if your tin ceiling has made contact with a neutral on the same circuit as your applicances you would see this "appliance related" behavior. if you dont have any current flowing from the hot to neutral, then all is well. once you turn on an applicance, there are two paths to return current, one via the existing neutral wire, and the other via the tin ceiling to the gas pipe to ground.
Grounding Electrical Question ?...help
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Chas3,
I will keep that outlet unused until the electrician arrive Tuesday to find where the faulty wire is. I definitely don't want to keep sending current through it. The gas pipe runs to the basement. I to avoid me or anyone in the apartment below me getting a shock.
I will keep that outlet unused until the electrician arrive Tuesday to find where the faulty wire is. I definitely don't want to keep sending current through it. The gas pipe runs to the basement. I to avoid me or anyone in the apartment below me getting a shock.
generally speaking, its "safe" to touch the neutral. while you are a path for the current to get back to ground, you are very poor conductor compared to the neutral.
this is how those ground fault breakers/outlets work. they examine the current leaving on the hot and returning on the neutral. if the difference is large enough, they trip because the current must be going somewhere it shouldnt (like through you). ground fault breakers/outlets are mandated now for bathrooms and kitchens (and garages i think) but only for outlets that at not dedicated to an appliance.
this is how those ground fault breakers/outlets work. they examine the current leaving on the hot and returning on the neutral. if the difference is large enough, they trip because the current must be going somewhere it shouldnt (like through you). ground fault breakers/outlets are mandated now for bathrooms and kitchens (and garages i think) but only for outlets that at not dedicated to an appliance.
EUREKA!!!!!!!
Electricians said this place is gonna burn down....LOL
Actually they recommended to the owners to properly wire up each apartment basement properly. The electrician was not too happy with setup, but gave them some advice to do it maybe one apartment at a time.
So the problem. It turns out the outlet behind my refrigerator has its neutral wire run up to the ceiling box in my kitchen and grounded to the BOX! yes you heard me right. Instead of connecting it to the neutral wire right there that also is connected to my light, they for some reason attached to a screw in the box directly. This was all so unexpected. The electrician found it by luck he was stumped and moving wires around the box to see. when he counted the wires and then the leads one was missing. so he final saw what looked like a wire pinched by a screw. He was just about to come down when he found it...close one. He told me of cases where people swap the wires and end up making a box hot then get electrocuted when they touched it.
Jeez short cuts like that can burn your building down. I don't see the logic behind it. So it was not accident, just some retarded actions by someone.
Thanks Guys or all of your useful help and knowledge.
Electricians said this place is gonna burn down....LOL
Actually they recommended to the owners to properly wire up each apartment basement properly. The electrician was not too happy with setup, but gave them some advice to do it maybe one apartment at a time.
So the problem. It turns out the outlet behind my refrigerator has its neutral wire run up to the ceiling box in my kitchen and grounded to the BOX! yes you heard me right. Instead of connecting it to the neutral wire right there that also is connected to my light, they for some reason attached to a screw in the box directly. This was all so unexpected. The electrician found it by luck he was stumped and moving wires around the box to see. when he counted the wires and then the leads one was missing. so he final saw what looked like a wire pinched by a screw. He was just about to come down when he found it...close one. He told me of cases where people swap the wires and end up making a box hot then get electrocuted when they touched it.
Jeez short cuts like that can burn your building down. I don't see the logic behind it. So it was not accident, just some retarded actions by someone.
Thanks Guys or all of your useful help and knowledge.
I once installed an outdoor security light and when I put the cover on it, pinched the black wire, which cut through the insulation. Some days later I leaned against the aluminum trip on the corner of the garage (all the way on the opposite end of the house) and got a strong tingle. Basically had the entire trim and gutters live.
tallpaul, sounds like a cool way to keep squirrls off the roof. you might be onto something there!
Good news!! It's always nice to see a real fix.
Glad to hear you got it fixed.
Sometime when there is a lot of time I'll tell you all about the story of one of my former colleagues (we worked for an electric utility so he should have known better) who owned a horse farm. He wired the barns himself. When the horses urinated, they danced all over the place for weeks before he figured it out. He was such a character none of us would go out and help him. Poor horses though – they didn’t deserve that.
Sometime when there is a lot of time I'll tell you all about the story of one of my former colleagues (we worked for an electric utility so he should have known better) who owned a horse farm. He wired the barns himself. When the horses urinated, they danced all over the place for weeks before he figured it out. He was such a character none of us would go out and help him. Poor horses though – they didn’t deserve that.
Oh no....LOL
Poor horses...
It is good to have this feeling of relief. You know the "now my apartment won't burn down" feeling...lol
I stayed up the first 3 nights and walked into the kitchen like 100 times checking for any issues.
Poor horses...
It is good to have this feeling of relief. You know the "now my apartment won't burn down" feeling...lol
I stayed up the first 3 nights and walked into the kitchen like 100 times checking for any issues.
horse barns really need full blown ground planes.. they're rediculously sensitive to electricity.
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