High mileage oil recommendations?

[Cubey]

Hello everyone. Here is the info on my vehicle based on the sticky suggestions of information to post:

Vehicle: 1978 Dodge B300 (1 ton) chassis Xplorer Class B motorhome (19ft long, non-dually)
Engine: 5.9L 360 V8
Transmission/Drive train: A-727 3 speed auto transmission / 3.54 Dana 60 rear end

How I drive it: I drive it easy and keep my speed lower than the limit (55mph zones, I'll do 50-55, in 70mph zones, 60-65) since it's such a big, heavy vehicle and isn't the most fuel efficient. I am going to be living and traveling in it full time. I'll be driving it mostly in short bursts of several hundred miles over a couple days, then having it mostly sit for the rest of the month.

Towing: I will be towing a home made, but heavy duty 5x8 utility trailer with raised mesh sides and a drop down tail gate with a 125cc scooter, aluminum truck toolbox with tools in it, bicycle, some other light cargo, etc.

Where I live: Not sure that's going to really apply since this is a motorhome, but right now I live in SW Arkansas (AR). I am eventually going to be settling and living full time in Seattle, WA. But that's a ways off. I intend to leave out from AR traveling in September of this year and will be going through TX, NM and on into AZ where I'll be staying through the winter into next year.

What manual says (type): The 1978 factory service manual that is intended to cover all Chrysler vehicles states For Service SE. The Haynes manual for 1971-2003 Dodge & Plymouth vans is a bit more vague. It simply states API grade "certified for gasoline engines".

What manual says (viscosity): The charts in the FSM and Haynes are slightly different. The FSM shows many more weights than the Haynes manual does, which only shows 10w30 and 5w30. 10w30 is best suited to the temperatures where I am going to be traveling to and living.

Known problems On start up, it burns oil a bit. Most likely leaky valve seals. A bit of rough idle on cold start for the first few minutes but then runs great after that. May just be the nature of the beast.. 70's V8 engine with a carburetor.

Other: I have installed aftermarket vacuum and oil pressure gauges to help keep tabs on the engine's condition.

Okay, here we go!

I am looking for a good high mileage 10w30 oil for my motorhome. Having a 5 digit odometer, the true mileage is unknown to me. I'm guessing it's 135k but it could very well be 235k. I will be buying the oil in retail stores since I can't as easily receive online orders while traveling.

I am looking for the best oil for my application that will provide the best additives for old seals and fuel economy. I would probably do best to stick with conventional oil since it's such an old engine. I have read that synthetics suddenly introduced can cause sludge that is sealing leaks to dislodge and you'll begin having leaks from gaskets. Sure, leaks may develop in time with conventional oil too but I'd rather not rush it.

I don't have any repair records on the engine prior to buying it. Since I bought it, I've had the 3 radiator hoses and all belts replaced. I also changed the coolant, air filter, spark plugs, PCV valve, worn out vacuum/PCV hoses, etc.

The major brand choices for conventional high mileage oils seem to be:

Castrol GTX HM (someone pointed out to me on another forum that this is produced by BP so I am going to avoid it)
Mobile Super HM
Pennzoil High Mileage
Quaker State High Mileage (Not API certified?!)
Valvoline MaxLife / MaxLife Next Gen

Then of course you have in-house brands like O'Reilly and Napa.

 

[tommygunn]

Welcome to BITOG!

Napa oil is rebranded Valvoline

Maxlife is what I would use out of the choices you listed.

Remember they do have high mileage synthetic oils such as Mobil 1 High Mileage.

That API category is so old pretty much anything will work for your car.

 

[toneydoc]

In that engine, use a good high quality oil and good filter such as Pure One. Any of the oils you listed will serve you well. Buy them on sale, and change them every 6 months or at least every year. Never go more than 4k miles between changes in my opinion.

 

[Cubey]

I have an O'Reilly brand oil filter on it right now and an extra one ahead due to a car I had that burned oil bad. I'd get the oil change $12 special of 5qts of oil and a filter. The car didn't need a filter as often as I had to keep adding oil so I got it for the van. I'm not driving it much right now so I figure it's good enough. Probably better than Fram ones.

