual does not state a weight of any kind, only the MB specs 229.5 which this oil meets, how do you know that a 5W-40 is required?

If the manufacturer had some special considerations they'd put a remark like "2.) Restriction: Only SAE 0W-40 und SAE 5W-40 engine oils are allowed !

Check the recommended spec for you engine here:
https://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/d/d/en/Spec_223_2.pdf


Originally Posted by JohnG
And after all, is there a huge difference between HTHS 3.0 and 3.5 @ 150C?

In terms of engine protection @ certain regimes-yes. In terms of appreciable fuel economy in your engine-highly doubtful.



Originally Posted by JohnG
Would any of you like to venture a guess as to what MB spec 229.52 is? I know it's a low SAPS oil, but unsure if it is spec'd for gasoline or diesel engines.

page 193-
https://www.aftonchemical.com/Afton/media/PdfFiles/Afton-Chemical-Spec-Handbook-September-2019.pdf

What's your engine type?

 

[DuckRyder]

Originally Posted by JohnG
...
Anyway, I've noticed that some of you think this engine requires a heavier weight oil. When the owners manual does not state a weight of any kind, only the MB specs 229.5 which this oil meets, how do you know that a 5W-40 is required?
...


According to Ravenol.de

That oil carriers only the following approvals.

Quote
Approvals
MB-Approval 229.6, RENAULT RN0700, FORD WSS-M2C913-D (fulfils 913-A/-B/-C), JAGUAR LAND ROVER STJLR.03.5003


RAVENOL FDS SAE 5W-30

You still haven't told us exactly what car we are talking about.

 

[edyvw]

Quote
Thanks Guys! I got the GPF idea from somewhere on the BITOG website during a previous search, so hopefully that info was incorrect. Unless MB makes an I4 2.0 L turbo diesel, which I doubt.

MB is not known as particularly great manufacturer of gasoline I-4 2.0. However, they are well known as great manufacturer of 2.0 I-4 diesel engines.

Quote
Anyway, I've noticed that some of you think this engine requires a heavier weight oil. When the owners manual does not state a weight of any kind, only the MB specs 229.5 which this oil meets, how do you know that a 5W-40 is required?

Reason why we are saying to use heavier oil, and the one meets MB 229.5 or MB 229.51 is that minimum HTHS has to be 3.5cp. That HTHS can be achieved only buy heavy W30 and heavier grades. Usually MB 229.5 and MB 229.51 are o/5W30 or 0/5W40 oils. In the end, you want MB 22.9 (though MB 229.51 could do).
In Wal Mart you have two great oils that you can get:
Castrol 0W40 (my preference)
Mobil1 0W40 FS

Quote
And after all, is there a huge difference between HTHS 3.0 and 3.5 @ 150C?

YES! It is actually big difference especially in vehicle with forced induction (turbo). I use in Toyota Sienna Mobil1 5W30 Ep that has HTHS of 3.0cp. I ues in wife's Tiguan Castrol 0W40. Trust me, that Mobil1 is not going to find its way into Tiguan.
Quote
Yes, I went with the 5W-30 to see what kind of fuel economy a 2.0 liter turbo might be capable of, and that's why I chose the 3.0 HTHS. I think Ravenol also makes 5W-30 oils with an HTHS of 3.5 @ 150C, so these numbers seem to be getting less and less relevant.

Minimal difference.

Quote
Would any of you like to venture a guess as to what MB spec 229.52 is? I know it's a low SAPS oil, but unsure if it is spec'd for gasoline or diesel engines.

Thanks again. I'll run this for a year to see how it does. If anything strange turns up I'll let you know. And change the oil immediately!

Forget difference between MB 229.5, MB 229.51 and MB 229.52. US has no low sulfur gas. The reason why MB 229.51 and MB 229.52 are designated as "diesel" specs. on US market is that US market had gasoline which much higher levels of sulfur than in diesel fuel. Sulfur is basically what will deplete additives very fast, and if you have low starting SAPS, than oil will run out of additives fast, and problems start. However, since 01/2017, US moved to ULSG, so basically you can use MB 229.51 or MB 229.52 in your car too. Two good oils you can find in Wal mart: Pennzoil Euro L 5W30 with MB 229.51 and Valvoline 5W40 MST.
As for performance difference between MB 229.5 on one side and MB 229.51 and .52 on another, it is only SAPS, deposit control, HTHS, oxidation is actually very similar.

 

[Wolf359]

If you want to spend extra money, you can try for the exotic oils, but in the MB forums and on here, lots of people run Mobil 1 0w40 and Castrol 0w40 all the time and it's a fine oil with good longevity. Mobil is what the dealer/Mercedes uses and what they sell although it's a slightly different blend than what you find on the shelves at Walmart. They have a $12 rebate now on up to four 5 quart jugs and Walmart has it for $21.38 now so it's hard to beat. They had it down to $19.99 when they were up against prime.

Basically you're overthinking it. Read the other threads here. Mobil 1 0w40 will be fine for your needs. I either do Castrol 0w40 or Mobil 1 0w40 in both my E-350's, use whichever is on sale.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by Wolf359
If you want to spend extra money, you can try for the exotic oils, but in the MB forums and on here, lots of people run Mobil 1 0w40 and Castrol 0w40 all the time and it's a fine oil with good longevity. Mobil is what the dealer/Mercedes uses and what they sell although it's a slightly different blend than what you find on the shelves at Walmart. They have a $12 rebate now on up to four 5 quart jugs and Walmart has it for $21.38 now so it's hard to beat. They had it down to $19.99 when they were up against prime.

Basically you're overthinking it. Read the other threads here. Mobil 1 0w40 will be fine for your needs. I either do Castrol 0w40 or Mobil 1 0w40 in both my E-350's, use whichever is on sale.

MB more or less switched to Petronas. Though, it could be that dealers are using Mobil1 still.

 

[JohnG]

"You still haven't told us exactly what car we are talking about."

Yeah, tried to put it in my profile, hoping it would show up here, but no dice.
This is a 2018 E300 Lux3.

So, since this oil meets 229.6 and that is listed in my owners manual, no issues at all. I was worried about the 1.2 %weight SAPS level, but apparently, no problem there either.

Thanks,
John