I’ve owned a total of 4 Altimas,,never had the pre cat issue and did get a cvt replaced under extended warranty, probably because I knew nothing about cvt maintenance. My 09 has 200k on it and my daughter drives it 130 miles round trip per day to the hospital she works at. Before she got ahold of it, I’d have driven that car cross country and never batted an eye. Minus the early pre cat issues, the 2.5 has proven to be one of the most reliable engines produced. People who bash Nissans, don’t like Nissans, or had a bad experience, which I get. I had a Chevy impala and a Chrysler T&C and they were both catastrophic money pits. More so the Chevy but the mini van wasn’t far behind. I’ve driven plenty of Toyotas and Hondas for rentals at work and I’d gladly take a Nissan over either. The Camry annd accord are two of the most boring cars I’ve ever driven, but that doesn’t make them bad. Are they perfect? Nope, but they’re far from garbage and you get a lot of car for your money.
Honda and Nissan to Merge?
- Thread starter Danh
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I’ve owned a total of 4 Altimas,,never had the pre cat issue and did get a cvt replaced under extended warranty, probably because I knew nothing about cvt maintenance. My 09 has 200k on it and my daughter drives it 130 miles round trip per day to the hospital she works at. Before she got ahold of it, I’d have driven that car cross country and never batted an eye. Minus the early pre cat issues, the 2.5 has proven to be one of the most reliable engines produced. People who bash Nissans, don’t like Nissans, or had a bad experience, which I get. I had a Chevy impala and a Chrysler T&C and they were both catastrophic money pits. More so the Chevy but the mini van wasn’t far behind. I’ve driven plenty of Toyotas and Hondas for rentals at work and I’d gladly take a Nissan over either. The Camry annd accord are two of the most boring cars I’ve ever driven, but that doesn’t make them bad. Are they perfect? Nope, but they’re far from garbage and you get a lot of car for your money.
Mine left me stranded multiple times. Cam and Crank sensors got me more than once.
Knock on wood, but the only one that’s left me stranded was my wife’s 24 Altima at the airport with a completely shot battery. That’s a JC issue more than a Nissan issue though. Couldn’t have happened at a worse time. 15 degrees in a 6 story garage and no jump pack.
JHZR2
Staff member
No comment on the turbos (euro turbos dilute too, and we’ve seen some high mileage Honda turbo engines now, so dilution may be moot). As an owner and performer of the TB service, it’s really quite easy, and allowed replacement of coolant and other things that were due as well.
I suspect neither of the above posts would even know how to measure for, let alone offset timing chain wear, which is a real thing, and affects engine operations too.
Agree with both. This is just silly and not even really relevant. And after nearly a decade and 100k, the tv I pulled off looked brand new, and all systems clean and bright, so….
Honda and Nissan merging could have done a few things - allowed a removal of competitive product (Infiniti or Acura), gotten Honda a truck unit and/or a lower market or EV business unit (Nissan).
The skyline and z lines would be interesting, but the trucks would have been the biggest benefit for Honda. And the Nissan trucks are some of the more handsome trucks on the road currently. The frontier especially.
The point made in previous posts was about Honda vs. Nissan vehicles. Last I checked Nissan vehicles don’t have oil diluting turbos nor the inconvenience of having to do timing belts. Is either a strike against Honda? Not really. Would the timing belt stop me from buying a Honda or another vehicle so equipped? It won’t, I’ve done my fair share of timing belts. If timing chains were such an evil as some make it out here, then most OEMs wouldn’t be manufacturing vehicles with them.
Pointless to bring in Euro turbos as a data point when the discussion was solely Honda vs. Nissan.
Very presumptuous to make assumptions about other folks’ skills set. I’ve only ever had to measure the timing chain stretch on 1 vehicle I had and it was at over 300k miles while I was doing a valve adjustment. Never needed to do timing chain stretch measurements or replacement on any of my other vehicles even past 200k miles. That’s 2 TB intervals - especially the 2nd one when the vehicle’s value has depreciated significantly. For the average consumer without mechanical skills, that’s a decent amount of money to pay a shop at a relatively low $ value point of the vehicle’s life.
