Fram X2 Filters ?

[Patman]

quote:

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Originally posted by sbc350gearhead:

quote:

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Originally posted by ZR2RANDO:
sbc350gearhead,
even if the filter is mounted with the open end up , a functioning adbv can still be a good thing. If it works like it is supposed to it not only holds oil in the filter itself (a given if the open end is up, ,,granted), but it can also hold back oil that is above the filter itself..keeping it from draining backwards through the filter towards the oil pan. Depends on the design of the system, One-way valves are a good thing in a hydraulic sense...

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Yes....that theory has been discussed here before, and although it seems quite logical, I (and a few others) am not convinced that it works in application. For example. Tonight, Out of curiousity, I cracked loose the PF35L oil filter (no ADBV) on my camaro, and measured the oil that leaked out from above the filter.............7-8 ounces. The car has not been started since early december. The next time I change the oil on my truck (pf1218......virtually the same filter, but with an ADBV), I will measure the oil above the filter (although I can't give it 2 months to drain back.....more like 1 day), and compare it to the results from my camaro. But honestly, I don't think there will be much difference.

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I think you'll be surprised. On my LT1, when I used the PF35 (without an ADBV) not as much oil came out from the oil filter base when I loosened it as what comes out now that I'm using a K&N, with the ADBV. And if I've got the drain plug still open when I take off the filter, quite a bit of oil comes out of the drain plug too, even if it had previously stopped dripping.

 

[ZR2RANDO]

ZitS,
Your getting a little punchy about this. Just because other people won't use them doesn't mean they don't work. You are an adult ( I assume from your comment), do your own homework, check the filters out for yourself, listen to any advice anybody has to offer just to hear any other points of view and then use whatever you want to use...
I don't care how old you are, I was just joking about the age thing, and the comments about
"I've met some pretty stupid 43-year-olds in my life, let alone 60-year-olds." is unnecessary,
You are the one paying $10 for a extended use Fram filter...I'm trying to be civil by not saying the same about you.
I won't comment on the X2's any more, hope they work out for you

 

[T-Keith]

I'd like to say, that I'm amazed at the civility of this forum.

On some other forums that I visit, this would have turned into a 10 page flame. Just shows the level of maturity on this site compared to others. Even though there is some strong disagreement here, people are keeping it pretty civil and informative.

-T

 

[Propflux01]

Zits, all I was asking was a justification on why someone would pay $10 for a filter that does what most $4.00 filters do now. I am not saying the X-filter does not work, or sucks or wahtever, It just seems to me that the X-filter is what Fram should be making in the first place. Even a 'Fram-hater' like me would consider using it if it were priced like other filters that match or exceed it's quality. As for the K&N's and M-1's, no I won't use them either, as I don't think from waht I have seen here, that they are much better than what I use now, and cannot justify their price either. but I do believe they are made better than the X-2 at the prices they are asking. Not bashing, just asking justification.

 

[labman]

quote:

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Originally posted by T-Keith:
I'd like to say, that I'm amazed at the civility of this forum.

On some other forums that I visit, this would have turned into a 10 page flame. Just shows the level of maturity on this site compared to others. Even though there is some strong disagreement here, people are keeping it pretty civil and informative.

-T

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Is it the maturity of people here, or the fine job our moderaters do? A big thanks guys from Labman.

As for the X2, it is sold by sombody that lied to me. It is not on the list of things I even look at. A brand name is nothing to mess with.

 

[Patman]

quote:

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Originally posted by labman:


Is it the maturity of people here, or the fine job our moderaters do? A big thanks guys from Labman.

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It's a bit of both actually. The guys do a great job at keeping things civil in here, but also you guys make our jobs easier too, by not getting out of line too often. I moderate on two other message boards, both of them very big, and believe me when I say that this site is a lot more mature.

 

[rcy]

Here's a filter review from a Honda Prelude site. I can't actually find any pictures of the Fram X2, but it's recommended by the reviewer who states:

"The FRAM x2 (and only the FRAM x2 Series) is probably the most heavily constructed filter I've seen so far. Though all of the Japanese made filters were of exceptional quality, the Fram x2 was as good in every way. Of note with the construction were the following features: metal screen backing the media, heavy metal end caps (all other Fram filters have cardboard), and 2 layer filter medium. Lab testing indicates this filter is fine at 5000 miles use with Mobil 1. As with all of the Fram filters and OEM Honda oil filters the x2 uses the standard spring loaded plastic by-pass valve that many people do not like. However, lab tests do not indicate that the valve jams or fails to work. It's possible that a hard enough impact at a sharp angle while the filter was by-passing might cause it to jam open, but I suspect the fluid within the filter would prevent this."

http://www.ntpog.org/reviews/filters/filters.shtml

 

[Grease is the word]

I was in Walmart today buying an X2 for the Grease/Merc 1218 Oil Study. I have to say, I looked around to see if anyone saw me buying a $10 Fram. I was a little embarrassed

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The only way I could justify buying one was to cut it open

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I may have to eat my words if it comes back from the lab as having great media.

