Honda 1.5T Oil Choice

[Virtus_Probi]

Originally Posted by wemay
Originally Posted by ekpolk
Other manufacturers like Hyundai use 5w -30 as their speced oil for turbos with the option to use 5w-40. Their 2.0 liter turbos now have TSB that mandates a full charge to 5w-40 full time speced oil...

Where can we find this TSB mandating Hyundai 2.0T owners use 5W-40? Can you share it, please?
I haven't received it. I haven't read of it on any of the Hyundai Forums, nor is it on any of the TSB lookup sites.

I think finding an LSPI resistant 5W40 might be a challenge, at least at WM!
I guess I haven't tried to find one lately, though...
I am also interested in seeing this TSB even though I don't own a Hyundai.

 

[yowps3]

The 400HP TTV6 Infiniti Q50/Q60 specs 0w20 !!
That's nuts

The funny part is the fact the Mercedes sourced
2.0T I4 used in base model recomends 0w40

What gives?

Who is right and who is wrong?

 

[yowps3]

Originally Posted by Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted by wemay
Originally Posted by ekpolk
Other manufacturers like Hyundai use 5w -30 as their speced oil for turbos with the option to use 5w-40. Their 2.0 liter turbos now have TSB that mandates a full charge to 5w-40 full time speced oil...

Where can we find this TSB mandating Hyundai 2.0T owners use 5W-40? Can you share it, please?
I haven't received it. I haven't read of it on any of the Hyundai Forums, nor is it on any of the TSB lookup sites.

I think finding an LSPI resistant 5W40 might be a challenge, at least at WM!
I guess I haven't tried to find one lately, though...
I am also interested in seeing this TSB even though I don't own a Hyundai.
The owners manual of my 2014 Kia Forte 1.6 T-GDI says to use 5w30 for fuel economy but recomends 5w40 for enhanced engine protection and sustained high speeds.

 

[StevieC]

I don't know how your warranty laws work there but I wouldn't be running anything other than what's in the manual for the warranty period so you have an air tight claim to warranty should you need it.
For the first change I would run it as long as Honda states because they usually want the oil in their longer on the first run.

Just monitor your dipstick level closely and remove any increase in oil and it will be just fine. You can always sample and send to a lab to check on this.

After this run the 20wt that meets the Honda specifications and just change it more regularly to keep fuel dilution at a safe level. It seems to be only a concern in the colder weather when the ECU is running much richer mappings.

 

[GenesisGuy70]

I have the same engine. I dumped the FF 0w20 @ 6,000 miles. Refilled with PPPP 5w30. But I had a quart of 0w20 leftover from the womans Hyundai so I used that too. So I have like a 4w27

Oil has always reeked of gas. Sending in the FF sample for analysis soon. Just need to pick a lab since I've read Blackstone doesn't give an accurate picture of fuel dilution. If it comes back with high dilution but viscosity is still within range, then I am open to going back to 0w20. But for this 1 change, my 4w27 will be a-okay.

**Be prepared for a battle with the oil filter. That sob is on there TIGHT. I had a heck of a time getting mine off. Dang near destroyed it getting it off. Had to get a leather belt and put around it, get out from under the car and do some self powered ugga duggas to break it loose. Why Honda did that beats me.

 

[ekpolk]

Originally Posted by wemay
Originally Posted by ekpolk
Other manufacturers like Hyundai use 5w -30 as their speced oil for turbos with the option to use 5w-40. Their 2.0 liter turbos now have TSB that mandates a full charge to 5w-40 full time speced oil...



Where can we find this TSB mandating Hyundai 2.0T owners use 5W-40? Can you share it, please?
I haven't received it. I haven't read of it on any of the Hyundai Forums, nor is it on any of the TSB lookup sites.

I was quoting Mainia's post, above, from 2:52 a.m. I know, slicing and dicing the quote-on and quote-off bracketing can make a mess in a hurry... Anyway, consider the request passed along to him. I'm aware that Hyundai has had issues along these lines, but never having owned one, of course, I'm not on their "distribution list" for TSBs.