Once I use it, I am thinking about switching to Wix/Napa Gold filters which seem to be about the best from what I have read. I've never heard of Pure One filters. Are they available at retail stores?

I might do the changes every 4-6 months depending on the driving conditions and environment. When down in AZ, 3 months might be better due to how dusty it's going to be. I have been told to factor in possible shearing which tends to happen more on engines with a carburetor.

I would be more willing to try a HM synthetic blend than a straight synthetic if anything. I used Motorcraft non-HM blend in Fords I've had with over 100k miles and had no oil burning issues before or after.

 

[motorguy222]

A 10W-40 might be better since you are pulling and since this is a big vehicle.

Here is the latest PDS from Warren Performance Products,one of the Super Tech suppliers.The Warren bottles will usually have either WPP or WNE on the bottom of the container.

This is for Super Tech High Milege 10W-40.

Visc @ 60F -105

Visc @ 100F -14.91

Visc Index -148

Pour Point C -39C (-38F)-

Cold Cranking Simulator at (C),cP -3.86

Noack Volatility,% loss -13.5

Zinc,wt % -0.098

Phosphorus,wt % -0.077

Calcium, wt % -0.25

Sulfur, wt % -0.298

Boron, wt %0.018

Sulfated Ash, wt % -0.92

Nitrogen, wt % -0.102

Pumping Viscosity at (C),cP -35,002 (-30)

Shear Stability -11.56

 

[Shellguy]

QS Defy is pretty solid ,that would be my choice

 

[steve20]

Just out of curiosity, as it has no bearing on your question---is the 360 a 4 barrel?
I had an early 70's 360 that is probably still running, somewhere in Indiana
I wholeheartedly agree with your inclination to stay AWAY from synthetics. I do not believe any of the seal material was designed for the synthetics of today
I would go with a HM 10-30 or 10-40 of your choice and the PureOne or Fram Ultra filter.
I would also change the transmission fluid at least once, as well as draining and refilling the differential. I took apart a late 70's Ford diff and the oil inside was rancid--could not get that smell out of the garage till the next Spring
An engine oil temp (easily done with a T fitting at the oil pressure sender) and trans temp gauge should also be in your future
Enjoy your retirement--send us some pics
Steve

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: motorguy222
A 10W-40 might be better since you are pulling and since this is a big vehicle.


As I mentioned, the FSM manual has more oil viscosity on it's chart. For -10 to 100+ temps, it lists 10w30, 10w40 and 10w50. For not less than 32 degrees, it shows 20w40, 20w50 and straight 30.

I read on some page someplace earlier that 10w30 of today is more like 10w40 of the past due to additives or something weird like that, so 10w40 might be better like you said.

My new oil pressure gauge (running 10w30) is showing readings within the margin of proper oil pressure range based on the FSM. It reads about 15psi when at full operating temperature when idling at a stop. When idling cold before driving it any, it reads about 50 psi. I have not put in any extra oil additives.

I have heard a lot of good things about Shell Rotella oils but unfortunately they don't make any high mileage formulas. However, it is often used in fleet and heavier duty vehicles, some of which are used well past 100k miles under heavy load conditions so I wonder if I might benefit from the better wear protection it claims to offer rather than seal conditioners of High Mileage oils.

Most of the miles are going to be on the highway. I am going to be doing city driving sparingly due to it's single digit city mpg. That's why I am going to pull a trailer with a scooter on it, to help offset the van's low mpg.

 

[salv]

I am running Super HM in one vehicle, and GTX HM in the other. I like the performance of both oils.
For yours, GTX HM 10w40 for a high mileage oil, but I bet Rotella T5 synthetic blend in 10w30 would run great in your application. My Walmart carries it for $16/gallon.