 

[T-Keith]

I'm guessing that the media will do well, at least in one catagory. However the ADBV still worries me.

-T

 

[Amkeer]

X2 stands for "Pay twice the amount for a regular filter". (X2=Times two) Nice rusty internals too, no extra charge!

 

[therion]

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Originally posted by Amkeer:
X2 stands for "Pay twice the amount for a regular filter". (X2=Times two) Nice rusty internals too, no extra charge!

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Heheh! Why would u pay $10 for a fram filter that "might" be good when the Purolators are probably just as good for half the price

 

[jthorner]

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Heheh! Why would u pay $10 for a fram filter that "might" be good when the Purolators are probably just as good for half the price

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The construction of an X2 is entirely different from a Purolator and your comment has no basis in observed or measured facts.

I guess what we really need is for someone to set up *real* independant filter testing including both flow and filtration effectiveness to find out how various filters perform. Construction analysis is fine, but the proof is in the use, not what a filter looks like.

John

 

[therion]

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Originally posted by jthorner:

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Heheh! Why would u pay $10 for a fram filter that "might" be good when the Purolators are probably just as good for half the price

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The construction of an X2 is entirely different from a Purolator and your comment has no basis in observed or measured facts.

I guess what we really need is for someone to set up *real* independant filter testing including both flow and filtration effectiveness to find out how various filters perform. Construction analysis is fine, but the proof is in the use, not what a filter looks like.

John

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Yeah your right. From what I understand the Fram X2 is the only one made with metal end caps and is suppose to last 7,500 miles, so how long are their other filters suppose to last? At $10 a pop, I'll pass. And here is a quote from Frams previous model the Double Guard, used to be $10 a pop too:

"This is one of the most expensive filters you can buy. Inside is a basic Fram Extra Guard (PH8A) filter element that has larger diameter holes at the end and has been pre-oiled. I assume this is to hold the Teflon particles in the filter element before the unit is installed. Don't put Teflon in your engine. It does not belong there! DuPont does not recommend using their Teflon product in internal combustion engines. "

Since their previous filters have shown a record of such bad quality, I will continue to not buy Fram filters.

 

[Amkeer]

I should hope the Frams are entirely different from Purolator! The Frams are $10 and the Purolator P1 is $5 thats a difference in itself. The other difference is Frams are known to mislead in their marketing to effect more sales. Purolator sells a decent filter at a fair price. You can buy the basic Purolator for about $3. You can buy the Frams with cheap internals for the same amount. The X2 are a waste at $10! I can buy high quality, Toyota, OEM, Denso filters for less than $9.

Fram makes decent air filters but their oil filters leave alot to be desired!

 

[therion]

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Originally posted by Amkeer:
I should hope the Frams are entirely different from Purolator! The Frams are $10 and the Purolator P1 is $5 thats a difference in itself. The other difference is Frams are known to mislead in their marketing to effect more sales. Purolator sells a decent filter at a fair price. You can buy the basic Purolator for about $3. You can buy the Frams with cheap internals for the same amount. The X2 are a waste at $10! I can buy high quality, Toyota, OEM, Denso filters for less than $9.

Fram makes decent air filters but their oil filters leave alot to be desired!

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Definately a waste of money and the company should be boycotted.

 

[Propflux01]

[/QUOTE]The construction of an X2 is entirely different from a Purolator and your comment has no basis in observed or measured facts.[/QUOTE]

How much different are they? All I can tell is the media itself is different than most other filters. His comment actually has basis in observed fact. As for measurements, well, that remains to be seen. But for $10 a pop? That media better be able to strain urine into fresh water for that price....

 

[Thomas Pyrek]

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Originally posted by Tim H.:
But for $10 a pop? That media better be able to strain urine into fresh water for that price.... [/QB]

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Some one should watch Waterworld and see if there is a prototype X2 on Costner's filtration device.

 

[Mystic]

A long time ago I used to use FRAM oil filters (and mostly Pennzoil oil) all the time. Then I had problems with two FRAM oil filters on two different cars. And I discovered the Oil Filter Study on the internet. I started using different brands of oil filters.