The point of my previous post was the carte blanche bashing of all Nissan products and the simultaneous justification of all things Honda that gets posted here in asinine. Every large company, automotive or otherwise, including Nissan and Honda make good and bad products over a long enough time intervals. It’s just the law of averages.
Honda has had some real issues lately-
- In January 2025, Honda recalled nearly 295,000 vehicles due to a software error in the fuel injection electronic control unit (FI-ECU). This error could cause the engine to stall or lose power, which could increase the risk of a crash or injury. The recall affected the following vehicles:
- 2022-2025 Acura MDX Type-S
- 2023-2025 Honda Pilot
- 2021-2025 Acura TLX Type-S
- 2022-2025 Acura MDX Type-S
- Honda updated the FI-ECU software for all affected vehicles at no cost.
- In October 2024, Honda announced a recall for 1.7 million vehicles due to a steering defect. The recall was caused by a faulty worm wheel that could swell during use, making the vehicle harder to control.
- In January 2025, Honda recalled nearly 295,000 vehicles due to a software error in the fuel injection electronic control unit (FI-ECU). This error could cause the engine to stall or lose power, which could increase the risk of a crash or injury. The recall affected the following vehicles:
Changing copper plugs every 10K miles is pretty easy if there accessible too, but no one uses them because there antiquated. Belts limit the amount of valve spring force you can use, and require bigger sprockets, hindering design. Honda is the only serious OEM still using a belt because there technically limiting. I didn't say it was hard or not hard to change.
I didn't even get into VVT rattle/ locking failure when Honda does try to use a chain. Honda also had their own CVT problems. But Honda can do no wrong around here I guess so I won't bother.
You seem you lack technical knowledge on how chains even work. Chain stretch is designed in. The curvature and depth of the sprocket teeth are designed to hold the chain while it stretches. The sprockets still drive in unison. The only reason to check the stretch of a chain would be fear the chain would jump. You won't be able to measure stretch of the chain itself with an instrument. On my VQ's I could pop a cover and measure the extension of the tensioner, but there is no need. Most cars go to the bone yard with the factory chains working fine even after questionable oil maintenance.
If your referring to offsetting timing chain wear on your ancient Mercedes - you don't need to adjust for it on a modern engine - the cam and crank sensors and ECU do so in real time - if it were actually needed which it likely isn't. commercial diesels that used mechanical diesel pumps were driven by a gear directly off the flywheel to directly avoid this issue. Maybe Mercedes just designed it wrong?
Either way Nissan is better off if someone other than Honda merges / invests with them. The primary reason is that Renault wants out - its not share dilution. Foxconn has lots more money. Maybe they want in still? It was purely the Japanese government that wanted this. I wouldn't be surprised if Honda is admonished and told to go back and beg. Either way, Nissan has been profitable over the last few quarters, and there profit per vehicle has been increasing steadily. Honda sales have been cratering globally also - so I restate - pot calling kettle.
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Can’t possibly be true, Honda is perfect. The J35 is the best engine ever made
All kidding aside, people here forget that there are several VQs and VKs (possibly after the manifold replacement) running around with 300k+ miles, without needing the timing chain to be replaced.There are a few folks with VKs over 400k-500k miles still chugging along on the original engine/tranny combo. But nah, that’s not possible - it’s a Nissan!
Most manufacturers seem to be struggling these days.
We sold my wife’s 07 murano to a local whose son drove it to university of Louisville for 3 yrs. Last I knew it had 300k on it with the original cvt…and zero rust. I changed the oil every 4K and never serviced the cvt until 100k. The entire time we owned it I replaced the plugs and had one of the rear coils go bad, so changed them all out since it was such a pain.
EPA and everyone wanting their cars to be rolling super computers. Show me a 1980s southern prelude and I’ll show you a great Honda.
