Honda 6th gen A/T fluid experiments.

[D_Ville_TX]

I am the owner of a 2002 Honda Accord V6 with Automatic transmission. Car was purchased with 85K miles and transmission was working perfect at time of purchase. All fluids changed after purchase, and transmission fluid was changed with ATF-Z1 through a cooler-line dump, 2 quarts at a time for a total of 8 quarts.
At 93K miles, it started to shift hard and shift points got unpredictable and often delayed. I added a bottle of Lubegard red and inline Magnefine filter, and shift points returned to somewhat normal, but shifting was still too harsh.
This is a 6th gen transmission so I expected a failure soon, and decided to play around with different fluids. Most fluids I tested did NOT work better than ATF-Z1, until I got this combination.

Currently using 67% Valvoline ATF+4 and 33% Valvoline MaxLife DEX/MERC ATF.

This combination has been in my transmission for 7K miles and is working PERFECT. Shifts are very predictable and soft, as good as my wife’s 2004 Toyota Sienna. With light throttle it shifts almost un-noticeable, and at medium throttle it shifts very nice and precise. Down-shift at throttle increase is perfect with perfect RPM match for clutch engagement. Car now has 107K miles.

This evening I decided to remove the magnetic plug to check for metal, and found NOTHING on the magnet, and fluid looked perfect so I installed the plug and poured the ATF back in the transmission.

It might only work like this in my transmission, but it is worth trying if you have similar problems I had.

Any comments would be appreciated.

 

[DeeAgeaux]

What other ATFs have you used?

 

[youdontwannaknow]

Originally Posted By: D_Ville_TX
through a cooler-line dump, 2 quarts at a time for a total of 8 quarts.


can you explain a little more ? was this a machine/pressurized fluid exchange ? or a drain ?
I believe the drain just through the drain plug typically exchanges about 2 and 3/4 quarts, so I'd imagine if you did a drain and also purged the cooler line you should have got more fluid out ?

 

[D_Ville_TX]

Other ATF tested was:
Amsoil ATF = Harsh shifts when hot,but better than Z1 when cold.
Mobil1 ATF = Harsh when hot, and delayed shift cold.
100% ATF+4 = Too soft.

Flush was done by draining the transmission, and adding 3 quarts new fluid. Disconnect cooler line and start engine until about 2 quarts was drained. Add 2 quarts and repeat until 8 quarts had been exchanged.

 

[94MaxGXE]

67% Valvoline ATF+4 and 33% Valvoline MaxLife DEX/MERC ATF

Ashland ++1

The MaxLife DEX/MERC ATF in my Camry works great.

The Honda will get Maxlife when the time comes.

 

[AzFireGuy79]

Makes me wonder how well the Maxlife ATF would do in comparison to what you have in there now? Interesting mix. ATF+4 is a very robust fluid no doubt, just never heard of anyone using it in a honda trans. Good for you as it sounds like its working out beautifully with the Dex/Merc!

I am having some shifting issues right now in my 99 acura TL. I am half way through a ARX cleaning and things have improved. Running amsoil atf but noticed it is a bit too harsh at operating temp. Was thinking about Maxlife but your mixture has me thinking.....

 

[TwoWheelRider]

Originally Posted By: 94MaxGXE

The Honda will get Maxlife when the time comes.


06 Accord here. I did a drain/fill with MaxLife two weeks ago. About 3 quarts were exchanged. Immediately 2nd and 3rd gears shifted pretty hard, but gear whine was gone. Today I did another drain/fill, but used Z1. After a few miles it started shifting more smoothly although 2nd gear is still a bit harder than before any MaxLife went in. Gear whine is back though.

In a week I will do another drain/fill with Z1.
Z1 is an odd fluid and has a faint smell of acetone. It isn't like any ATF that I have handled before.


On the other hand, MaxLife is working fantastic in our 04 Toyota Sienna.
I seems like Toyotas love that stuff.
Local Walmart sells MaxLife ATF for US$3.76, a great deal!

 

[AzFireGuy79]

Man I hate honda transmissions almost as much as I hate Z1!

Thanks for sharing your "Maxlife sucks in Honda" story. Back to the drawing board for me.......

 

[DeeAgeaux]

It seems alot of Honda guys that are maintenance freaks like Maxlife while speed freaks like Redline D4.

 

[FZ1]

102k on my '02 Accord V6 with Z1. I ain't tryin' nothin' else.

 

[countrypill]

Same here, will not use anything but Z-1. I have 124k on a 99 Accord with only Z1 and at this time everything is still good to go. I have done drain and refills every 10 - 15k though.

 

[hsd]

116k on my 2000 accord and the original transmission works fine with Z1 changes every 20k or so. I recently added a Magnefine filter and plan to start using Maxlife next ATF change because of the good results report by others and the excessive cost of Z1.

