Fram Ultra Filter

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New guy here, been reading for a looooong time and very impressed with the knowledge base here. My question: last oil change I switched to Fram Ultra oil filter and it changed the oil pressure reading on my gauge. I was running about 30psi at hot idle, now it shows 40psi at hot idle. This is not a high tech engine, Jeep 4.0 in wrangler (02 Sport) and it seems to run fine with whatever oil I have put in it (10w-30). My UOA showed a good report with a recommendation of longer OCI's. The only thing different is the oil filter. Previously I used what I could find on the shelf at wallyworld, usually a FL-A1 or purolater. Thanks for any insight.
 
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The only way to consider the problem would be with an outside mechanical gauge and/or switching filters. Otherwise you'd be approaching the problem with speculation instead of information.
 
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Rule of thumb is 10 psi of oil pressure per 1000 rpm so go at highest gear on highway (say 60 mile per hour(or 98 kilometer per hour))then note psi .if your rpm is 4000 ?psi should be at 40 if its higher by a lot you might need to use a 0w30(this does not apply to diesel)diesel is more around 20 psi per 1000rpm
 
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The Ultra may have increased your oil pressure since it's so awesome. It's about the only filter I run now. Make sure to get your money's worth the filter can run for 15,000 mile intervals if you're engine isn't sludged. Even if I change my oil at 5 or 6 thousand miles I leave the Ultra on for 15,000+. I don't even drain the few ounces of oil I just leave it. They have huge capacity and are supposed to get more efficient over time.
 

ZeeOSix

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Originally Posted By: Tdog02
New guy here, been reading for a looooong time and very impressed with the knowledge base here. My question: last oil change I switched to Fram Ultra oil filter and it changed the oil pressure reading on my gauge. I was running about 30psi at hot idle, now it shows 40psi at hot idle. This is not a high tech engine, Jeep 4.0 in wrangler (02 Sport) and it seems to run fine with whatever oil I have put in it (10w-30). My UOA showed a good report with a recommendation of longer OCI's. The only thing different is the oil filter. Previously I used what I could find on the shelf at wallyworld, usually a FL-A1 or purolater. Thanks for any insight.
Need some more information. 1) Did you use the same exact oil brand and weight for that oil change? Different brands of "10W-30" oil could have a different viscosity at the same temperature. 2) Was the oil at the same operating temperature when you are looking at the oil pressure at idle. I'm assuming you did the oil pressure comparison after driving a long ways so engine was fully hot. 3) Is the engine RPM the same at idle between the tests? Sometimes engines idle a little higher if the A/C is on. With a positive displacement oil pump, the oil pressure really only changes with the oil viscosity/temperature unless the pump is in pressure relief. The last thing I'd suspect causing the oil pressure gauge to change at hot idle would be the oil filter used. I've ran 4 different brand oil filters on the Z06, and every one of them gives me the same exact oil pressure at idle and throughout the whole engine RPM range when comparing with the same oil and oil temperature (ie, viscosity).
 
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^^^Just what does your LS6/7's (don't know if you have a C5, or C6) oil pressure gauge read at both hot and cold idle with the Ultra, and with which oil? I want to know for comparison, even though I know their oiling systems are different than the LS1's, especially if it is an LS7, obviously, since I have some Ultras stockpiled, and I want to run one for this winter's OCI. wink
 

ZeeOSix

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Originally Posted By: dailydriver
^^^Just what does your LS6/7's (don't know if you have a C5, or C6) oil pressure gauge read at both hot and cold idle with the Ultra, and with which oil? I want to know for comparison, even though I know their oiling systems are different than the LS1's, especially if it is an LS7, obviously, since I have some Ultras stockpiled, and I want to run one for this winter's OCI. wink
I've got a C5 with the LS6. The oiling system (from what I've read) is the same between the LS1 and LS6. I run Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic. Here's the oil pressures vs engine RPM data I've collected when the oil is at a constant 200 deg F. I've seen this same data while using Mobil 1 5W-30 with 4 different oil filter brands, so the filter has no effect on the seen oil pressure, which is how it should be. Idle (800 RPM) = 32 PSI 2000 RPM = 46 PSI 3000 RPM = 55 PSI 4000 RPM = 64 PSI 5000 RPM = 70 PSI I think the oil pump starts to go in to pressure relief mode when the oil pressure seen on the gauge hit around 70 PSI. That's why you see the "10 PSI per 1000 RPM" relationship not hold true between 4000 and 5000 RPM.
 