'In my experience' (linked below*) you're one of the lucky ones! In short, I owned a very well maintained 03 Altima 2.5L with relatively low miles. Precat failed and destroyed the engine. I was conned by Nissan and felon fugitive from justice Ghosn. One member a while back said I hold grudge against Nissan. As it was my hard-earned money they stole, if still being angry about it means holding grudge, so be it and darn right.
As for the merger now being called off, my thought, Great! Let Nissan sink or swim on their own now.
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Agreed. My 02 (3.5 v6 - manual) and 05 (4 cyl - auto) both left me stranded. The 05 left me stranded multiple times.
The 02 had clutch issues from new, including making weird chirping sounds. It was eventually replaced under warranty. The 05 had the cam/crank sensor no starts, and one time died on the interstate, and then had transmission issues (no forward movement).
JHZR2
Staff member
If you look back at my history over the last 20(!) years, I’ve been pretty critical of Honda/Acura myself. Nobody was more surprised than me when we ended up buying two of their vehicles. I know nothing of their recent sales levels. Not a concern or consideration to me.Changing copper plugs every 10K miles is pretty easy if there accessible too, but no one uses them because there antiquated. Belts limit the amount of valve spring force you can use, and require bigger sprockets, hindering design. Honda is the only serious OEM still using a belt because there technically limiting. I didn't say it was hard or not hard to change.
I didn't even get into VVT rattle/ locking failure when Honda does try to use a chain. Honda also had their own CVT problems. But Honda can do no wrong around here I guess so I won't bother.
You seem you lack technical knowledge on how chains even work. Chain stretch is designed in. The curvature and depth of the sprocket teeth are designed to hold the chain while it stretches. The sprockets still drive in unison. The only reason to check the stretch of a chain would be fear the chain would jump. You won't be able to measure stretch of the chain itself with an instrument. On my VQ's I could pop a cover and measure the extension of the tensioner, but there is no need. Most cars go to the bone yard with the factory chains working fine even after questionable oil maintenance.
If your referring to offsetting timing chain wear on your ancient Mercedes - you don't need to adjust for it on a modern engine - the cam and crank sensors and ECU do so in real time - if it were actually needed which it likely isn't. commercial diesels that used mechanical diesel pumps were driven by a gear directly off the flywheel to directly avoid this issue. Maybe Mercedes just designed it wrong?
Either way Nissan is better off if someone other than Honda merges / invests with them. The primary reason is that Renault wants out - its not share dilution. Foxconn has lots more money. Maybe they want in still? It was purely the Japanese government that wanted this. I wouldn't be surprised if Honda is admonished and told to go back and beg. Either way, Nissan has been profitable over the last few quarters, and there profit per vehicle has been increasing steadily. Honda sales have been cratering globally also - so I restate - pot calling kettle.
I don’t need an explanation of how chains work, thanks. Point is that they do wear, they are not infallible, they can have issues, they do need replacement in some cases, and so it’s just the age old belt vs chain conversation. Even if the engine controls are compensating, point is, they’re compensating. Whether it’s a control signal or woodruff key on an “ancient” engine (that are some of the longest lived and most reliable automotive engines out in the wild, the world over), the outcome is the same. Compensation for an item going through its lifecycle. Point is that many folks have never even seen their timing chain, and will profess “superiority” just because of parroting.
Regarding Nissan and the actual topic, regardless of how they have done the past quarters, they obviously have things that are good in their value proposition, and they have systemic issues. Honda as far as I know is still the largest engine manufacturer worldwide. Maybe that has been ceded to the Chinese or something, but they are doing something right over the long run. And they’re meeting a consumer value proposition despite baggage associated with ATs and timing belts. Nissan doesn’t seem to be faring as well. But they bring certain value streams and products to the table.
The rationale for merging or not, and rejection… that’s business as usual in businesses negotiating and planning. It’s not because Honda has a timing belt or fan base.
JHZR2
Staff member
The point of oil dilution and turbos is relevant to euro and others. It’s a systemic issue, not just one vendor. Some do manage it better than others, or include older tech to compensate/manage some of the issues. That’s engineering, there are always trades and decisions to be made.