 

[fdcg27]

You could try Rotella T5 10w30.
If you don't see any real leaks or consumption, that would be a good choice.
Of the High Mileage oils, I'd lean toward Maxlife, either red bottle or Nextgen.
I had a superb UOA of Nextgen Maxlife 10W-40 from my old BMW, so I am partial to it.
I'd start with a 10w30 and see how leaks and consumption look and go to a 10W-40 if you see much of either.
Good luck with this old vehicle.
How does it look and drive?
If it looks good and drives right, it may be on its first turn of the odometer.
Many older vehicles of this type were only used for vacations, so they often have low original mileage.

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: steve20
Just out of curiosity, as it has no bearing on your question---is the 360 a 4 barrel?
I had an early 70's 360 that is probably still running, somewhere in Indiana
I wholeheartedly agree with your inclination to stay AWAY from synthetics. I do not believe any of the seal material was designed for the synthetics of today
I would go with a HM 10-30 or 10-40 of your choice and the PureOne or Fram Ultra filter.
I would also change the transmission fluid at least once, as well as draining and refilling the differential. I took apart a late 70's Ford diff and the oil inside was rancid--could not get that smell out of the garage till the next Spring
An engine oil temp (easily done with a T fitting at the oil pressure sender) and trans temp gauge should also be in your future


Oh yes, I meant to mention that and I didn't. Sadly, it has the the 2BBL. I considered changing to 4BBL but the extra cost for parts and labor isn't worth it.

The transmission was rebuilt in 2011 by a previous owner, one of the few pieces of documentation I got with it (along with alternator and voltage regulator receipts). But I do need to get it checked... something funky may be going on with it. I have it under a tall carport here at home. I have to drive about 50ft to the end of my driveway and then turn out onto the highway. When I first take off, it feels like it has low pressure at first. Then I get to the stop at the roadway to turn and it bucks a little sometimes when taking off. Any other time, it does not behave this way, only when it's been sitting overnight or longer. I plan to get the fluid and filter changed before I head out in September.

Long story short, the differential got rebuilt last year.... hopefully done right. So i has new differential fluid.

[off topic rant]
The shop who did the differential botched the rear brake job by not replacing a missing spring retainer pin (Bendex brakes) I ended up doing it myself this month. They also stole one of my new brake drums which I realized this month when I had both drums off and found they were different. One old, one new. I picked them up new at Oreilly and examed them before I left. I know what I bought and took to them.

And that's after another shop tore apart the differential and had no clue how to put it back together and kept it for 3 months... and got mad at me for having it towed someplace else. And after I bought all the new parts, I realized how horrible the first mechanic was... I wonder if I even needed a new ring gear and pinion like he claimed.

Yeah, it was a huge mess. Makes me not trust any mechanics anywhere really.

I have an active BBB complaint against the shop who has bold face lied that I was passing $20 bills around as tips to all the mechanics.. after paying a $600 repair bill plus $100 towing plus $600+ in parts.

I may find another shop who does differential rebuilds (they are hard to find around here!) and have them check the gears to make sure they are riding properly. Needless to say, I don't exactly trust the shop who did it to have done it right. Especially since they caused damage to the new brake drum they *did* install, the new brake upper shoe on that side as it was digging into the drum constantly, a loose spring bouncing around in the drum and left me with poor, dangerous braking that they deny I complained about when I picked it up. They insisted they were good so I just took their word for it and assumed something else was wrong in the braking. It was nose diving badly and would barely stop with the pedal as far as it would go.

I am (or was anyway) too nice and trusting of mechanics, I guess.
[/off topic rant]

It wouldn't hurt to change the differential oil to Mobil 1 full synthetic since it has all new seals. I was told it's better to run cheap oil for the break in period of a new differential.. metal shavings and what have you. I had to replace a small amount of fluid after fixing the brakes, being a full floating axle. I topped it off with more of O'Reillys brand of differential oil which is what should have been put in at the rebuild, since that's what I provided to them to use.

