How long will an Engine Last with Mobil 1?

[Flimflam]

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Originally posted by Gene K:
You are not the only weird person on this site.

A 2000 BMW 750iL was a $93,000 car. A clean 65,000 mi example can currently be bought for $25,000.

1. In most cases used cars are a much better value.

2. Never Finance A Depreciating Asset!

Gene

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Re: "used cars....a better value...." Depends which State and even which Neighborhood you live in. Some places, you can not find an honest person for miles.

I used to live and work in one certain city, when I needed a cheap used car, every potential seller I met up with was a crook who wanted to sell me something totally unreliable and completely unsound. I eventually setled on an old beater for $2,500. Figured I could afford to leave it by the highway and just walk away if it became difficult.

But in Louisiana, Alabama, I have never heard of a car buyer being ripped off. I am sure it happens sometimes, but just not as often as some other places.

 

[Flimflam]

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Originally posted by gerhardb:

Originally posted by ekpolk:
I have a Prelude with an H22A4 that recently under went sometop half engine wear.

The mechanic, one of the best specialist you can get, indicated that the top half and the oil pan were perfectly clean and free of slude.

At 120,000 miles that's not a bad endorsement of synthetic products. The engine has mostly had Mobil 1......

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Top end engine wear......that, and leaking seals/gaskets, is my biggest beef with Synthetic Oil.

Back in 1983, I observed people who used Synthetic Oil end up with wrecked valve trains.....meaning ground-down camshaft, worn out cam followers, rocker arms, etc.

Today, this problem with Synthetic Oil and valve trains is confirmed by UOA numbers. Higher Iron(Fe) than Conventional Oil used oil analysis.

If I were you, I'd use Shaeffer Supreme. The best of both worlds. The high-temperature stability of Synthetic, plus the low wear numbers of the best Conventionals.

As a footnote, the Million Miles claims, 200,000 mile claims, are completely irrelevant. Go to any Limo Service and ask. Lincoln Town Cars are expected to go 300,000 miles on the cheapest available bulk Conventional Oil. Many have done 1,000,000 miles without batting a headlight cover.

 

[Patman]

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Originally posted by Flimflam:

Back in 1983, I observed people who used Synthetic Oil end up with wrecked valve trains.....meaning ground-down camshaft, worn out cam followers, rocker arms, etc.

Today, this problem with Synthetic Oil and valve trains is confirmed by used oil analysis numbers. Higher Iron(Fe) than Conventional Oil used oil analysis.

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I challenge you to find a used oil analysis from an LS1 powered vehicle running conventional oil that is anywhere near as good as my recent one posted from my 98 Corvette using Syntec 0w30. Iron was good too, at only 8ppm in 5000 miles.

Conventional oils are showing good used oil analysis over the last few years for sure, but I highly doubt you can make a blanket statement that you'll see lower iron compared to synthetic. Equal amounts in some cases perhaps, but not lower.

 

[Flimflam]

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Originally posted by Patman:


[/qb]

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I challenge you to find a used oil analysis from an LS1 powered vehicle running conventional oil that is anywhere near as good as my recent one posted from my 98 Corvette using Syntec 0w30. Iron was good too, at only 8ppm in 5000 miles.

Conventional oils are showing good used oil analysis over the last few years for sure, but I highly doubt you can make a blanket statement that you'll see lower iron compared to synthetic. Equal amounts in some cases perhaps, but not lower. [/QB][/QUOTE]


When I blasted Synthetics, I did not mean Castrol Syntec GC 0w-30, which in any case is hardly a universally-available, off-the-shelf item you can get at any Gas station like Valvoline or Castrol GTX. It is more of a Cult product.

Most of my negativity was directed at the stuff that comes in flimsy silver bottles, with the fragile, leaky cap.

I've had 4's and 5's in my mineral used oil analysis for Fe (ppm). Most of the Synthetic used oil analysis that I've seen show far greater Fe content than 4's and 5's, often double, and sometimes triple or more.

Now, you are probably going to copy and paste some Syn Oil used oil analysis that shows maybe 0 or 1 for Fe, but I claim that is not typical for Syn Oil. However, 2's, 3's, 4's for Fe, that's fairly common for users of good Conventional Oil.

