Ground strap broke off down spark plug hole

That was with the plug removed. I searched on google and it said it would blow out any debris. Are you telling me my engine is gone and there is nothing to do?

My friend said he can bring a shop vac tomorrow
 
That's what has me worried - divots or damage to the piston, which I suspect will give before the head.

Might be enough force in the impact of piston, debris and head to bend a rod, or wrist pin, and that would be the end of engine.

Depending on piston and combustion chamber design, there may be an area on the piston where the clearance is near zero and the ground would cause interference. Interference bends, deforms, or breaks parts.
 
So should I try to vacuum it out or anything at this point or just see how and how long it drives?
 
Here's what happens when a 10mm washer falls into the cylinder and you start and run it for less than a minute with it making noise. It did lose compression a bit on this cylinder.

no-1-cyl-head.jpg
no-1-piston-tdc-close.jpg
 
Drew7a said:
and you can diagnose that damage has been done from behind a keyboard impressive.
Click to expand...
See SHOZ's post above. There is no way that "fierce noise" does not result in mechanical damage. Your diagnosis is that it does not?

And I'm not the only one who stated that in this thread, make sure you go back and criticize the others as well.
 
If the OP though it was OK to try to start the car with some loose metal inside the cylinder, then someone needs to take away his tools before he does something worse.


Z

PS If this comes across as too harsh, then check out the grandma’s on the knitting & crocheting forums. You really have to have a thick skin to hang with those gals. ;)
 
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Infomercial said:
Thanks for all of your help. I have inserted a new plug finger tight and the noise persists. I have been told it sounds like piston knock, there is no cure. I should look into a compression test, but really just get a new car. It is throwing code p106. Thank you for your help. Any further suggestions are welcome. This is my first time changing spark plugs and although it has been fun and educational I do not know if this car thing is for me any longer.
Click to expand...
A compression test involves a free rental part from Autozone and 20 minutes of time.
 
Infomercial said:
It's the L shaped ground strap. Bigger than a tip. The noise started after I noticed it missing from the plug and read running the engine with the plug out will blow out debris. It does not make that sound with the plug out but does with the plug inserted loosely. I had just replaced the alternator with a bad bearing yesterday and marveled at how nice it sounded.

I think there is not much to do now but see if it drives around like that. I am so sorry bitog'ers I feel like a disgrace to all car diy'ers.
Click to expand...
This is your first time changing plugs, don't be too hard on yourself. Next time I would suggest finding a friend or neighbor that has some experience to help you out. Otherwise do what I do....watch TONS youtube videos that are specific to your car. Find which guys know what they are talking about, then follow their instructions.
 
Barkleymut said:
This is your first time changing plugs, don't be too hard on yourself. Next time I would suggest finding a friend or neighbor that has some experience to help you out. Otherwise do what I do....watch TONS youtube videos that are specific to your car. Find which guys know what they are talking about, then follow their instructions.
Click to expand...
On the other hand the OP likely installed them correctly or would have even with YouTube assistance. But if you’re installing the wrong plugs, well you can install those completely correctly and still wreck the engine.
 
You might be able to blow the part out if you have compressed air available, but make sure the valves are closed first.
There are different versions of this borescope that are a little less expensive. This will be good for inspections to see what you are trying to remove. Works with your cell phone. I like the attachments that come with it too. The hook was helpful, allowing me to see the hook in relationship to the part I was trying to fish for in one application, same with the magnet attachment, and the light is great too.
https://www.amazon.com/DEPSTECH-Bor...hvlocphy=&hvtargid=pla-4584207583273447&psc=1
I used this scope with combination of vacuum and tube for major cleaning of cylinder and compressed air with long shaft blower to blow out the rest of the shavings after putting CalVan inserts into the aluminum heads of my Expedition.
Make sure the valves in that cylinder are all in the closed position if using a blow gun and compressed air method. CalVan provided a rubber plug accessory that fit in the spark plug hole, run air into it and move the crankshaft by hand, when the valves are closed, the rubber plug blows out of the spark plug hole. I realize you are not putting inserts, but this is a video might give you some ideas.
CalVan Spark Plug Insert Instructions Video
Use the borescope to inspect that the cylinder is clean afterwards. This has many other uses, so it would not be wasted money. I use mine all the time.
 
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Amazon has some really inexpensive borescopes that plug into a phone or laptop that will serve light duty like what you are doing. $10 to $25 that will do what you need. Amazon also has kits with magnets, hooks, and mirrors that clip on the end that are useful.
No one suggested putting the old plugs back in to check for noise. And tighten the plug, no whoof whoof pumping sound is going to help you determine it something is hitting.
 
Fitz98 said:
You might be able to blow the part out if you have compressed air available, but make sure the valves are closed first……”
Click to expand...

Actually , no. The standard practice for removing a small foreign object is as follows :

1) don’t try to Start the engine. (Not much help
To the OP @ this point )

2) turn the engine over by hand slowly until the exhaust valve is open on the suspect cylinder

3) apply compressed air to the spark plug hole

4) if small enough, the object should be carried out the open exhaust port by the air stream .

5) visually check to see if successful. Repeat as needed.

This is the same procedure used when installing a helicopter-coil or time-sert in a stripped out spark plug hole. If done correctly, all the debris from the helicopter-coil process will exit the exhaust port , eliminating the need to take the cylinder head off.


I’ve done literally hundreds of motorcycle spark plug repairs this way over the past 55 years. Never fails.


Z
 
Astro14 said:
Depending on piston and combustion chamber design, there may be an area on the piston where the clearance is near zero and the ground would cause interference. Interference bends, deforms, or breaks parts.
Click to expand...
Or the piece of metal that broke off got permanently embedded in the piston or combustion chamber, and evey time the piston goes to TDC there is contact.

OP, if all the plugs are removed and the engine cranked over can you hear the same noise? Better yet, what CleanSump suggested using the old plugs. If the noise is still there with the engine running using the old plugs then the piece is embedded and/or there's some kind of engine damage.

If you had a boredcope you could try and see if the ground strap is embedded someplace. Only other way would be to pull the head off.
 
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An update on this car: I called a mobile mechanic who said he can see the ground with his phone flashligight this will be easy, doesn't have a long enough tool. Came back the next day with a longer tool and said he doesn't think it's magnetic, then said it's fused, then said it's small and not a big deal, he would drive it and not worry


I'm thinking of running it with the plug out for a few minutes or trying to see if I can hold off on driving until I can afford borescope.

I heard the Ford 4.0 engine is "indistrictable" the car has 220k miles and runs great compared to when I got it. Kinda want a pontiac LS1 tho. Wwjd?
 
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wwyd ? I’d get a different mechanic.

seriously, any small piece of metal can cause a valve to stick open and / or get bent. And that’s one of the better case scenarios.

If I’d were mine, I’d turn the engine over until the exhaust valve was fully open and no overlap, ie the intake is closed, then blow Compressed air down the spark plug hole. Until the piece blows out the exhaust port.

Z
 
Infomercial said:
Came back the next day with a longer tool and said he doesn't think it's magnetic, then said it's fused, then said it's small and not a big deal, he would drive it and not worry
Click to expand...
"Fused" ... like embedded into the top of the piston? If the piece is hitting the combustion chamber and making noise, I wouldn't drive it that way. If it's embedded into the piston, it will never come loose by itself.
 
Its on the bottom from what i could tell. He thought it was free to snag enough to come back.
 
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