Tdog02

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Ok, I have answered my own question by reading the posts. I was using the same oil in the engine Castrol GTX 10w30. I just changed the filter to the Fram Ultra and topped off what I lost. The bottle was 10w40, increased viscosity so higher oil pressure. I never even looked at the bottle when I picked it up because it was surrounded by all the other 10w30 bottles. ZeeOsix caused me to retrace my steps and I discovered the reason. I thought I had lost my mind until I grabbed the quart bottle that still had some oil left and it said 40 weight. Now I realize I had HUA syndrome and should start paying better attention. Thanks for your replys
 
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
^^^Just what does your LS6/7's (don't know if you have a C5, or C6) oil pressure gauge read at both hot and cold idle with the Ultra, and with which oil? I want to know for comparison, even though I know their oiling systems are different than the LS1's, especially if it is an LS7, obviously, since I have some Ultras stockpiled, and I want to run one for this winter's OCI. wink
I've got a C5 with the LS6. The oiling system (from what I've read) is the same between the LS1 and LS6. I run Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic. Here's the oil pressures vs engine RPM data I've collected when the oil is at a constant 200 deg F. I've seen this same data while using Mobil 1 5W-30 with 4 different oil filter brands, so the filter has no effect on the seen oil pressure, which is how it should be. Idle (800 RPM) = 32 PSI 2000 RPM = 46 PSI 3000 RPM = 55 PSI 4000 RPM = 64 PSI 5000 RPM = 70 PSI I think the oil pump starts to go in to pressure relief mode when the oil pressure seen on the gauge hit around 70 PSI. That's why you see the "10 PSI per 1000 RPM" relationship not hold true between 4000 and 5000 RPM.
THANKS! thumbsup Yes, the LS6 is A LOT closer in oil system specs/oil pump to the LS1, than the dry sump equipped LS7. Mine sits at ~43psi for hot idle with the EaO64, and the Red Line/Sustina mix in my sig. Cold idle is at ~52psi. Hot WOT/5500 revs is at almost 80psi!! Do you know exactly where the pressure relief kicks in on these engines (stock, not modded oil pumps/springs), as far as pressure, and/or revs go? shrug
 

ZeeOSix

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Originally Posted By: dailydriver
THANKS! thumbsup Yes, the LS6 is A LOT closer in oil system specs/oil pump to the LS1, than the dry sump equipped LS7. Mine sits at ~43psi for hot idle with the EaO64, and the Red Line/Sustina mix in my sig. Cold idle is at ~52psi. Hot WOT/5500 revs is at almost 80psi!! Do you know exactly where the pressure relief kicks in on these engines (stock, not modded oil pumps/springs), as far as pressure, and/or revs go? shrug
Your oil pressure is somewhat higher due to the higher viscosity "brew" you're running, and the oil pressures you see will always be higher at each RPM point. If you are seeing near 80 PSI at 5500 RPM, then I'd say the stock pump's oil pressure relief valve is kicking in between 75 & 80 PSI. I was concluding it was around 70 PSI from my data collecting, but it's hard to find a road to hold it steady at 5500 or 6000 RPM, even in 2nd gear. So I only have a data point at 5000 RPM and not above that.
 
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Originally Posted By: Tdog02
New guy here, been reading for a looooong time and very impressed with the knowledge base here. My question: last oil change I switched to Fram Ultra oil filter and it changed the oil pressure reading on my gauge. I was running about 30psi at hot idle, now it shows 40psi at hot idle. This is not a high tech engine, Jeep 4.0 in wrangler (02 Sport) and it seems to run fine with whatever oil I have put in it (10w-30). My UOA showed a good report with a recommendation of longer OCI's. The only thing different is the oil filter. Previously I used what I could find on the shelf at wallyworld, usually a FL-A1 or purolater. Thanks for any insight.
Hi, I work for FRAM, thanks for buying Ultra. Here is a logical explanation for what your seeing. All filters have some kind of restriction across them referred to as pressure drop. As filter loading occurs, the pressure differential between incoming oil and outgoing oil will increase. When it increases to a certain point, (whatever the relief valve is set at 9-22psi) the bypass will open and allow dirty oil to run through the engine. I think your previous oil filter was dirt loaded and sitting just below the bypass valve opening pressure. As good as Ultra filters are, they cannot increase oil pressure just by keeping the oil clean. Thanks for using FRAM
 
