getting car quotes via email negotiation

Here's the best writeup I have seen in remotely buying a new car. I'll use it if and when the time comes, plus, it's entertaining. If spending some time and effort to save thousands is worth it to you then this should work well: (Dude was looking for a Tacoma, but this will work for any vehicle)

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This is the approach on pretty much any commodity product and service negotiation.
 
Here's the best writeup I have seen in remotely buying a new car. I'll use it if and when the time comes, plus, it's entertaining. If spending some time and effort to save thousands is worth it to you then this should work well: (Dude was looking for a Tacoma, but this will work for any vehicle)

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Here's the thing, one complaint I often hear is that people want (and certainly in this thread) expect an uncomplicated buying process that gets straight to the point. This write-up you posted effectively advises the reader to go out of their way to take as much time as possible and make an excessive amount of effort to grind out "the best deal" by contacting as many dealerships as feasible. 150 dealerships, really?!?

So what is it, is the goal to simplify the process or make it as complex and time consuming as possible? Personally I (and many others) simply don't have the time or just don't want to spend an excess of time buying a vehicle. Honestly I get to a point that I just want to get it done and am willing to accept the reality that a deal is what it is and I either buy or I don't get the vehicle. Trying to grind out a better deal is what customers commit to doing of their own volition and then complain about as if they were being victimized by the business.

When I purchased my 2021 Outback recently I was able to buy it for right around internal cost as well as get the top extended warranty for $900 under internal cost. I visited 5 dealerships over the course of 3 days and made my purchase decision based upon the fact that one dealership was willing to put in the work to get me approved for financing terms with an OTD cost that exceeded my expectations.
 
FWIW at this point I would not be surprised if many dealerships are in revolt to the E-Price revolution as it were (for lack of a better way of putting it right off hand). If a customer is not willing to make the effort to come to their dealership they are not willing to make the effort to communicate with said customer. Frankly I am aware of many dealerships that do quite well taking walk-ins ("ups" in business speak) because they likely have more than enough to work with. The way I see it, if a dealership is not responding they don't immediately need your business which is not to suggest that they do not want it but rather that they want you to come into the dealership to work out a mutual agreement that is intrinsic to every business deal.

To be perfectly honest communicating with a dealership without showing up in person allows them to collect information on you and their potential customer base at large. Even if you never show up there is meta data that you provide to them that they can use for analytics, that data is quite valuable in the grand scheme of things believe it or not. When I was in the business I was happy to collect as much of that data as potential customers were willing to send me so I could retain it in a database for future potential usage. It is nothing nefarious, no Edward Snowden is going to be a whistle blower against this practice as the customer is the one volunteering this data with willful consent, but like I said it can be put to use for business purposes in some way.
At the end of the day, they lost a customer that will bad mouth them every chance he gets. I do see though that my miniscule negative effect to their bottom line is far more than offset by the positive effects of their strategy overall.

There is a conflict to this philosophy though. Dealerships will stoop to despicable levels for a buck, theoretically demonstrating desperation, although it could be argued that these types are simply not comfortable in life unless they're doing something unethical. Despite that, they'll turn around and throw a potential sale away which required no more than a few seconds of typing to get. Now I understand most people might turn it into a huge conversation like suggested above, but that's not me. One or two simple questions answered and I would have shown up and bought the vehicle.

It's almost as if they are not comfortable with a legitimate sale earned in an ethical, professional manner. There has to be some sort of manipulation involved, or it just isn't worth it! :LOL:
 
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If I cannot build a relationship with a dealership I am in the wrong place.
My goal is not a single purchase, it is a long term, multiple purchase relationship.
I want a fair price; I want them to make a profit so they will be there for the next time I need a car.
Fot example, I have purchased 4 cars at a local Honda dealership and 4 cars at a local Lexus dealership.
If they do not value my patronage, I am in the wrong place.
In turn, I need to value the service they povide me.
 
Here is a good case study on what I was eluding to earlier. Here are the questions I would ask of the customer as someone who has no interest in selling them a car but has insight into how those in the car business think and react to such an inquiry:

1. What are your expectations for pricing? What are you seeking to accomplish? Why I ask is because right now the "best price" is MSRP. You have stated that buying a car at MSRP will not garner your commitment to purchase, so in your mind what will?

2. What if no one is willing to meet your expectations for pricing? Let's say that all are at or near MSRP and will not budge, what is "good enough" for you to commit to purchase?

3. What if one of those dealerships that you are now excluding from your shopping process one that would, at the end of the day, be willing to offer a better deal than all the others but YOU are not going to get that deal because you initiated the non-committal game playing which turned them off to doing business with you?

