Geico 500 at Talladega
- Thread starter bdcardinal
- Start date
- Status
Lap 182, caution withdrawn, red flag displayed for cleanup.
Red flag withdrawn, yellow displayed, quickie yellow.
17 spun taking the white flag, 42 and 81 hard hits on the backstretch.
42 flipped numerous times. looks like the 38 and 24 were involved also.
![[Linked Image]](https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/attachments/usergals/2019/04/full-8895-32073-elliott.aspx.jpeg "[Linked Image]")
Unofficial results:
1. Elliott
2. Bowman
3. Preece
4. Hemric
5. Logano
6. Kurt Busch
7. Newman
8. Almirola
9. Kyle Busch
10. Gaughan
11. LaJoie
1. Elliott
2. Bowman
3. Preece
4. Hemric
5. Logano
6. Kurt Busch
7. Newman
8. Almirola
9. Kyle Busch
10. Gaughan
11. LaJoie
Was nothing more than a PR move to try and generate interest.
quote=billt460]
Originally Posted by JasonC
This is such a joke. Horrible excuse for racing.
They gave them 100 more horsepower so they can drag a bigger parachute.[/quote]
quote=billt460]
Originally Posted by JasonC
This is such a joke. Horrible excuse for racing.
They gave them 100 more horsepower so they can drag a bigger parachute.[/quote]
I did. 5 laps was enough. They should be ashamed to call this racing.
Originally Posted by Malo83
Originally Posted by JasonC
This is such a joke. Horrible excuse for racing.
Turn the channel and don't watch
Originally Posted by Malo83
Originally Posted by JasonC
This is such a joke. Horrible excuse for racing.
Turn the channel and don't watch
Originally Posted by JasonC
Was nothing more than a PR move to try and generate interest.
That's exactly all it was. The networks were as bad or worse than NASCAR in hyping all of this, "100 added horsepower" nonsense for over a week straight. They were all making it sound as if these cars were going to really have added power, speed, and increased performance. But notice they didn't carry on about the 9" spoiler they now have to drag around with them. Instead they kept B.S.'ing the fans into thinking this was all going to amount to something it wasn't and didn't.
The cars were no faster. They kept babbling on before and during the race about the supposed, "faster closing rate". More nothing. Get hung out alone and you're going to the rear.... Same as before. There was nothing different in the way this race was run. You had the same 40 cars that can't get out of each others way. All bunched up in rows of 2 or 3, playing bumper tag trying to push each other around the track.... Until someone does something stupid and makes a big mess. Which someone always does.... Usually several times. Then they can cut away to a dozen more commercials.
They force the teams to go through all of this added fabrication, development, testing, and expense. And the results are the exact same schitt show they put on before. Boring "racing" on a track that was built for 200+ MPH speeds. And achieved it in the first race they ran there back in 1969. So now they all stand around trying to dupe the fans into thinking they are getting to watch something they're not. When the harsh reality is they were faster half a century ago. When they started with a car from the dealership. And not a pile of tubing laying on the floor.
Was nothing more than a PR move to try and generate interest.
That's exactly all it was. The networks were as bad or worse than NASCAR in hyping all of this, "100 added horsepower" nonsense for over a week straight. They were all making it sound as if these cars were going to really have added power, speed, and increased performance. But notice they didn't carry on about the 9" spoiler they now have to drag around with them. Instead they kept B.S.'ing the fans into thinking this was all going to amount to something it wasn't and didn't.
The cars were no faster. They kept babbling on before and during the race about the supposed, "faster closing rate". More nothing. Get hung out alone and you're going to the rear.... Same as before. There was nothing different in the way this race was run. You had the same 40 cars that can't get out of each others way. All bunched up in rows of 2 or 3, playing bumper tag trying to push each other around the track.... Until someone does something stupid and makes a big mess. Which someone always does.... Usually several times. Then they can cut away to a dozen more commercials.