I don't have anything against FRAM. And I am not an expert on oil filter design. I am just a customer and I try to buy the best products for the best price that I can for my car.

I mentioned the problems that I had with a couple of oil filters. When I have problems with a certain brand I tend to switch to something else. But also I did not like the appearance of the FRAM oil filters that had been cut apart in the Oil Filter Study (the cardboard endcaps, the plastic valves, the appearance of the filtering media, etc.). I am not an oil filter engineer. Maybe FRAM makes the best oil filters in the world for all I know. And Bob did have great wear results using Schaeffer's Oil and FRAM oil filters. I have to make decisions based on my experience, information I am able to come across, and appearance of a product. I am just a customer.

Based on all of the above I swtiched from FRAM and used other brands. I would love to use FRAM oil filters if I personally thought the quality was there-FRAM is everywhere and I would not have to do some searching for an oil filter.

I now own a car that uses an oil filter element. I can SEE what the oil filter media looks like. I don't have to cut an oil filter can apart. If I come across an oil filter element made by FRAM that will work on my car and it looks good to me and is available at a reasonable price I will buy it. I will also buy WIX or whatever else is available for the same reasons. I probably would look at the WIX made oil filter element first in all honesty because my experience with FRAM oil filters has not been stellar. Even though I am an old man now I tend to remember who has treated me badly in the past.

This post is about the FRAM X2 oil filter that has metal endcaps. I now have a car that uses an oil filter element. It seems to me that the FRAM X2 would have to be the equal of oil filters like the K&N, Mobil 1, and other oil filters that cost about 10 dollars to be worth buying. The FRAM X2 has metal endcaps-what about the rest of the construction?

I feel that everything I have said in this post is fair and reasonable. I am not an engineer and I don't work for an oil filter manufacturer. I am just a customer trying to buy good products at good prices. Anybody feel that this post is unfair or unreasonable?

 

[Brian Barnhart]

While Fram’s X2 may not be the best filter there is, it does compare reasonably well to some of the other “premium” filters I’ve seen. And it’s far from the only overpriced filter on the market.

I’ve sawed open at least a dozen different Jeep filters (equivalent to the Mopar 05281090). My opinions/observations are:

The Mopar filter is well made, and reasonably priced (for an OEM) at about $7

The K&N with it’s hex nut on the end, and the Mobil 1 with it’s silicone ADBV and “synthetic” media may be somewhat better than the Mopar, but still seem rather overpriced at $10-$12 when compared to the OEM.

The Amsoil is roughly equivalent to the Mopar filter but appeared to offer nothing to justify it’s much higher-than-OEM price of about $11.

The Wix and Napa Gold filters are about $6 ($1 less than the OEM Mopar), and offered the bonus of a silicone ADBVs. These arguably represent the best values for this application.

The Mopar, Mobil 1, K&N, Amsoil, Napa Gold, and Wix are the only filters (of the ones I cut open) with the OEM type rubber/metal bypass valves on the “open” end.

The Fram Extra Guard is the basic Fram filter. They use a cardboard endcap to center the ADBV and filter element inside the canister. I consider that a poor practice and will not use this filter.

Basically the same story for the Fram’s Tough Guard. It has a silicone ADBV and nice screen over the bypass valve, but the cardboard centering endcap ruins it for me.

Fram’s X2 appears to be a good filter. It’s only drawbacks appear to be the plastic/metal bypass valve on the non-OEM end, and the price of about $10. Feature wise, it looks like other manufacturer’s $6 filters.

Purolator’s Pure 1 appears to be a nice filter in every respect except for the metal/metal bypass valve on the non-OEM end. This is the filter I’ve used most often (with good results) over the last 5 years on my Jeep.

The Purolator Premium Plus, STP, SuperTech, and Napa Silver are reasonably good low cost filters. But personally, I’d rather spend a few more bucks and use a Wix/Napa Gold or even a Pure 1.

The Bosch Premium is much like the STP and SuperTech, but appears to have a slightly different media. For what I saw, it’s approximate price of $5seemed rather lofty.

As I stated at the beginning, these are only my opinions based on my observations. I didn’t really consider the filter media itself in any of my comments. That’s because I have no way to judge it.

Of course, one could argue (accurately) that all my comments are subjective as opposed to objective. But, then again, if you listen to the filter manufacturers, they all have great, rugged designs with excellent filtering and dirt holding capacity that meet or exceed the manufacturer’s service requirements. Good hunting.