 

[Bottom_Feeder]

I use the specified 0w20 in my wife's '17 Civic EX-T, specifically Mobil 1 AFE, and it has no fuel dilution issues. The oil level never moves over the course of the OCI and it doesn't smell of gasoline when it's changed.

But since this is the Internet, I'm going to recommend Valvoline VR1 in 20w50.

 

[PimTac]

First of all, welcome.

What are your driving routines? All city? Short trips or motorway? How many km do you drive annually?

I personally would stick with the 0w20 for now. That will cover your warranty. After the warranty a 5w30 should be fine. Anything thicker is just a waste.

These engines are known for their fuel dilution. We have seen plenty of uoa here with that problem yet the wear metals are good. I would go with whatever short oci Honda recommends. Using miles I subscribe the the 5k miles plan for short trips and 7.5k for mostly highway driving. You can convert that to km.

 

[ekpolk]

Originally Posted by DV0993
Originally Posted by ekpolk
. . .
If the OP isn't a troll and comes back and tells us what his manual says, we can take it from there. In any event, I'm willing to bet that Honda has carefully validated the use of whatever oil it is specifying for this vehicle (and all of its others). Yeah, I'm going to go with that over nebulous, vague fears that an oil is just "too thin" every day.


Definitely not a troll, I'm genuinely concerned with the reliability of these motors and wanted to compare:

- BITOG forum views vs other parts of the internet (specifically Civic forums)

Thank you for coming back and clarifying. The "troll" comment wasn't a personal shot at you. We do get a fair number of individuals who will drop a controversial question, offer few specifics, and then vanish. I recommend starting a discussion like this one with what your manual specifically recommends.
Originally Posted by DV0993
My (conflicting) views:

(a) That Honda have designed these engines for 0w20 (bearing clearances/oil flow/oil squirters)

(b) That Honda are using 0w20 oils for the purposes of beating emmissions numbers
But are these two ideas really in conflict? Is this, in a sense, a "false dilemma"? Different countries put differing levels of pressure on the car makers to improve fuel economy. In the US, we have CAFE (Corporate Average Fuel Economy), a complex set of regulations that create incentives (coercion, some might say) in this direction. I don't know whether or how Australia does this.

In the meantime, the car makers, Honda included of course, are always trying to make a better product - engines that are more powerful, smoother, quieter, and maybe even last longer too. All these things are in play, not just improved fuel economy.

Originally Posted by DV0993
That thicker is better (to a degree! I would never consider anything above a 30wt for this engine)
Whoa, hold on, let's take a careful look at this. First, consider the relative terms used. What does "thicker" really mean? Or even "better"? 0w-20 is pretty "thick" compared to 0w-8. And a cold (40C) 0w-20 is thicker than a hot (100C) 20w-50. Beyond semantics, would you say that for an engine designed, from its bearings up, to use a 20wt oil, that a 30wt or 40wt oil is "better"?

In my opinion, the "best" viscosity oil for an engine is the one (or the range) it was designed to use - whether we choose to see that oil as "thick" or "thin."
Originally Posted by DV0993
Arguably, everyone on this forum (including myself) is OCD and only wants the best in terms of performance and reliability!

Arguably?!? That's probably the most certain bit of information in this entire discussion!!!

 

[PimTac]

This Honda engine is a relatively new one and likely designed with 0w20 in mind from the outset.

In Australia the heavier grades have been the go to oils since the beginning. So a 0w20 recommendation will have people thinking of course. We still have plenty of thinkers here in the US despite the fact this grade has been out for many years now.

The fears and predictions of early engine failures using this grade of oil have not come true. Engines and engineering change just like everything else. Who would have thought we would be flying in plastic airplanes?

I run 0w20 in my Mazda and it's quiet and smooth.