 

[Sunnyinhollister]

Originally Posted By: D_Ville_TX
I am the owner of a 2002 Honda Accord V6 with Automatic transmission. Car was purchased with 85K miles and transmission was working perfect at time of purchase. All fluids changed after purchase, and transmission fluid was changed with ATF-Z1 through a cooler-line dump, 2 quarts at a time for a total of 8 quarts.
At 93K miles, it started to shift hard and shift points got unpredictable and often delayed. I added a bottle of Lubegard red and inline Magnefine filter, and shift points returned to somewhat normal, but shifting was still too harsh.
This is a 6th gen transmission so I expected a failure soon, and decided to play around with different fluids. Most fluids I tested did NOT work better than ATF-Z1, until I got this combination.

Currently using 67% Valvoline ATF+4 and 33% Valvoline MaxLife DEX/MERC ATF.

This combination has been in my transmission for 7K miles and is working PERFECT. Shifts are very predictable and soft, as good as my wife’s 2004 Toyota Sienna. With light throttle it shifts almost un-noticeable, and at medium throttle it shifts very nice and precise. Down-shift at throttle increase is perfect with perfect RPM match for clutch engagement. Car now has 107K miles.

This evening I decided to remove the magnetic plug to check for metal, and found NOTHING on the magnet, and fluid looked perfect so I installed the plug and poured the ATF back in the transmission.

It might only work like this in my transmission, but it is worth trying if you have similar problems I had.

Any comments would be appreciated.




Out of curiosity why not replaced the 3rd & 4th gear pressure sensors for this issue? They are a known problem and do impact shift quality when failing. I could be that the mix you currently have is compensating for failing sensors?

Just a thought - here's a link for you on the sensors:

http://tl.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=721508

I changed the ones on my Pilot at 48k just for grins and it took about 30 minutes.

 

[D_Ville_TX]

Sunnyinhollister,

Thanks for this info and link. I did not know anything about possibly failing pressure sensors, but I will look into it.

You might be correct about the current fluid compensating for failing sensors. I would like to be able to use OEM fluid and get normal shifts back, so that might be the fix.

Have a nice weekend.

 

[AzFireGuy79]

I was always under the impression that the sensor issue only affected later model honda/acura vehicles? Might be worth a try in my 99 TL although I have never seen anyone do this on my particular year.

What ever happened to BuickGN?

 

[hate2work]

We've got 120k on our 99 Civic, only doing drain and fills at 40k, 80k, and every 10k thereafter, using only Z1. I'd like to try Amsoil/Red Line, but at this point I'm almost afraid to.

 

[AzFireGuy79]

I hear ya. Other friends of mine have used both amsoil and Redline as I have, but they had favorable results. I on the other hand didn't with either and I think it might be because of the pressure switches and not the fluid.

I'm doing a ARX treatment right now with a magnefine in place. Just got off the phone with acura parts guy, $41 each for the new sensors that retail for $61! I figure its worth a try to see if it works on these earlier cars.

This transmission beats the [censored] out of Z1 so I hate to go back to it. I have amsoil in there right now(100% from a fluid exchange) so if it shifts good after I replace the sensors today I will go with amsoil or Redline D4. Coin flipping time!

 

[deven]

I have a 2009 TL and at 1450 miles I changed the Z1 fluid, since I don't have faith in it, to Royal Purple Max ATF. With the Z1 fluid the shift points were unpredictable and the 3rd to 4th gear would take forever and higher RPM's to catch. With RP ATF, the shifts are prescise and firm but buttery smooth too. Granted the transmission is in infancy but none the less works great now. Only time will tell if I made the right choice or not. From now on its drain and fill every 30k miles. Fyi, I did 3 drain and fills with RP to get as much of the Z1 fluid out. Expensive but hopefully worth it.

 

[Sayjac]

Originally Posted By: FZ1
102k on my '02 Accord V6 with Z1.
+1 135+K on an 01 Civic (noted for AT issues) with 3 drain and refills. Seems to shift fine, and no issues. My philosphy with the Civic and Z-1 is, if it ain't broke don't fix it.

Congrats to the OP on finding a Honda transmission fluid combo that works for him.

 

[dkryan]

Originally Posted By: countrypill
I have done drain and refills every 10 - 15k though.


Which is why you have had success with that transmission and Z-1. Honda's transmissions through at least 2005 shear the living [censored] out of the Z-1. And unfortunately, they beat on Full Synthetic ATFs pretty hard, as well.

I have RLI in my '05 Accord V6 (with only 23k miles on the engine) and the transmission whine is driving me nuts. Thank goodness for XM radio and loud volume!

I've heard the sensor change has worked well for most Honda/Acura owners. It's certainly worth a try.