What I am about to say may be perceived as accusatory, that is in no way the intention nor is it directed at anyone here. One thing that people need to understand is that car dealerships are not simply desperate to sell any vehicle to anyone. I have seen too many people with some semblance of an entitlement complex shopping and believing this when they have no idea what they are seeking to accomplish in acquiring a vehicle. When you do this you make the process waaaay more difficult on yourself and all others involved.
Ignatius, to answer your questions:
1. Doing some online research, i.e. from Edmunds and a couple of other sources the average discount that people have reported is around $6000 off of MSRP. I have no way of knowing of that was from in stock vehicles, ordered vehicles or both. So my commitment to purchase will be from a dealer who offers a price concession in the $5K - $7K range. One dealer did allude to the fact (via a phone conversation) that if I didn't take advantage of their 0% financing, a cash discount could be applied. I will add that this is a luxury vehicle with an MSRP in excess of $100K and not a commodity/basic transportation vehicle in the sub-$40k range.

2. If there is price collusion among dealers and none will budge from MSRP I will grudgingly buy from the most convenient dealer.

3. Not sure what you are getting at. In my email to dealers I clearly stated that I was READY TO BUY. Since one didn't respond at all, and the other dug in their heels and said MSRP, period, why would I contact them again or how would I know that they would now be willing to give a better deal ?

Bottom line is the first dealer to make an effort to make a slam dunk sale by offering a reasonable discount is going to take my money. I'm not one of those buyers who will pinch a penny until Abe Lincoln cries "uncle" but I'm not one to pay MSRP either.
 
Here's the thing, one complaint I often hear is that people want (and certainly in this thread) expect an uncomplicated buying process that gets straight to the point. This write-up you posted effectively advises the reader to go out of their way to take as much time as possible and make an excessive amount of effort to grind out "the best deal" by contacting as many dealerships as feasible. 150 dealerships, really?!?

So what is it, is the goal to simplify the process or make it as complex and time consuming as possible? Personally I (and many others) simply don't have the time or just don't want to spend an excess of time buying a vehicle. Honestly I get to a point that I just want to get it done and am willing to accept the reality that a deal is what it is and I either buy or I don't get the vehicle. Trying to grind out a better deal is what customers commit to doing of their own volition and then complain about as if they were being victimized by the business.
So let's see...you are complaining about my post trying to help OP. OK.

The title of the thread is:

getting car quotes via email negotiation​


No plan is for everyone. Go ahead and pay whatever you want to pay, and buy however you choose to buy.

It's a suggestion trying to help someone who asked for suggestions.

If you can't handle it, or don't like it, I suggest you move along.
 
If I cannot build a relationship with a dealership I am in the wrong place.
My goal is not a single purchase, it is a long term, multiple purchase relationship.
I want a fair price; I want them to make a profit so they will be there for the next time I need a car.
Fot example, I have purchased 4 cars at a local Honda dealership and 4 cars at a local Lexus dealership.
If they do not value my patronage, I am in the wrong place.
In turn, I need to value the service they povide me.

Why? My goal is to never return unless I need warranty service and that has happened once in the last 15 years. I do maintenance myself, why do I want or need any kind of a relationship with the dealer?
 
My friend recently bought a vehicle. They emailed 5 non-local dealers within a 150 mile radius and asked for those dealers best price. They then took the lowest quote from those 5 dealers to the local dealer 2 miles down the road from their house, and basically said "I will buy from you today if you sell the car to me for this price." The local dealer matched the email quote and they drove the new car home that day. They had no intention of ever driving up to 150 miles away to buy the car, but simply used the dealers for pricing. Kind of explains why dealers are getting more and more hesitant to send email quotes.

I work in a non-auto sales organization, and we have customers all day long that do the same thing to us. They will forward us a price quote from a competitor and ask us to meet or beat the price to win the business. We hate that. We pride ourselves in providing industry leading pre-sales and post-sales support to our customers and many times cannot meet or beat low ball price quotes and give customers the level of support or payment options they want (on top of the bargain basement price.) There have been times where we have had to turn away business due to pricing that is just too low. The customer buys from the other vendor, doesn't like the service the other vendor provides, and then reaches out to us to fix their problems. We will help the customer, and gently remind them of our overall value when it comes time for them to buy additional products or services (at a price higher than they paid to the other vendor.)

My next car I buy, I am simply going to go in with two numbers. The price I am willing to pay for the new car ($150-$350 above published invoice but before available incentives) and what I would like for my trade. If they say yes to both numbers, it will be a quick done deal. If they start to fool around I will walk. I am tired of spending 3-4 hours at the dealer. There is simply no reason for it.
 
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At the end of the day, they lost a customer that will bad mouth them every chance he gets. I do see though that my miniscule negative effect to their bottom line is far more than offset by the positive effects of their strategy overall.