 

[ekpolk]

Originally Posted by Bottom_Feeder
I use the specified 0w20 in my wife's '17 Civic EX-T, specifically Mobil 1 AFE, and it has no fuel dilution issues. The oil level never moves over the course of the OCI and it doesn't smell of gasoline when it's changed.

But since this is the Internet, I'm going to recommend Valvoline VR1 in 20w50.

In the latter half of my first OCI using the same AFE in my Prius, I'm seeing the same -- zero indication of any consumption (it's a new engine of course, I guess it's sealing well) and no hint of dilution (by odor anyway, but this isn't really a Prius issue). I'm thinking I might politely pass on the VR1 recommendation. . .

 

[Petabytes]

The Hyundai TSB for 5w40 recommendation is 16-20-001. It was released on Nov 28, 2016. It stated applying to model year 2017 at that time.

I'm also considering whether switch from current 5w30 to 5w40 or not as there is still no API SN Plus oil for 5w40 available on the market. Also no ACEA A5 rating too. Only A3 with API SN available.

 

[ekpolk]

Originally Posted by PimTac
. . .
The fears and predictions of early engine failures using this grade of oil have not come true. Engines and engineering change just like everything else.
Exactly. And let's not forget that 20wt oils have been mainstream now for twenty years! It's not as if 5w/0w-20 oils are bizarre, new-fangled experimental fluids that haven't yet proven themselves.
Originally Posted by PimTac
I run 0w20 in my Mazda and it's quiet and smooth.
My experience as well.

 

[ekpolk]

Originally Posted by Petabytes
The Hyundai TSB for 5w40 recommendation is 16-20-001. It was released on Nov 28, 2016. It stated applying to model year 2017 at that time.

I'm also considering whether switch from current 5w30 to 5w40 or not as there is still no API SN Plus oil for 5w40 available on the market. Also no ACEA A5 rating too. Only A3 with API SN available.

Thank you for the information. Let's keep in mind, though, that this is a thread addressing oil recommendations for a Honda engine, not a Hyundai. As I noted earlier in the discussion, conclusions about a Hyundai engine with specific problems simply can not be blindly extended to a Honda engine, and certainly not a Honda engine that isn't showing any signs of the same problems.

 

[y_p_w]

Originally Posted by Throt
**Be prepared for a battle with the oil filter. That sob is on there TIGHT. I had a heck of a time getting mine off. Dang near destroyed it getting it off. Had to get a leather belt and put around it, get out from under the car and do some self powered ugga duggas to break it loose. Why Honda did that beats me.

You would either need a cap-style "wrench" or a locking cam (spider) style "wrench". I've had various cap wrenches over the years, but they're of course limited to filters where the fluting fits exactly. They might also be useful where the filter instructions say to use a wrench to get it on to the specified turns after contact and that doesn't seem to be happening by hand.

But the cam-style is more or less universal as long as the filter is within a certain diameter. I think WM has one for under $5, although I bought mine years ago when changing oil for my parents' car while borrowing it. Nothing I had fit, and the quickie lube place they last went to must have used a wrench to tighten it. I went to AutoZone and got something for $6. Those things just clamp down and even dig into the can. Something like these:

I've tried everything over the years, including band wrenches, oil filter pliers, jaw style wrenches, but nothing seems to work better than something where I just turn it with a 3/8 socket handle. Often there was limited access to get in the band wrench. I did get the factory filter off my 2004 WRX with one, but it was at odd angles (applied diagonally) because I couldn't get the handle between the exhaust and filter.

 

[oil_film_movies]

Originally Posted by wemay
Originally Posted by Mainia
Other manufacturers like Hyundai use 5w -30 as their speced oil for turbos with the option to use 5w-40. Their 2.0 liter turbos now have TSB that mandates a full charge to 5w-40 full time speced oil...
Where can we find this TSB mandating Hyundai 2.0T owners use 5W-40? Can you share it, please?I haven't received it. I haven't read of it on any of the Hyundai Forums, nor is it on any of the TSB lookup sites.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_UDQbyqw8jsTUVmb3BXM3lKajA/view
Its really a Kia (OK, Hyundai uses the same engines...so,) TSB for "clarification" of their stupidly-worded infamous Owner's Manuals from 4 years ago.
And it doesn't say you have to use a 5w40, but says its cool if you wanna.

