Fuel system cleaner before/after exhaust pictures

[gathermewool]

Originally Posted By: Artem
Originally Posted By: Smokefan1977
Originally Posted By: Artem
I've never seen the inside of an exhaust CLEAN on a car which had more then 1,000 miles on it.

I've seen clean exhaust pipes on brand new hybrids that haven't been started yet but that's about it.


Dont you think though if it cleaned the outside of the tip the interior pic would surely show improvement in some way, shape or form?


I don't see how you can expect the pipes to clean inside after using a fuel system cleaner

+1

That does sound pretty sweet, even with a [censored] camera mic. I'd love to hear it in person!

 

[Smokefan1977]

This is my same question that you are posting about. I dont see how the outside of an exhaust tip validates a fuel system cleaner working either. I just dont see what is being proven here. I suppose you have some bean stock beans from jack to

 

[Artem]

It sounds even better in person. Fly by or in car.

I went through 3 different resonators and countless trips to the muffler shop before i was happy with the exhaust note. With the cost of the $650 exhaust, i spent a good $600 on top of that in resonators and muffler shop fees.

Its worth it to me to have that supercar exhaust note, even if it's coming outta a Civic.

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: FMC
I would like to see how dirty the exhaust tip gets with a maintnence dose of Redline SI-1 every tankfull ?


I tried throwing in a dose with every fill up and after the inital cleanup, it doesn't get any cleaner and the exhaust tip remains semi clean.

That's why i only add the cleaner when i start seeing too much black build up, which is usually about 2-3k miles post last cleanup.

Originally Posted By: Smokefan1977
This is my same question that you are posting about. I dont see how the outside of an exhaust tip validates a fuel system cleaner working either. I just dont see what is being proven here. I suppose you have some bean stock beans from jack to

Simple; if the burn exhaust gasses coming outta the back are 'dirty' from carbon build up, the tip is black.

Once the engine internals are 'cleaner' the spent exhaust gasses coming out also seem to be cleaner, hence why the tip is less black.

What is so hard to understand here?

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: gathermewool
At least for turbo Subies, the difference between a catted and catless exhaust is minimal. Might be a HUGE (read: a whopping 4 hp) difference on a small NA car, though.

Either way, I'm sure the people behind you while you're WOT hate you.

When you're trying to squeeze out every last HP, every Pony matters. I wanted that extra 4hp so i tossed the CAT. Sure the people behind me with the windows down might not be too happy but neither am i, driving behind any pre 1990 car that's emitting a trail of black smoke as it puffs along.

Close the windows, turn on the recirculate function on your AC and enjoy clean air.

 

[baddrummerboyy]

Originally Posted By: gathermewool
At least for turbo Subies, the difference between a catted and catless exhaust is minimal. Might be a HUGE (read: a whopping 4 hp) difference on a small NA car, though.

Either way, I'm sure the people behind you while you're WOT hate you.

If you don't mind, post up or PM me a sound clip. I've only heard 3-5 modded SI's and they all sounded like [censored]. They must all have been Skunk or resonatorless catbacks of some sort. I loved the exhaust note on the stock SI, so I'll be very impressed if what you've got sounds better.


Well most header for the 06-11 Civic Si are catless. Most of them are making 15-18hp with just catless header.

I do agree that a lot of aftermarket exhaust sounds [censored]. I have an invidia q300 which is similar to the stock exhaust but more deeper.

 

[cadchris]

ARTEM;

So you added resonators to quiet the exhaust due to the cat being taken off, right?

Can you please give me specifics to who manufactures your resonators modle# and length they are?

Also, what header, and what pipe sizes from the header collector back are you running?

Thanks,

Chris
Fl.

 

[Artem]

That's some serious, technical questions there buddy.

I have a buddy club 4-2-1 race header with a 2" collector going into a 2.5" catback.

I'm using all Vibrant resonators and rear muffler.

Resonator measures 4.5" x 6.75" oval 10" long

And an 18" bottle style in the mid section.

Of course the standard Vibrant muffler in the back. All other info cab be found @Vibrant performance . Com

 

[cadchris]

You have no idea how technical I was going to go into about resonators. I was hoping that you came across a tuned "helholtz" style aftermarket resonator.

These are the factory style resonators that are tuned for each individual motor, pipe size, flow, and harmonics.

They look like a regular glass pack resonator but are hollow with a straight tube terminating inside into the open tuned chamber of the resonator body.

There are many different designs of a "Helmholz Exhaust Resonator" and Corsa Mufflers uses a theoretical design.

The "Helmholz Resonator" design is used in many industries to filter out certain harmonics. Its also used on many factory intake systems and looks like a "Appendix" branching off of the intake to eliminate intake harmonics and droan.

Google:
"Helmholtz Exhaust Resonators"
"Helmholtz exhaust tuning"
"Helmholtz exhaust chamber"



Here's different photos:
http://www.google.com/search?q=helmholtz...ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ

And here's an interesting design for the 350Z's:
http://www.pro-touring.com/showthread.php?67467-Helmholtz-Resonance-exhaust

Sorry to to lay this on you, but you could explore even more solutions to your exhaust note! This will take you and many into a whole different direction in Scientific Exhaust Tuning.