They force the teams to go through all of this added fabrication, development, testing, and expense. And the results are the exact same schitt show they put on before. Boring "racing" on a track that was built for 200+ MPH speeds. And achieved it in the first race they ran there back in 1969. So now they all stand around trying to dupe the fans into thinking they are getting to watch something they're not. When the harsh reality is they were faster half a century ago. When they started with a car from the dealership. And not a pile of tubing laying on the floor.
You hit the nail on the head. Funny, that they won't mention that 50 years ago the cars were faster, the crew chiefs could actually make changes to the car, there was no pit road speed, no get your lap back freebies, and yet no driver or crew member was seriously hurt.
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by JasonC
Was nothing more than a PR move to try and generate interest.
That's exactly all it was. The networks were as bad or worse than NASCAR in hyping all of this, "100 added horsepower" nonsense for over a week straight. They were all making it sound as if these cars were going to really have added power, speed, and increased performance. But notice they didn't carry on about the 9" spoiler they now have to drag around with them. Instead they kept B.S.'ing the fans into thinking this was all going to amount to something it wasn't and didn't.
The cars were no faster. They kept babbling on before and during the race about the supposed, "faster closing rate". More nothing. Get hung out alone and you're going to the rear.... Same as before. There was nothing different in the way this race was run. You had the same 40 cars that can't get out of each others way. All bunched up in rows of 2 or 3, playing bumper tag trying to push each other around the track.... Until someone does something stupid and makes a big mess. Which someone always does.... Usually several times. Then they can cut away to a dozen more commercials.
T
hey force the teams to go through all of this added fabrication, development, testing, and expense. And the results are the exact same schitt show they put on before. Boring "racing" on a track that was built for 200+ MPH speeds. And achieved it in the first race they ran there back in 1969. So now they all stand around trying to dupe the fans into thinking they are getting to watch something they're not. When the harsh reality is they were faster half a century ago. When they started with a car from the dealership. And not a pile of tubing laying on the floor.
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by JasonC
Was nothing more than a PR move to try and generate interest.
That's exactly all it was. The networks were as bad or worse than NASCAR in hyping all of this, "100 added horsepower" nonsense for over a week straight. They were all making it sound as if these cars were going to really have added power, speed, and increased performance. But notice they didn't carry on about the 9" spoiler they now have to drag around with them. Instead they kept B.S.'ing the fans into thinking this was all going to amount to something it wasn't and didn't.
The cars were no faster. They kept babbling on before and during the race about the supposed, "faster closing rate". More nothing. Get hung out alone and you're going to the rear.... Same as before. There was nothing different in the way this race was run. You had the same 40 cars that can't get out of each others way. All bunched up in rows of 2 or 3, playing bumper tag trying to push each other around the track.... Until someone does something stupid and makes a big mess. Which someone always does.... Usually several times. Then they can cut away to a dozen more commercials.
T
hey force the teams to go through all of this added fabrication, development, testing, and expense. And the results are the exact same schitt show they put on before. Boring "racing" on a track that was built for 200+ MPH speeds. And achieved it in the first race they ran there back in 1969. So now they all stand around trying to dupe the fans into thinking they are getting to watch something they're not. When the harsh reality is they were faster half a century ago. When they started with a car from the dealership. And not a pile of tubing laying on the floor.
NASCAR is in serious trouble with their older fans stop watching and the younger folks into Import racing and drifting.
Originally Posted by JasonC
You hit the nail on the head. Funny, that they won't mention that 50 years ago the cars were faster, the crew chiefs could actually make changes to the car, there was no pit road speed, no get your lap back freebies, and yet no driver or crew member was seriously hurt.
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by JasonC
Was nothing more than a PR move to try and generate interest.
That's exactly all it was. The networks were as bad or worse than NASCAR in hyping all of this, "100 added horsepower" nonsense for over a week straight. They were all making it sound as if these cars were going to really have added power, speed, and increased performance. But notice they didn't carry on about the 9" spoiler they now have to drag around with them. Instead they kept B.S.'ing the fans into thinking this was all going to amount to something it wasn't and didn't.