 

[GenesisGuy70]

Originally Posted by y_p_w
Originally Posted by Throt
**Be prepared for a battle with the oil filter. That sob is on there TIGHT. I had a heck of a time getting mine off. Dang near destroyed it getting it off. Had to get a leather belt and put around it, get out from under the car and do some self powered ugga duggas to break it loose. Why Honda did that beats me.

You would either need a cap-style "wrench" or a locking cam (spider) style "wrench". I've had various cap wrenches over the years, but they're of course limited to filters where the fluting fits exactly. They might also be useful where the filter instructions say to use a wrench to get it on to the specified turns after contact and that doesn't seem to be happening by hand.

But the cam-style is more or less universal as long as the filter is within a certain diameter. I think WM has one for under $5, although I bought mine years ago when changing oil for my parents' car while borrowing it. Nothing I had fit, and the quickie lube place they last went to must have used a wrench to tighten it. I went to AutoZone and got something for $6. Those things just clamp down and even dig into the can. Something like these:

I've tried everything over the years, including band wrenches, oil filter pliers, jaw style wrenches, but nothing seems to work better than something where I just turn it with a 3/8 socket handle. Often there was limited access to get in the band wrench. I did get the factory filter off my 2004 WRX with one, but it was at odd angles (applied diagonally) because I couldn't get the handle between the exhaust and filter.


I have the one in the bottom picture and it has worked flawlessly on every oil filter I've used until this factory installed one on this Accord. It failed miserably at getting that thing off. I put duct tape all around the filter to give the remover something to bite into but that didn't work. I tried to bend the housing of the filter and give it some ridges for it grab onto, that didn't help. So for my last attempt I grabbed one of my pant belts, put it around and that finally gripped enough to remove it. Never had so much trouble! I think if the factory filter had that rubber applied to it like the Fram Ultra's do, it would've come off no problem. It had dug into the metal of the can but it was on so tight it just pushed the metal inwards into the filter and it was all over from there.

 

[wemay]

Originally Posted by Petabytes
The Hyundai TSB for 5w40 recommendation is 16-20-001. It was released on Nov 28, 2016. It stated applying to model year 2017 at that time.

I'm also considering whether switch from current 5w30 to 5w40 or not as there is still no API SN Plus oil for 5w40 available on the market. Also no ACEA A5 rating too. Only A3 with API SN available.



Hyundai has always recommended 5W40 among it's choices of motor oil for the 2.0T. But it still recommends the 5W30 as a 1st choice, even in the 2019 MY Santa Fe 2.0T models.

 

[wemay]

Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
Originally Posted by wemay
Originally Posted by Mainia
Other manufacturers like Hyundai use 5w -30 as their speced oil for turbos with the option to use 5w-40. Their 2.0 liter turbos now have TSB that mandates a full charge to 5w-40 full time speced oil...
Where can we find this TSB mandating Hyundai 2.0T owners use 5W-40? Can you share it, please?I haven't received it. I haven't read of it on any of the Hyundai Forums, nor is it on any of the TSB lookup sites.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_UDQbyqw8jsTUVmb3BXM3lKajA/view
Its really a Kia (OK, Hyundai uses the same engines...so,) TSB for "clarification" of their stupidly-worded infamous Owner's Manuals from 4 years ago.
And it doesn't say you have to use a 5w40, but says its cool if you wanna.


Correct, 5w40 is just another choice of many they approve...no mandate for it.

 

[PimTac]

Those oil filter tools for removal as pictured above are great. They work every time. I've had good success with Channelocks. Make sure you get a wide spread jaw and a long jaw as well. Some are too short to be efficient. You can also use Channelocks for other things as well.