Gotta gas up..

[BeerCan]

If I understand your question...
The rate of charge has nothing to do with our solar panels. The only difference is the cost of electricity.

Jeff, first just don't engage, I get what you are trying to say and so do most of the others I suspect.
second, how big is your array? Do you use any kind of powerwall or batteries for storage? Typically how long does it take you to charge with your array as compared to using utility electricity? Are you grid tied or stand alone?

 

[Astro14]

Gentlemen - we've gotten off topic here by starting down the path of personal criticism.

Let's stick to charging electric vehicles, and leave it at that. There are some good folks on this board, and we don't need to pick at each other while discussing the topic.

I'm going to lock this for now. I'll open it later when we've all taken a breather.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Would it help if the Tesla app showed “MRPH” - “Miles of Range added Per Hour”?

Maybe it is just a "Tesla thing" ... but "MPH" (knowing what the context of the term means, and it's just missing the "R", but the "R" is repetitive anyway) still ultimately makes sense regardless of how some people get upset over the use of the term.

 

[UncleDave]

After having driven several of these vehicles its clear that the manufacturers are all struggling with how to present all the different information to the drivers.

Exactly what you get per unit of time you spend at a charger being just one as the entire process is non linear from beginning to end with a wide variety of variables thrown in.

Ive driven volts, bolts, Leafs, BMW's plug in pri'i and Teslas, andI think Tesla does the best job at conveying consumption and recharging, providing an accurate range remaining,

In terms of getting to a charger nothing else in even close.I can tell how many stalls are open at an unpcoming charger and the cars will pre condition a battery for a quick charge.

 

[JeffKeryk]

In terms of getting to a charger nothing else in even close.I can tell how many stalls are open at an unpcoming charger and the cars will pre condition a battery for a quick charge.

Number of open charging stalls is pretty important. You might see 20 Teslas charging with 2 or 3 drivers waiting to get on. Ha!
It is important to know when charging is complete, as you can be charged for leaving you car too long after completion.

Here is a Supercharger location at Santana Row, a popular shopping and restaurant center in Silicon Valley.
Personally, I think some people are charging more for show than go. Plus they get parking in a busy place. Dunno for sure.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Jeff, first just don't engage, I get what you are trying to say and so do most of the others I suspect.
second, how big is your array? Do you use any kind of powerwall or batteries for storage? Typically how long does it take you to charge with your array as compared to using utility electricity? Are you grid tied or stand alone?

5.1 kW, 17 Longi solar panels and Enphase inverters
No storage; perhaps one day
Grid tie system.
How long to charge? Ya got me. I just plug in and forget about it.

There is a lotta sun in Los Gatos; we are the southern most town in the South Bay Area.
Last town before you get into the Santa Cruz Mountains.

 

[ZeeOSix]

It is important to know when charging is complete, as you can be charged for leaving you car too long after completion.

That's interesting ... any idea what kind of extra charge is imposed on someone who leaves the car sitting too long after charging is completed?

 

[JeffKeryk]

That's interesting ... any idea what kind of extra charge is imposed on someone who leaves the car sitting too long after charging is completed?

A lot. Here is my understanding:

Idle fee $0.50 per minute.
When the station is 100% occupied $1.00 per minute.

Even at work, you are supposed to move your car after charging. You get a text message on your cell.
Free or subsidized charging is a nice perk, but they enforce the rules.

 

[mbacfp]

5.1 kW, 17 Longi solar panels and Enphase inverters
No storage; perhaps one day
Grid tie system.
How long to charge? Ya got me. I just plug in and forget about it.

There is a lotta sun in Los Gatos; we are the southern most town in the South Bay Area.
Last town before you get into the Santa Cruz Mountains.

Hey Jeff,

Not to hijack your thread, but wanted to say thanks for the help when I did my solar project.

8.6 kW, 28X310 Watt North American Panels.

Coming up on a year and have been pleased. Averaging $9-$12 a month generation fee (grid tie in as well). Looks like I will owe $230 for the 12 month period over usage...but that is with all of us home more due to pandemic (kids virtual learning, etc.).

Here is my system info.

When we stay in Felton, CA I've passed through Los Gatos many times...beautiful area. I actually ended up adding 2 extra solar panels thinking someday I might get an electric vehicle and charge it with my 50 amp motorhome outlet. Take care all.

 

[Spyderman24_7]

When was the last time you saw a gas station with a hand pump?

If I had an electric car - I can charge using my home genset that runs on natural gas.

Do realize people tend to store gas/diesel AT home and hand/battery power pump if needed, lmao. I'd take my chances trying to source gas than electricity. EVs have their place in life for some, but will never replace fuel burning for the majority of population.

 

[Cerjed]

After having driven several of these vehicles its clear that the manufacturers are all struggling with how to present all the different information to the drivers.

Exactly what you get per unit of time you spend at a charger being just one as the entire process is non linear from beginning to end with a wide variety of variables thrown in.

Ive driven volts, bolts, Leafs, BMW's plug in pri'i and Teslas, andI think Tesla does the best job at conveying consumption and recharging, providing an accurate range remaining.