There is a conflict to this philosophy though. Dealerships will stoop to despicable levels for a buck, theoretically demonstrating desperation, although it could be argued that these types are simply not comfortable in life unless they're doing something unethical. Despite that, they'll turn around and throw a potential sale away which required no more than a few seconds of typing to get. Now I understand most people might turn it into a huge conversation like suggested above, but that's not me. One or two simple questions answered and I would have shown up and bought the vehicle.

It's almost as if they are not comfortable with a legitimate sale earned in an ethical, professional manner. There has to be some sort of manipulation involved, or it just isn't worth it! :LOL:

OMGosh you guys are too much! 🤣

Three things I learned that were incredibly helpful in making me successful in this business:

1. Don't care about what other people think of you, it is not something anyone can control.
2. Be as straight forward as possible despite the craziness you may encounter.
3. Recognize that despite your best efforts and logic behind them, some people just will not buy a car from you for reasons that you will never understand.

Arguably the most popular thread on the Subaru website I have run for over 17 years was entitled "Tales from the Dealership" and it was primarily me talking about my experiences and perspectives from someone working in auto sales. Though I closed that thread down a few years ago after I got out the business the one thing that I constantly encountered from those contributing to the thread with questions is a dynamic of thinking that the car business is the bad guy by default while the customer, no matter what they did, was the good guy by default that was "forced" into being untruthful, deceitful, and outright lying to people in the business.

This mindset is so endemic as part of the American psyche. That other people do not cause our reactions is a difficult concept, so automatically have we come to associate our feelings with what someone else is doing (or perhaps insinuate that they are doing even if they have done nothing at all).
 
I tried email negotiating prices for my last 2 new cars and it was an epic failure. I initiated contact with the "internet" sales depts and got back scripted responses that essentially wanted me to come into the showroom first. What made it more annoying was that I would get emails from multiple people and didn't have a single point of contact. Had to go in and negotiate the annoying old school way to get the prices I wanted (which I did).

So yeah... I hear all these stories about people getting excellent deals thru email alone and only having to step foot in the dealership to get the keys but my two experiences have been to the contrary.
 
I'm going with CostCo next time around. The extra $500.00 bucks(or less) spread over a 5 year loan is well worth it IMHO. Life's too short. There is a "cabal" of mainstream dealerships in the Salt Lake Valley (not counting the luxury lines). Basically owned by three different families. Though I haven't attempted it-I would expect the "email method" to fall flat on it's face. You can either buy through them or drive to Las Vegas.
 
This mindset is so endemic as part of the American psyche. That other people do not cause our reactions is a difficult concept, so automatically have we come to associate our feelings with what someone else is doing (or perhaps insinuate that they are doing even if they have done nothing at all).
No I'm not saying they're the bad guy. I'm saying they're downright evil. Let me be clear about that. "Bad" would be an improvement.

No amount of "Yeah well I-I-I-I-I had morals when I did it", or "Oh, but this one dealership in Hoboken is great!" is going to make me re-envision my firsthand encounters over decades, every single one of which is tainted with despicable behavior from every dealership I've ever visited. There are exceptions but they're what a statistician would call an "outlier".

This may just be a difference in moral standard, IE what one views as acceptable behavior versus another.

What is funny is #3 is a direct result of the rampant occurrence of #1 and the near zero occurence of #2. Further, no amount of crazy from a customer justifies hideous behavior from the other, and vice versa. Old cliche, "two wrongs don't make a right".
 
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I tried email negotiating prices for my last 2 new cars and it was an epic failure. I initiated contact with the "internet" sales depts and got back scripted responses that essentially wanted me to come into the showroom first. What made it more annoying was that I would get emails from multiple people and didn't have a single point of contact. Had to go in and negotiate the annoying old school way to get the prices I wanted (which I did).

So yeah... I hear all these stories about people getting excellent deals thru email alone and only having to step foot in the dealership to get the keys but my two experiences have been to the contrary.
Which cars and location?
My experience with internet sales has been great. The reps have been helpful and not pushy. They tell me what they can and can't do.
I would never step into a dealership cold.
 
Why? My goal is to never return unless I need warranty service and that has happened once in the last 15 years. I do maintenance myself, why do I want or need any kind of a relationship with the dealer?
Future busines. Vehicles are some of the largest purchases we make.
I want to be on good terms with the company when I am spending this much money.

When I bought the GS (used) the General Manager came into the room and told the sales manager, "He has bought 2 new RXs from us."
The resulting price was very much to my liking.
 
Find another dealer. The last few cars I've bought have been over email and phone, I will never negotiate in person again.

If they're difficult to deal with over email, it's not going to get any better in person.
This is the best and most succinct advise, IMHO.

The last two purchases I made were via e-mail. The Cobalt was strictly e-mail until I went in to finalize the deal, and the Sonata was mostly e-mail with a call from the sales guy following up on the quote he sent me. But after that call it was a formality for me to go in and finish things.