I have already entertained the idea of a transmission oil temp gauge. I decided the best place is just before the transmission cooler. Originally it used a cooler in the radiator but someone disconnected it and put it straight to a big, indepentant transmission cooler. Some say the pan is the best place but it seems to me, fluid exiting the transmission before it has been cooled should be the true fluid temperature you should worry about.

I'm running out of room for add-on gauges though. The vacuum gauge is on top of the dash to the left. I installed the oil pressure gauge into a blank space in the metal dash (that hole was fun to cut!) to the left side of the steering column. It's going to look like the cockpit of an airplane before too long if I keep adding more gauges... haha. The factory gauge for oil pressure is just a dummy light on this van... while some had a real gauge (but without numbers).

 

[Kuato]

Rotella T5. You can get it at any WM nationwide.

 

[Cubey]

Originally Posted By: fdcg27
You could try Rotella T5 10w30.
If you don't see any real leaks or consumption, that would be a good choice.
Of the High Mileage oils, I'd lean toward Maxlife, either red bottle or Nextgen.
I had a superb UOA of Nextgen Maxlife 10W-40 from my old BMW, so I am partial to it.
I'd start with a 10w30 and see how leaks and consumption look and go to a 10W-40 if you see much of either.
Good luck with this old vehicle.
How does it look and drive?
If it looks good and drives right, it may be on its first turn of the odometer.
Many older vehicles of this type were only used for vacations, so they often have low original mileage.


It's really hard to say. It has oil change stickers on the door jamb from around 1990-91 that show the mileage around 90k. Unless it has only been driven 40k in the last 22 years, it could be at 235k.

So much as been replaced on this van, it's even further hard to say. The transmission was rebuilt in 2011 before I bought it. I have replaced almost all the entire front end (as far as parts that wear out). Drag link, center link, Inner and outer tie rods, upper and lower ball joints, shocks (but not springs, new one were shorter than the old), upper and lower control arm bushings, brakes on the front and rear, differential rebuilt (hopefully done right, see above post with a rant about it).

I have way more money in it than it's worth ($1000 just being a set of 5 new tires) but live and learn. I am pretty much "restoring" it in a sense. I have used all high quality parts... no cheap stuff. Also also had to put a new starter on it last year. being that it's going to be my home, it's worth it to me. Sure, I could have bought a newer one for more money (I bought this for $1400.. trans rebuild it already had cost about $1000) so I still think I got a fair deal, even if a lot was worn out badly on it. There's no guarantee a $6,000 used motorhome would be any less worn out.

The majority of older RVs out there are *the* most neglected vehicles on the road it's probably fair to say. people buy them cheap used and run them into the ground with little to no maintenance after they are 15-20 years old.

I carry full coverage which won't fully cover what I have in it, there's no way any insurance carrier will insure it for what I have in it I'm sure.. but assuming it doesn't get stolen and isn't recovered or burn to the ground, I have wealth of new parts on it i can swap out to another older Dodge motorhome that may need it. There's no shortage of cheap 78-83 Dodge B300 chassis motor homes out there. A minor accident will 'total' it but most likely it'll still be drivable. I've had that happen on two old cars now (both accidents not my fault). I kept the cars for a few hundred dollars less payout, did minor fixes myself (ie: lights, bumper) and pocketed the rest.

 

[motorguy222]

Originally Posted By: Cubey


As I mentioned, the FSM manual has more oil viscosity on it's chart. For -10 to 100+ temps, it lists 10w30, 10w40 and 10w50. For not less than 32 degrees, it shows 20w40, 20w50 and straight 30.

I read on some page someplace earlier that 10w30 of today is more like 10w40 of the past due to additives or something weird like that, so 10w40 might be better like you said.

My new oil pressure gauge (running 10w30) is showing readings within the margin of proper oil pressure range based on the FSM. It reads about 15psi when at full operating temperature when idling at a stop. When idling cold before driving it any, it reads about 50 psi. I have not put in any extra oil additives.

I have heard a lot of good things about Shell Rotella oils but unfortunately they don't make any high mileage formulas. However, it is often used in fleet and heavier duty vehicles, some of which are used well past 100k miles under heavy load conditions so I wonder if I might benefit from the better wear protection it claims to offer rather than seal conditioners of High Mileage oils.