 

[Patman]

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When I blasted Synthetics, I did not mean Castrol Syntec GC 0w-30, which in any case is hardly a universally-available, off-the-shelf item you can get at any Gas station like Valvoline or Castrol GTX. It is more of a Cult product.
Most of my negativity was directed at the stuff that comes in flimsy silver bottles, with the fragile, leaky cap.
I've had 4's and 5's in my mineral used oil analysis for Fe (ppm). Most of the Synthetic used oil analysis that I've seen show far greater Fe content than 4's and 5's, often double, and sometimes triple or more.

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I won't disagree with you if you're comment is based on Mobil 1 then (which I'm assuming it is), as we definitely have seen more iron in used oil analysis with that oil compared to others. Not in all cases mind you, but yes it is a bit of a trend. But your statement just mentioned synthetics in general, not any one particular oil.

We still don't know if Mobil 1s sometimes higher iron content is actual engine wear though, or perhaps some sort of chemical reaction going on.

 

[TC]

This is sorta related to the topic at hand (engine longevity and durability)...mostly not...but still impressively cool nonetheless.

62,000 MILES AT 132+ MPH!
In October 1986, three stock Saab 9000s established 21 endurance records at Talladega Motor Speedway in Alabama. Three Saab 9000 Turbos circled the high-banked tri-oval continuously for 20 days and nights, at speeds in excess of 140 mph. A new 100,000 kilometer (62,000 mile) speed record at over 132 mph was accomplished. Not too shabby, especially while using 1986 vintage lubes. (I wish this could explain why my sister's '96 Saab 9000 Turbo was so problematic -- although the engine was faultless -- while my '94 BMW 325 was faultless until about 120K miles.)

[ October 25, 2004, 04:53 PM: Message edited by: TC ]

 

[drm7]

Cary, it's funny you say that. I heard a 750 drive by today and it coughed and sputtered like it was running on half of the cylinders. I figured neglect but maybe it's junk from the start.

What makes them so bad? What kind of problems do they have?

Sorry for the

 

[Dr. T]

I disagree. Like any car there are good examples and bad examples. There are 750's with 300k mi. and those that are shot after 75k.

As a general rule of thumb, the more expensive the car, the more expensive the maintenance and the more expensive the parts. More expensive cars have a greater number of parts and the intricacy of these parts is greater. The more expensive the maintenance, the less of it is performed....especially after the warranty period...and after the lease period. The maintenance is generally concurrent with the cost of the vehicle and the condition of the vehicle represents who it's owners are/were.

 

[Cary]

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Originally posted by drm7:
Cary, it's funny you say that. I heard a 750 drive by today and it coughed and sputtered like it was running on half of the cylinders. I figured neglect but maybe it's junk from the start.

What makes them so bad? What kind of problems do they have?

Sorry for the

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I'll disagree here with Dr. T as I have never heard of a reliable 750il, as much as a BMW fan as I am (owned 4 between my wife and I, her mom currently drives a 735il I work on and her sister has a 525i).

The great discription I heard about the 750il one time was it was a car with 350 pounds of wire. Problems start with things like intake gasket failures ($2000) to failed electrically controled shocks $750 for the part. In part the problem is the cars have problems, in part they were so low production that parts are horribly expensive. Do a search on 750il problems to get more info than you ever wanted.

As my mechanic says, if you want a BMW, get a six cylinder. They don't have the cylinder wall failures, oil pump bolts backing out, and cooling system issues the V-8 engines have.

 

[High Plains Drifter]

mf150

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have a 97 4.6L F-150 (Ford) that's been on Mobil 1 10W30 for over 225,000 miles

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Is this one of the engines backdated to run 5w-20?

 

[High Plains Drifter]

flimflam

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Back in 1983, I observed people who used Synthetic Oil end up with wrecked valve trains.....meaning ground-down camshaft, worn out cam followers, rocker arms, etc.

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Where those camshafts in GMC products? If so that was'nt the oils fault. Gm had bad cams in 82.

 

[seotaji]

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Cary, it's funny you say that. I heard a 750 drive by today and it coughed and sputtered like it was running on half of the cylinders. I figured neglect but maybe it's junk from the start. [I dont know] What makes them so bad? What kind of problems do they have?

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They were 12 cylinder engines which took a very rich person to afford maint. It was junk from the start.

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As my mechanic says, if you want a BMW, get a six cylinder. They don't have the cylinder wall failures, oil pump bolts backing out, and cooling system issues the V-8 engines have.

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Incorrect, the 3 and 3.2L 6 cylinders have that problem too. Unless it has safety wire running through the nut, which is a custom mod.

 

[Cary]

Are you talking about the old M30 Big six and the banjo bolts backing out, or the new M50/M52/M54 series?