The cars were no faster. They kept babbling on before and during the race about the supposed, "faster closing rate". More nothing. Get hung out alone and you're going to the rear.... Same as before. There was nothing different in the way this race was run. You had the same 40 cars that can't get out of each others way. All bunched up in rows of 2 or 3, playing bumper tag trying to push each other around the track.... Until someone does something stupid and makes a big mess. Which someone always does.... Usually several times. Then they can cut away to a dozen more commercials.
T
hey force the teams to go through all of this added fabrication, development, testing, and expense. And the results are the exact same schitt show they put on before. Boring "racing" on a track that was built for 200+ MPH speeds. And achieved it in the first race they ran there back in 1969. So now they all stand around trying to dupe the fans into thinking they are getting to watch something they're not. When the harsh reality is they were faster half a century ago. When they started with a car from the dealership. And not a pile of tubing laying on the floor.
Ahh no.. not accurate...
A crew member was killed at Atlanta.... Ricky Rudd car locked up the brakes and hit a crew from behind... Causing severe head trauma to the poor tire changer on the other crew...
That's why they added a pit road speed... Though one could say it was not due to speed. Watching the accident at Atlanta... Seems a brake mechanical failure was more likely the issue.
And if I'm not wrong Bill Elliot had 2 crew members die on on pit road accident at Talladega... Have to double check that...
Having said all that....
If and I mean if they were to run unrestricted... Speeds would be 230+ mph...
Now I am ok with that. But huge changes needed to that track... 1) move back and elevate the stands... Two barriers between the track and fans may well be necessary. 2) Flag stand... Would have to be automated and no person in it... The flag man darn near got killed in Bobby Allison's wreck... 3) Those car would need even more safety features in them... 4) the walls would need another barrier in addition to the safer walls already there... 5) the infield may well need some changes as well to keep cars and spectators separate....
I am ok with all of the above....
But if one thinks this will lead to better racing... May well need to watch older races... I have to say there certainly we're some good races back then... But there were some run away races has well... One thing was totally impressive was Bill Elliot driving from two laps down under the green to come back and win a race... That would be interesting to see again.
Also... Let's go back to North Wilkesboro, Rockingham... Get rid of stupid mile and a half cookie cutter tracks... Let's go to Eldora... Let's get rid of ISC and Speedway Corp... Let's cut the schedule down to 25 races... Let's get rid of the current ownership of NASCAR... Get Tony Stewart/Dale Earnhardt Jr in there...and many more changes... As well.
You hit the nail on the head. Funny, that they won't mention that 50 years ago the cars were faster, the crew chiefs could actually make changes to the car, there was no pit road speed, no get your lap back freebies, and yet no driver or crew member was seriously hurt.
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by JasonC
Was nothing more than a PR move to try and generate interest.
That's exactly all it was. The networks were as bad or worse than NASCAR in hyping all of this, "100 added horsepower" nonsense for over a week straight. They were all making it sound as if these cars were going to really have added power, speed, and increased performance. But notice they didn't carry on about the 9" spoiler they now have to drag around with them. Instead they kept B.S.'ing the fans into thinking this was all going to amount to something it wasn't and didn't.
The cars were no faster. They kept babbling on before and during the race about the supposed, "faster closing rate". More nothing. Get hung out alone and you're going to the rear.... Same as before. There was nothing different in the way this race was run. You had the same 40 cars that can't get out of each others way. All bunched up in rows of 2 or 3, playing bumper tag trying to push each other around the track.... Until someone does something stupid and makes a big mess. Which someone always does.... Usually several times. Then they can cut away to a dozen more commercials.
T
hey force the teams to go through all of this added fabrication, development, testing, and expense. And the results are the exact same schitt show they put on before. Boring "racing" on a track that was built for 200+ MPH speeds. And achieved it in the first race they ran there back in 1969. So now they all stand around trying to dupe the fans into thinking they are getting to watch something they're not. When the harsh reality is they were faster half a century ago. When they started with a car from the dealership. And not a pile of tubing laying on the floor.