Why not keep it simple? Battery percentage on one gauge and estimated miles to empty on another. Just like in IC vehicles...fuel tank empty, half, full and some also show estimated miles till empty. It just seems that it is being made more complex than it needs to be for whatever reason... maybe to stand out or differentiate yourself? I am not saying that it’s bad or wrong but it does put off some people and alienate others who may not want to or maybe have a very difficult time understanding “high tech” or just new concepts in general. Almost everyone knows approximately how much their phones last when it is fully charged....why not stick with a concept that most people are already familiar with? Much like, “I know that I can get home with 1/4 tank of gas”...isn’t it just the same as saying “I know that I can get home with 1/4 battery charge”.?

 

[pezzy84]

That's interesting ... any idea what kind of extra charge is imposed on someone who leaves the car sitting too long after charging is completed?

This really depends on the station and how the algorithm is setup. The Chargepoint level 2 charging station I use at work is $.90/hour (20 miles) for the first 3 hours then doubles to $1.80/hour after that, if I run to near empty on my low range 84 mile E-Golf it will be ~4 hours to recharge. Fortunately the algorithm for this station I can stop the charging remotely but stay plugged in and not be charged any additional, I only do this if the other bay remains/stays open, if I see the other bay is in use I will take a quick break and move my car to open it up for someone else. Pre-pandemic I would have to move my car pretty much 90% of the time, now it does not get much use so 90% of the time I can just leave my car plugged in but not charging.

 

[blingo]

Even regarding more technical aspects it's perfectly fine to communicate along something like "from 20% to 80% within 15 minutes"
https://insideevs.com/news/461777/hyundai-ioniq-5-342-miles-wltp-range/

Why shouldn't people remain free to translate from there in any fashion they like when peddling the line regarding the most universal practical aspects? Space get's plastered with satellites to let people download games or telephone books and bibles per hour.

 

[4WD]

That's another big plus, no underground storage tanks full of fuels. There can be 20 charging stations all in a row and nothing but wires and conduit in the ground. Twenty level two's at a full 7000 watts each, and a 120,000 volt line transformered down to them, puts a whopping 140 watts on the main line, very possible to do. Or do you have your oil tank under the garage floor?

But for now … how many Tesla owners only have an EV … Jeff has a nice car stable started

 

[Snagglefoot]

Year end is here. Not trying to be difficult but it would be nice to see how folks with solar panels are making out on $/mile it cost them this year. So, we know the solar panel systems had a capital cost and most were told their panels would be paid off on X cents per kWh produced, in about 8 years or there a-bouts. ( another Newfie term) So, let’s take 1/8 of the capital cost and prorate the number of kWhr the car would take and divide by the miles driven this past year. Is this fair? So how many kWhrs of energy were required to drive for the year, how much I did that cost on a sell-back-to the grid basis, and proportionately how much power was allocated to the car vs the total system. Then divide that price by the number of miles.

Bragging rights for solar energy cannot be conferred until the 9th year. Then the owners can have the next 16 years or so to crow. Also, I believe most EVs charge at night when there is no solar energy available so we are really talking about the sell back price to the grid when calculating the worth of the power to charge the car. Now if someone wants to talk about using a Power Wall, then they have to add the capital cost of the wall. There is no such thing as free solar power until all the capital costs are paid off.

 

[4WD]

Year end is here. Not trying to be difficult but it would be nice to see how folks with solar panels are making out on $/mile it cost them this year. So, we know the solar panel systems had a capital cost and most were told their panels would be paid off on a cents per kw produced, in about 8 years or there a-bouts. ( another Newfie term) So, let’s take 1/8 of the capital cost and divide by the miles driven this past year. Is this fair?

Bragging rights for solar energy cannot be conferred until the 9th year. Then the owners can have the next 16 years or so to crow.

Is there a Lemon Law for them ?
https://www.nist.gov/news-events/ne...tential-driver-premature-solar-panel-failures

 

[JeffKeryk]

But for now … how many Tesla owners only have an EV … Jeff has a nice car stable started

Exactly.
I don't know any EV owners that have only 1 car.
And I know a lotta i3, Leaf and Bolt owners who bought (or leased) mainly to take advantage of the commuter lane and other EV perks.
The same thing happened when hybrids came out. Big C-Level execs driving a Prius or Civic hybrid through the week and their Porsches (Ferraris!) on Fridays.
If I could have only 1 vehicle, it would not be the Tesla.

 

[UncleDave]

Do realize people tend to store gas/diesel AT home and hand/battery power pump if needed, lmao. I'd take my chances trying to source gas than electricity. EVs have their place in life for some, but will never replace fuel burning for the majority of population.

Only a few in the city store fuel ..how many store enough gasoline for even one full tank of fuel?
Then rotate it regularly?

How much fuel do you have on hand right now?

Living rurally if we lose power we lose water, so I cant take chances and had to prep backup power so I can make power - but I cant refine fuel.

Never is an awfully long time, I wouldn't take that bet, but I would say for the next 20 years liquid fuel will remain dominant but the switch is starting.

 

[UncleDave]

But for now … how many Tesla owners only have an EV … Jeff has a nice car stable started

I want to know if Jeff has a sister?

 

[JeffKeryk]

I want to know if Jeff has a sister?

My sister Patty lives with her family in Gig Harbor, WA. Mark drove my '68 Vette 20 years ago and got the bug.
He bought a '69 Coupe, then a '62 Fuelie Basket. He also has my '68. Mark has become very knowledgeable on the mechanical fuel injection systems.
Mark and Patty are very good people. Me? Not so much...