I also helped a family member purchase a car where we went into the dealer to look around and used the internet pricing to help finalize the deal. '

If they want to sell you a car they will do so however they can; if they want to string you along, move on and find someone else who will work with you.
 
Future busines. Vehicles are some of the largest purchases we make.
I want to be on good terms with the company when I am spending this much money.

When I bought the GS (used) the General Manager came into the room and told the sales manager, "He has bought 2 new RXs from us."
The resulting price was very much to my liking.

I have found the dealers I have purchased cars from make absolutely no effort to keep in touch with me after purchase. I have been trying to get the dealership that sold me my current vehicle to send me the prorated refund for my GAP Insurance. I paid the car off early and am due a prorated refund per state law. The GAP Insurance company sent me the paperwork needed by the dealership to process the refund. The dealership has been working on it for over a year. I finally spoke to my sales guy, who had no recollection of who I was. I explained who I was, and what was needed, and there has been no communication since then. The General Manager of the dealership was able to get the sales rep to call me, however we are back to square one again. Not very impressive.

I have also had car dealers literally not know who I was mere weeks after buying a car. I will go in for service, wander out on the sales floor, and have the rep that sold me my car approach me and ask if I was in the market for a new car. I will explain that I just bought my car from them a few weeks prior and they act like they have no idea.

Most dealer's don't care about long-term relationships. They want the immediate sale and then you are out of sight, out of mind.
 
I have found the dealers I have purchased cars from make absolutely no effort to keep in touch with me after purchase. I have been trying to get the dealership that sold me my current vehicle to send me the prorated refund for my GAP Insurance. I paid the car off early and am due a prorated refund per state law. The GAP Insurance company sent me the paperwork needed by the dealership to process the refund. The dealership has been working on it for over a year. I finally spoke to my sales guy, who had no recollection of who I was. I explained who I was, and what was needed, and there has been no communication since then. The General Manager of the dealership was able to get the sales rep to call me, however we are back to square one again. Not very impressive.

I have also had car dealers literally not know who I was mere weeks after buying a car. I will go in for service, wander out on the sales floor, and have the rep that sold me my car approach me and ask if I was in the market for a new car. I will explain that I just bought my car from them a few weeks prior and they act like they have no idea.

Most dealer's don't care about long-term relationships. They want the immediate sale and then you are out of sight, out of mind.
Which car and which general location? Is it Chevrolet in Pennsylvania?
Most of my experiences have been far better; I am almost friends with the dealer managers and sales reps afterwards.
However, a Honda dealership I dealt with was similar to your experience. 1 guy was great and 1 was a "one deal" guy.

From the posts on this thread, it seems I am in the minority. I am sorry to learn this, but I guess it's true.
I have to believe it has to do with the manufacturer's business model. Dunno for sure.
 
Relationship with the dealer.
I have bought 3 cars from the same Hyundai dealer and take the two I have now there for oil changes(they wash the car thats worth 8 or 9 bucks alone)
Bought them all from the same low key salesman.
If he's there and sees me he always greets me by name and we chit chat about the new cars.
They have an awesome coffee machine that makes great coffee.
I would feel comfortable enough just to stop in and have a cup and look at cars.
 
Relationship with the dealer.
I have bought 3 cars from the same Hyundai dealer and take the two I have now there for oil changes(they wash the car thats worth 8 or 9 bucks alone)
Bought them all from the same low key salesman.
If he's there and sees me he always greets me by name and we chit chat about the new cars.
They have an awesome coffee machine that makes great coffee.
I would feel comfortable enough just to stop in and have a cup and look at cars.
Well said; that's my story.
I get coffee at Putnam Lexus from time to time.
 
Which car and which general location? Is it Chevrolet in Pennsylvania?
Most of my experiences have been far better; I am almost friends with the dealer managers and sales reps afterwards.
However, a Honda dealership I dealt with was similar to your experience. 1 guy was great and 1 was a "one deal" guy.

From the posts on this thread, it seems I am in the minority. I am sorry to learn this, but I guess it's true.
I have to believe it has to do with the manufacturer's business model. Dunno for sure.

It has been every dealer here in PA (Ford, GM, Dodge, Jeep, Hyundai, Honda, VW, Toyota, etc.) The sales team gets the sale and that is it. Service is hit or miss. I will be in the market for a new car in the next year or so, and am steering away from GM products simply due to the overall ownership experience (sales and service.) I have nothing against GM products and have owned 6 in the past 30 years, but their sales channel is kind of ruining it for them.

I hear a lot of people say things like "I have a sales guy at the dealership...I will call him and see what he says". None of the sales people I have ever dealt with in the past 30 years have put forth any inclination that they want to be my "sales guy" in the long term.
 
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