Ahh no.. not accurate...
A crew member was killed at Atlanta.... Ricky Rudd car locked up the brakes and hit a crew from behind... Causing severe head trauma to the poor tire changer on the other crew...
That's why they added a pit road speed... Though one could say it was not due to speed. Watching the accident at Atlanta... Seems a brake mechanical failure was more likely the issue.
And if I'm not wrong Bill Elliot had 2 crew members die on on pit road accident at Talladega... Have to double check that...
Having said all that....
If and I mean if they were to run unrestricted... Speeds would be 230+ mph...
Now I am ok with that. But huge changes needed to that track... 1) move back and elevate the stands... Two barriers between the track and fans may well be necessary. 2) Flag stand... Would have to be automated and no person in it... The flag man darn near got killed in Bobby Allison's wreck... 3) Those car would need even more safety features in them... 4) the walls would need another barrier in addition to the safer walls already there... 5) the infield may well need some changes as well to keep cars and spectators separate....
I am ok with all of the above....
But if one thinks this will lead to better racing... May well need to watch older races... I have to say there certainly we're some good races back then... But there were some run away races has well... One thing was totally impressive was Bill Elliot driving from two laps down under the green to come back and win a race... That would be interesting to see again.
Also... Let's go back to North Wilkesboro, Rockingham... Get rid of stupid mile and a half cookie cutter tracks... Let's go to Eldora... Let's get rid of ISC and Speedway Corp... Let's cut the schedule down to 25 races... Let's get rid of the current ownership of NASCAR... Get Tony Stewart/Dale Earnhardt Jr in there...and many more changes... As well.
The reason that Bill made up those two laps under green was because his Thunderbird wasn't as wide as the other cars. NASCAR didn't have templates for width back then and his crew chief worked around the rule book. Therefore his car was able to cut through the air. Awesome feet and awesome ingenuity on the part of the crew chief.
Only a handful of drivers and crew members have ever been killed over the course of 70 years of NASCAR. Main reason for the pit road speed limits and forced cautions is so the revolving billboards aka racecars can get more screen time. It's all about the $$$$$
Only a handful of drivers and crew members have ever been killed over the course of 70 years of NASCAR. Main reason for the pit road speed limits and forced cautions is so the revolving billboards aka racecars can get more screen time. It's all about the $$$$$
Again... Pit road accident that killed that guy in Atlanta started pit road speed limits... And having lead lap cars and lap down cars pit on separate times/laps was a part of that too... Nothing to do with blanking commercials.
Hey... I'm no fan of the stupid stage stuff... They should just keep on running... No caution flags..
And yeah I have seen dumb caution flags at times... Especially near the end of races... That trend started more and more in the early 2000s.
If not for some strange caution flags... You would legitimately only have 10 to as little as 3-4 cars on the lead lap at times.... In 1990 Rockingham race Kyle Peety actually lapped the entire field at one point... In 1993 Geoffrey Bodine lapped everybody except Mark Martin... And I think maybe Rusty Wallace... That 400 lap race at North Wilkesboro did not have a single caution flag... 0. This is what NASCAR does need to get to doing... Because it was a whole lot more real during that time... Yeah some races only had 2-5 cars on the lead lap at the end of the race... But it was real.
Hey... I'm no fan of the stupid stage stuff... They should just keep on running... No caution flags..
And yeah I have seen dumb caution flags at times... Especially near the end of races... That trend started more and more in the early 2000s.
If not for some strange caution flags... You would legitimately only have 10 to as little as 3-4 cars on the lead lap at times.... In 1990 Rockingham race Kyle Peety actually lapped the entire field at one point... In 1993 Geoffrey Bodine lapped everybody except Mark Martin... And I think maybe Rusty Wallace... That 400 lap race at North Wilkesboro did not have a single caution flag... 0. This is what NASCAR does need to get to doing... Because it was a whole lot more real during that time... Yeah some races only had 2-5 cars on the lead lap at the end of the race... But it was real.