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Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
THANKS! thumbsup Yes, the LS6 is A LOT closer in oil system specs/oil pump to the LS1, than the dry sump equipped LS7. Mine sits at ~43psi for hot idle with the EaO64, and the Red Line/Sustina mix in my sig. Cold idle is at ~52psi. Hot WOT/5500 revs is at almost 80psi!! Do you know exactly where the pressure relief kicks in on these engines (stock, not modded oil pumps/springs), as far as pressure, and/or revs go? shrug
Your oil pressure is somewhat higher due to the higher viscosity "brew" you're running, and the oil pressures you see will always be higher at each RPM point. If you are seeing near 80 PSI at 5500 RPM, then I'd say the stock pump's oil pressure relief valve is kicking in between 75 & 80 PSI. I was concluding it was around 70 PSI from my data collecting, but it's hard to find a road to hold it steady at 5500 or 6000 RPM, even in 2nd gear. So I only have a data point at 5000 RPM and not above that.
I double checked this yesterday and today, and I was reading the gauge incorrectly. It is between 65-70 psi at 5500 revs, hot, and sits at 60 psi cold, at lower revs (<3500, as I NEVER go over this until the oil is fully hot). Yes, I am going to thin out my winter OCI 'brew' a bit (with more 0W-20) to get that hot idle pressure down to a little < 40 psi. wink
 
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Originally Posted By: Motorking
Originally Posted By: Tdog02
New guy here, been reading for a looooong time and very impressed with the knowledge base here. My question: last oil change I switched to Fram Ultra oil filter and it changed the oil pressure reading on my gauge. I was running about 30psi at hot idle, now it shows 40psi at hot idle. This is not a high tech engine, Jeep 4.0 in wrangler (02 Sport) and it seems to run fine with whatever oil I have put in it (10w-30). My UOA showed a good report with a recommendation of longer OCI's. The only thing different is the oil filter. Previously I used what I could find on the shelf at wallyworld, usually a FL-A1 or purolater. Thanks for any insight.
Hi, I work for FRAM, thanks for buying Ultra. Here is a logical explanation for what your seeing. All filters have some kind of restriction across them referred to as pressure drop. As filter loading occurs, the pressure differential between incoming oil and outgoing oil will increase. When it increases to a certain point, (whatever the relief valve is set at 9-22psi) the bypass will open and allow dirty oil to run through the engine. I think your previous oil filter was dirt loaded and sitting just below the bypass valve opening pressure. As good as Ultra filters are, they cannot increase oil pressure just by keeping the oil clean. Thanks for using FRAM
Assuming he didn't have 15K on that filter it still doesn't explain why the Ultra had higher oil pressure at idle. Synthetic media filters are supposed to have LESS pressure drop than paper.
 

ZeeOSix

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Originally Posted By: HangFire
Assuming he didn't have 15K on that filter it still doesn't explain why the Ultra had higher oil pressure at idle. Synthetic media filters are supposed to have LESS pressure drop than paper.
If the oil pressure sensor is after the oil filter (which almost are), then more oil pressure means more oil flow. The OP did say he added higher viscosity oil to his sump, so that too will raise oil pressure. Surely at an idle, a positive displacement oil pump is putting all the output volume through the filter & engine oiling circuit, so the seen increase in oil pressure is most likely from the increased oil viscosity. If the viscosity doesn't change, then the oil pressure should be the same at idle (at same oil temp) regardless of what oil filter is used. Pressure drop across an oil filter only shows up in oil pressure readings when the oil pump is in pressure relief, and at idle that's basically impossible if the pump and its relief valve is operating correctly.
 
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