Thanks

Cary

 

[haley10]

[/QUOTE]I won't disagree with you if you're comment is based on Mobil 1 then (which I'm assuming it is), as we definitely have seen more iron in used oil analysis with that oil compared to others. Not in all cases mind you, but yes it is a bit of a trend. But your statement just mentioned synthetics in general, not any one particular oil.

We still don't know if Mobil 1s sometimes higher iron content is actual engine wear though, or perhaps some sort of chemical reaction going on. [/QB][/QUOTE]


I wish we knew the answer to this, but I don't think it's going to happen. I got only 9ppm iron in mild Winter with M1 @ 5100 mi.

Since I have a cast iron block GM 3800 V6, you would think if it is all a reaction that the iron would be much higher.

 

[Cary]

quote:

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Originally posted by Gene K:

A 2000 BMW 750iL was a $93,000 car. A clean 65,000 mi example can currently be bought for $25,000.

Gene

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There is a reason you can purchase a 750il dirt cheap. They are so problematic, they make an old Jaguar look like a reliable vehicle. Figure about $10,000 a year to keep a 750il on the road.

A much better deal is a used BMW 528i From the same year. About $18,000 and you can figure about $1000 per year in maintence to keep it on the road.

 

[Dr. T]

Cary, you simply just brought it back down to dollars and cents. If one had the cash to R&R every part that was req'd, the car would be pristine after 300k.

Remember 80's and 90's Ferrari's? The Testa req'd a timing belt every 10k...and the engine needed removal for the job.

Gotta remember, these cars ain't for everyone...and they ain't a kitchen appliance either. My daily driver 1994 V-12 BMW 850 has a reliable 200k mi. as we speak. I'll let you know when I top 500k.

Also...all early models of every car manuf. have defects/shortfalls. Even the new 7 series...in 2000 they were being flatbedded into the dealers every day of the week...Never buy the first year out!

 

[seotaji]

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Are you talking about the old M30 Big six and the banjo bolts backing out, or the new M50/M52/M54 series?

Thanks

Cary

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the new series. bmwNA doesn't want to hear about it either, unless you are going to pay them $300-600 to deal with it.

 

[Flimflam]

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Originally posted by Patman:

The problem probably wasn't the fact that the oil was synthetic, but it might've been due to the fact that it was the wrong viscosity! 15w50 is too thick for most engines, even in hot climates.

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I beg to differ, Patman. The shop involved in the above case (cases?) of top end/valve train wreckage used Castrol conventional 20w50 as standard, and they would sometimes go to Castrol dino Straight 30 and Straight 40 if conditions required it.

In maintaining and repairing Japanese engines, they never had to fix a valve train until some smart-a** customers decided to go Synthetic.

 

[Flimflam]

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Originally posted by High Plains Drifter:
flimflam

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Back in 1983, I observed people who used Synthetic Oil end up with wrecked valve trains.....meaning ground-down camshaft, worn out cam followers, rocker arms, etc.

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Where those camshafts in GMC products? If so that was'nt the oils fault. Gm had bad cams in 82.

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High plains, they were Honda's used in an area with very hot climate year round. I believe the Synthetic Oil used was a 15w-50.

Definitely not a case of [auto] manufacturer's fault. The mechanics who had to clean up the mess said that maybe the Syn Oil was too thin, so the oil pump could not get a grip on it to move it up to the Top End. They added that it was the first & only time they'd seen any kind of Top End wear problem with this brand of Automobile.

 

[Patman]

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Originally posted by Flimflam:

quote:

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Originally posted by High Plains Drifter:
flimflam

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Back in 1983, I observed people who used Synthetic Oil end up with wrecked valve trains.....meaning ground-down camshaft, worn out cam followers, rocker arms, etc.

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Where those camshafts in GMC products? If so that was'nt the oils fault. Gm had bad cams in 82.

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High plains, they were Honda's used in an area with very hot climate year round. I believe the Synthetic Oil used was a 15w-50.

Definitely not a case of [auto] manufacturer's fault. The mechanics who had to clean up the mess said that maybe the Syn Oil was too thin, so the oil pump could not get a grip on it to move it up to the Top End. They added that it was the first & only time they'd seen any kind of Top End wear problem with this brand of Automobile.

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The problem probably wasn't the fact that the oil was synthetic, but it might've been due to the fact that it was the wrong viscosity! 15w50 is too thick for most engines, even in hot climates.