The pit road speed limit at Talladega is ridiculous. Those cars come off the turn at 190+ MPH. Then they are forced to slam on the brakes to avoid a speeding penalty. There have been several accidents because of cars losing control over this. Brad Keselowski almost wrecked, spinning 180 into his pit box. It made the highlight reel because it looked cool. It could have just as easily been posted as an, "over 18" video at Live Leak, if he had spun past his pit box, and pinned another crew member between his car and the wall.
This is a classic case where the cure, ("speed limit"), is causing the very problem it is supposed to prevent, (pit road accidents). Between the bunched up "racing", along with the stupid pit road speed limits at that track, it's causing far more danger than it's preventing. It's the same at Daytona. They've been lucky. If Austin Dillon had gone roof first into the catch fence, the fans would have been sprayed with his body parts. Instead, by going in bottom first, it tore the engine and transmission completely out of that car, and threw it clear across the track, into the infield. That car went from 190+ to 0 in 30 feet.
If that engine and transmission had instead cartwheeled through the stands, it could have killed dozens. Common sense dictates the tighter these cars are forced to race together, that more, larger, and more violent wrecks will be generated. Years of restrictor plate racing has proven this over and over. It's only a matter of time before someone, (or several fans), gets killed. Creating more carnage, while at the same time being lucky, is not the way to build a, "safety record".
This is a classic case where the cure, ("speed limit"), is causing the very problem it is supposed to prevent, (pit road accidents). Between the bunched up "racing", along with the stupid pit road speed limits at that track, it's causing far more danger than it's preventing. It's the same at Daytona. They've been lucky. If Austin Dillon had gone roof first into the catch fence, the fans would have been sprayed with his body parts. Instead, by going in bottom first, it tore the engine and transmission completely out of that car, and threw it clear across the track, into the infield. That car went from 190+ to 0 in 30 feet.
If that engine and transmission had instead cartwheeled through the stands, it could have killed dozens. Common sense dictates the tighter these cars are forced to race together, that more, larger, and more violent wrecks will be generated. Years of restrictor plate racing has proven this over and over. It's only a matter of time before someone, (or several fans), gets killed. Creating more carnage, while at the same time being lucky, is not the way to build a, "safety record".
Originally Posted by bbhero
If and I mean if they were to run unrestricted... Speeds would be 230+ mph... Now I am ok with that. But huge changes needed to that track... 1) move back and elevate the stands... Two barriers between the track and fans may well be necessary. 2) Flag stand... Would have to be automated and no person in it... 3) Those car would need even more safety features in them... 4) the walls would need another barrier in addition to the safer walls already there... 5) the infield may well need some changes as well to keep cars and spectators separate....
Here I agree. But this is the part that is so funny, it's all but laughable. If these changes were legitimately proposed, the first thing NASCAR would start screaming about is cost. They would immediately start complaining that such changes would be impossible to implement, because they would be far too cost prohibitive.
Yet, if you add up all of the expensive carnage that all of these race teams have had to contend with. Most all due to restrictor plate racing causing one, "big one" after another, they could have implemented those changes 10 times over, with money to spare. If you were to total up the cost of all of the completely destroyed race cars, involved in all of these wrecks since the introduction of restrictor plate racing, the financial monetary waste is in the tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars. Since restrictor plates were mandated at the Super Speedways back in 1988. Over 30 years ago.
Keep in mind that a competitive NASCAR Cup Car costs in the neighborhood of $200,000.00 + to build. When you add up the amount of them that have been totally destroyed in wrecks, at both Talladega and Daytona, because of bunched up plate racing, most all of which wouldn't have happened if those cars had the ability to separate themselves. They easily could have had a much faster and SAFER track today. Instead it's become nothing but a costly 195 MPH demolition derby. And one of these days it's all going to go horribly wrong.