I do agree that blindly stating anything, be it tb vs chain, Nissan being lousy, Honda being great, etc. is indeed asinine. And every vendor makes good products and poor ones.
'In my experience' (linked below*) you're one of the lucky ones! In short, I owned a very well maintained 03 Altima 2.5L with relatively low miles. Precat failed and destroyed the engine. I was conned by Nissan and felon fugitive from justice Ghosn. One member a while back said I hold grudge against Nissan. As it was my hard-earned money they stole, if still being angry about it means holding grudge, so be it and darn right.
As for the merger now being called off, my thought, Great! Let Nissan sink or swim on their own now.
I get it and know where you’re coming from. I had a similar issue with GM and wouldn’t own one if I won it in a raffle. Getting stung once when you work hard etches a permanent spot in the memory. I had an 03 Altima and honestly never even knew of the pre cat issue (at 1st) because my car didn’t use a drop of oil. How I have no idea.
You might want to lay off the personal criticism of another member.Changing copper plugs every 10K miles is pretty easy if there accessible too, but no one uses them because there antiquated. Belts limit the amount of valve spring force you can use, and require bigger sprockets, hindering design. Honda is the only serious OEM still using a belt because there technically limiting. I didn't say it was hard or not hard to change.
I didn't even get into VVT rattle/ locking failure when Honda does try to use a chain. Honda also had their own CVT problems. But Honda can do no wrong around here I guess so I won't bother.
You seem you lack technical knowledge on how chains even work. Chain stretch is designed in. The curvature and depth of the sprocket teeth are designed to hold the chain while it stretches. The sprockets still drive in unison. The only reason to check the stretch of a chain would be fear the chain would jump. You won't be able to measure stretch of the chain itself with an instrument. On my VQ's I could pop a cover and measure the extension of the tensioner, but there is no need. Most cars go to the bone yard with the factory chains working fine even after questionable oil maintenance.
If your referring to offsetting timing chain wear on your ancient Mercedes - you don't need to adjust for it on a modern engine - the cam and crank sensors and ECU do so in real time - if it were actually needed which it likely isn't. commercial diesels that used mechanical diesel pumps were driven by a gear directly off the flywheel to directly avoid this issue. Maybe Mercedes just designed it wrong?
Either way Nissan is better off if someone other than Honda merges / invests with them. The primary reason is that Renault wants out - its not share dilution. Foxconn has lots more money. Maybe they want in still? It was purely the Japanese government that wanted this. I wouldn't be surprised if Honda is admonished and told to go back and beg. Either way, Nissan has been profitable over the last few quarters, and there profit per vehicle has been increasing steadily. Honda sales have been cratering globally also - so I restate - pot calling kettle.
He does, in fact, have the technical knowledge of how chains work, and a great deal of technical knowledge in other areas, as well.
When your* post has dozens of spelling and grammatical errors, you’re* living in a glass house, and throwing stones.
*You’re is a contraction of you are. Your is the possessive form of the pronoun, you. Might want to brush up on that as a starting point.
I agree. Point being that someone decided to bash Nissan vs Honda technically in a thread about mergers and acquisitions and you decided to wade in, and not simply technically but try to assert who or who doesn't know about chain stretch and how to measure it.
No OEM is infallible. Nissan certainly has their share of failures. However I have pointed out several times above where Nissan still outperforms Honda - in emerging markets especially. Emerging markets are growing and western markets are not. Honda makes everything from lawn mowers to Airplane engines. Nissan is more focused. Comparing the two is a fools errand. Nissan likely brings more value to someone like Foxconn who is not in the auto business currently, than it does Honda. The Honda marriage was an attempt at arrangement by an insular Japanese government. I personally prefer Nissan not to become Honda. I have no say either.
Anyway, possibly you should upgrade your Mercedes fuel pump to a belt for better performance? Sorry, couldn't resist.
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Yet this was acceptable?
Yes glass houses.
No my English grammar is not very good. Not my area of expertise.
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