Most of the miles are going to be on the highway. I am going to be doing city driving sparingly due to it's single digit city mpg. That's why I am going to pull a trailer with a scooter on it, to help offset the van's low mpg.


A 10W-40 today is much better than they were in 1978,there is no comparison.A 10W-40 used to have problems with their viscosity improvers breaking down and causing sludge but with the oils we have today,that is not really a problem.With a 10W-40,you get a thicker oil,something that may be needed since you are doing some pulling,even though it might not be very heavy,you are still adding to the weight of the vehicle.

As far as a 10w30 being like a 10W-40,it may be as far as its ability to resist reakdown but you also have to consider the oils viscosity at operating temp.,some 10w30's are on the thin side of its viscosity range and can shear into the 20 weight range,that may not be something you would want with this vehicle.

As example,Havoline 10w30 has a viscosity of 9.3,that is the lowest possible allowed and still be a 10w30.It could shear into 20 weight range,quite thin for this vehicle.

A high mileage oil not only has a seal conditioner but usually have a stronger add pack that helps keep engines clean and resist wear better than a conventional oil,they are usually more robust.

You might also consider that some High Mileage oils are semi-synthetic,Mobil Super High Mileage,QS Defy and Maxlife are examples.I have used the Mobil Super High Mileage and it helped useage quite a bit.It also has titanium in it,some are not sure of titaniums ability but others have used Mobil oils with it and they have had really good results.

The used oil analysis we have seen with Mobil Super 5000 have shown really good results,while this isnt the same as Super High Mileage,it should give us a good idea of what it can do.

 

[Cubey]

Thanks for the thorough explanation, motorguy222.

I have decided to go with Valvoline Maxlife 10w40 Synthetic Blend. It's very common, affordable and comes in 5qt jugs. My van calls for 5qts at oil changes which I like.

The 97 Ford E150 I had a few years ago with the 4.6L Triton V8 used 6qts which was annoying. It more or less forces you to buy an extra single quart of oil. Unless of course, you want buy a second 5qt jug and have 4qts in it sitting around for 6 months. Not worth the trouble unless you are burning or leaking oil and need to put 3 or 4 quarts in to make up for the loss over 6 months.

From what I can tell, the best balance of value and high quality in an oil filter is the Napa Gold (rebranded Wix). They run about $5-6 while Wix branded ones from O'Reilly run about $7-8, so I'll go with Napa Gold.

I need a good high quality oil and filter that can be found in most auto parts store across the country, so I should be good to go with this combination.

I do not shop Wal-Mart at all anymore despite their tempting low prices. Sure, the oil may cost $7 less for 5qt jug but they treat everyone involved with the company below the CEOs like garage and pay practically slave wages for the work they expect done.

 

[TFB1]

Originally Posted By: Shellguy
QS Defy is pretty solid ,that would be my choice


Mine too and in a the 10W-40 flavor, especially since it's a heavy vehicle with poor aerodynamics that will also be towing...

 

[motorguy222]

Originally Posted By: Cubey
I have decided to go with Valvoline Maxlife 10w40 Synthetic Blend. It's very common, affordable and comes in 5qt jugs. My van calls for 5qts at oil changes which I like.


I think the Maxlife is a really good choice.It has shown to be a good oil in the used oil analysis that have been done and there have been several.

 

[billythekid]

Maxlife

 

[KCJeep]

Maxlife and Defy are both excellent High Mileage oils.

 

[Clevy]

OP
Be thankful that gas guzzling 360 has a 2 barrel carb. I bet its already painful to fill the gas tank,imagine how many less miles you would get per tank once you double the air and fuel. Likely helps prevent fuel diluted oil as well.
Sir. Try a few different oils out. See which the engine runs best with. I'm sure you will know every little sound that motor home makes and you will be able to hear it talk to you once you get some miles on er.
Keep us informed of your observations if you don't mind.