If and I mean if they were to run unrestricted... Speeds would be 230+ mph... Now I am ok with that. But huge changes needed to that track... 1) move back and elevate the stands... Two barriers between the track and fans may well be necessary. 2) Flag stand... Would have to be automated and no person in it... 3) Those car would need even more safety features in them... 4) the walls would need another barrier in addition to the safer walls already there... 5) the infield may well need some changes as well to keep cars and spectators separate....
Here I agree. But this is the part that is so funny, it's all but laughable. If these changes were legitimately proposed, the first thing NASCAR would start screaming about is cost. They would immediately start complaining that such changes would be impossible to implement, because they would be far too cost prohibitive.
Yet, if you add up all of the expensive carnage that all of these race teams have had to contend with. Most all due to restrictor plate racing causing one, "big one" after another, they could have implemented those changes 10 times over, with money to spare. If you were to total up the cost of all of the completely destroyed race cars, involved in all of these wrecks since the introduction of restrictor plate racing, the financial monetary waste is in the tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars. Since restrictor plates were mandated at the Super Speedways back in 1988. Over 30 years ago.
Keep in mind that a competitive NASCAR Cup Car costs in the neighborhood of $200,000.00 + to build. When you add up the amount of them that have been totally destroyed in wrecks, at both Talladega and Daytona, because of bunched up plate racing, most all of which wouldn't have happened if those cars had the ability to separate themselves. They easily could have had a much faster and SAFER track today. Instead it's become nothing but a costly 195 MPH demolition derby. And one of these days it's all going to go horribly wrong.
Again, years of racing, only several deaths. That is a pretty good record. It is a dangerous sport, those that choose to work in it must accept the risks, as well as the rewards. There should be no pit road speed limits, no lucky dog, you can pit whenever you want. There also needs to be a few simple body template rules, maximum cubic inch, and a general suspension rule. And before you cry that only the big guys would win under that, the big guys pretty much always win. Sad that thy went from a 43 car field, with usually several cars failing to qualifying to these 36-37 car fields. Also, I think they should get rid of the Champions provisional. If you dont qualify fast enough, you dont make the field. That is real racing, not this controlled version of sports entertainment.
Originally Posted by bbhero
Again... Pit road accident that killed that guy in Atlanta started pit road speed limits... And having lead lap cars and lap down cars pit on separate times/laps was a part of that too... Nothing to do with blanking commercials.
Hey... I'm no fan of the stupid stage stuff... They should just keep on running... No caution flags..
And yeah I have seen dumb caution flags at times... Especially near the end of races... That trend started more and more in the early 2000s.
If not for some strange caution flags... You would legitimately only have 10 to as little as 3-4 cars on the lead lap at times.... In 1990 Rockingham race Kyle Peety actually lapped the entire field at one point... In 1993 Geoffrey Bodine lapped everybody except Mark Martin... And I think maybe Rusty Wallace... That 400 lap race at North Wilkesboro did not have a single caution flag... 0. This is what NASCAR does need to get to doing... Because it was a whole lot more real during that time... Yeah some races only had 2-5 cars on the lead lap at the end of the race... But it was real.
Originally Posted by bbhero
Again... Pit road accident that killed that guy in Atlanta started pit road speed limits... And having lead lap cars and lap down cars pit on separate times/laps was a part of that too... Nothing to do with blanking commercials.
Hey... I'm no fan of the stupid stage stuff... They should just keep on running... No caution flags..
And yeah I have seen dumb caution flags at times... Especially near the end of races... That trend started more and more in the early 2000s.
If not for some strange caution flags... You would legitimately only have 10 to as little as 3-4 cars on the lead lap at times.... In 1990 Rockingham race Kyle Peety actually lapped the entire field at one point... In 1993 Geoffrey Bodine lapped everybody except Mark Martin... And I think maybe Rusty Wallace... That 400 lap race at North Wilkesboro did not have a single caution flag... 0. This is what NASCAR does need to get to doing... Because it was a whole lot more real during that time... Yeah some races only had 2-5 cars on the lead lap at the end of the race... But it was real.
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