I wish I had a physicist engineering degree to really understand it, but I know its what I need to explore far beyond the simple glass pack design resonators.

I've wanted the same on my Acura, a sporty European, "Ferrari" like exhaust note, or close to it without the crackle/snap/pop, droaning or buzziness these Honda motors make.

Thanks for the follow up.

Chris

 

[Artem]

Funny you mention the Helmholtz resonators. Sadly, I found out about them AFTER I finished my exhaust. Next car though, I'm going all out.

 

[cadchris]

Great to hear others are thinking outside the box and not relying on all the junk that 99.9% of the aftermarket exhaust companies force us to buy!

I think the mistake that many make is removing the factory Helmholtz Resonator and not at least trying to somehow re-size it to a larger diameter but I'm sure once that's done, the inner tube legnth's will need changing either shorter or longer, including the overall size/volume of the resonance chamber. Wish I could get these questions answered. I even tried through the backdoor of Magnaflow into their engineering/R&D regarding another exhaust concept that I've been contemplating but they would never even give me a courtesy follow up from their Director of Engineering. This concept I inquired to them about was the Vizard Exhaust Therory. Looks like it was too much for Magnaflow to consider.

I know of someone who knows Chip Foose. Maybe I'll get him to tell Chip to consider designing it and to return my [censored] call!

This exhaust concept is called the "David Vizard Exhaust Theory Zero Loss Exhaust".
http://www.superchevy.com/technical/engines_drivetrain/exhaust/0505phr_exh/index.html

Google it also and you'll find the same article reprinted for other magazines and many people discussing it on forums.

David Vizard is the very famous automotive technical journalist who is the GOD and most high authority on anything performance automotive. You've read many of his articles in the Car Magazines and probably never new who he was. He's also written many books on tuning and performance modifications for different cars; I think he has a few books under the MOTORBOOKS series.

I just wish there was some sort of an adjustable volume Helmholtz Resonator, one size fits all for 4cyl, 6cyl, and 8cyl in different diameters and body sizes!

But I guess that's why the OEM's lock a few exhaust sound engineers in a small white padded room until they finally get it right after years of designs.

I only wonder how much the aftermarket puts into exhaust tuning when making an aftermarket performance exhaust

Chris

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: Artem
I've never seen the inside of an exhaust CLEAN on a car which had more then 1,000 miles on it.


Look at pretty much any Ford F-series (gasoline, of course) from the past 6-8 years. Its AMAZING that many of these just don't leave any deposits at all inside the exhaust pipe.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: Artem
Here's two sound clips while dyno tuning. Note that this is with a modified stock air box.


An observation: the guy holding the blower was in a good place to be singing soprano if there'd been a mechanical failure There are plenty of YouTube videos out there where connecting rods fly right through the space his family jewels were occupying. Two places I'd never be during a dyno run are in front of the car or beside the engine where parts my fly out... and with a front-drive car he was in BOTH of those places at the same time.

 

[Artem]

That may be, but this is a high compression engine, that is NOT STOCK, that does not have a CAT to keep the exhaust gases clean.

Its also been driven VERY HARD for the past 4 years / 100k miles visiting the track quite often (i have an auto-x session this Saturday) I don't mind having the inside of the pipes black.

 

[BobFout]

Sooty gassers are more common now with DI engines.

 

[Smokefan1977]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: Artem
I've never seen the inside of an exhaust CLEAN on a car which had more then 1,000 miles on it.


Look at pretty much any Ford F-series (gasoline, of course) from the past 6-8 years. Its AMAZING that many of these just don't leave any deposits at all inside the exhaust pipe.

Both of mine are spotless. If I could figure out how to post pics I would. my 99 is what 12 years old and there is NO carbon in the exhaust

I'd think performance wise it would run just as clean

 

[Spazdog]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: Artem
I've never seen the inside of an exhaust CLEAN on a car which had more then 1,000 miles on it.


Look at pretty much any Ford F-series (gasoline, of course) from the past 6-8 years. Its AMAZING that many of these just don't leave any deposits at all inside the exhaust pipe.


My Ford Duratec30/Mazda MZI still has left almost no deposits on the inside of the exhaust with over 100,000 miles.

You can really tell the difference from an MZI Mazda6S and a DISI Turbo Mazdaspeed6. Not only is the rear bumper different but the inside of the DISI turbo is full of black sooty deposits

 

[Spazdog]

Can't believe I'm posting a pic of my car when it is so dirty.

But the exhaust is the cleanest 100,000 mile car I've ever had.
Ford and Mazda did well.

 

[friendly_jacek]

Originally Posted By: Artem

Experiment:

~One 4oz dose added to a 13 gallon tank.

The exhaust would get EXTRA BLACK with a dose of Redline fuel system additive.

~No more cleaner added.

The second fill after the 'cleanup' tank of gas results in the exhaust tip being significantly cleaner. Nowhere NEAR as black as prior to cleaning.



So, basically, you are saying that Redline additive makes your exhaust black and then the carbon goes away when no Redline cleaner is used? Did I understand that correctly?

 

[Artem]

I really wanna see pics of this clean exhaust that you speak off. Figure out how to post pics!! Email em to me, i'll do it!