fram oil filters....

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Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: labman
There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


Welcome to the real world... Most of the bashing here on the board are from major koolaid drinkers and anything else but their koolaid is garbage.
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That's okay, a lot of them are ignored once their agenda is obvious.

Bill


Yes, I have noticed how some people react to anything negative said about a certain brand.
 
Quote:
Yes, I have noticed how some people react to anything negative said about a certain brand.
I've noticed the same thing, right here on this thread.
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That's not an agenda though.
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Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: labman
There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


Welcome to the real world... Most of the bashing here on the board are from major koolaid drinkers and anything else but their koolaid is garbage.
06.gif


That's okay, a lot of them are ignored once their agenda is obvious.

Bill

No Koolaid garbage about it,you have to admit bill what would you rather use on your 2004 GMC 4.3l 4x4 pickup??






these orange fram o scraps?


page6-1032-full.jpg


page6-1035-full.jpg




or your quality constructed classic AC Delco or Pureone filters that you use??

img0680md.jpg


img0681n.jpg


p6300656.jpg


p6300659.jpg



Hmmmm no brainier.....
 
Originally Posted By: labman
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: labman
There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


Welcome to the real world... Most of the bashing here on the board are from major koolaid drinkers and anything else but their koolaid is garbage.
06.gif


That's okay, a lot of them are ignored once their agenda is obvious.

Bill


Yes, I have noticed how some people react to anything negative said about a certain brand.


Like some people do ever time Purolators are mentioned
whistle.gif
?

I think its abundantly clear that Fram extraguards are a cheaply made filter that is overpriced. It's hard to prove that they leak oil around the media but they have the most potential. the carboard end caps and media are not fully axially supported by the center tube as Purolators are. On the otherhand maybe thats why the P1s show more strain at some of the pleat to end cap connections?
 
Originally Posted By: daman
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
labman said:
There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


Welcome to the real world... Most of the bashing here on the board are from major koolaid drinkers and anything else but their koolaid is garbage.
06.gif


That's okay, a lot of them are ignored once their agenda is obvious.

Bill

No Koolaid garbage about it,you have to admit bill what would you rather use on your 2004 GMC 4.3l 4x4 pickup??






these orange fram o scraps?


page6-1032-full.jpg


page6-1035-full.jpg



Someone mention in that thread that, that one Fram isn't sold in the US. Why not post this these ones?

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...nt=4&page=1
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1855050&page=all
or other Suburu or Honda OEM filters, or the Fram that went 25K miles. I personally don't use the orange can but i find it strange that you had to dig up an old post to find that pic, when there's 2 thread with pics of a used Fram just below this one.
 
Originally Posted By: labman
...If I remember correctly, Fram did well compared to better looking filters. There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


All the orange Frams did a good job of cleaning the fine crud out of the oil for me, and the media looks fairly "tight" under a microscope as well.
Oil flowed through the media reasonably well, too.
These are all things relative to many other filter medias tested, and the Fram media should work pretty well at doing its intended job.
...But I don't like the construction, and do not use them myself anymore.

I think the XG is OK.
 
Originally Posted By: Bluestream
That's interesting info on the web site, but mostly subjective conclusions with no data to back them up.

The whole point of the testing/comparisons was to give an indication of what performance one might expect from a given filter, relative to others, when no useful data is given by the manufacturer.
e.g. "99% efficient" on the box means nothing at all by itself.
 
I have used the XG Fram on my 4Runner for a while now and I have cut open a few of them open this is a solid well built filter. I don't know how much the filter effects my used oil tests from Blackstone but all have been great with the XG Fram in place.

XG real good filter and built like a tank!
 
The air filter and OC interval probably make the big difference.
Still, an oil filter is there for a reason. Might as well be a good one.
 
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: labman
There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


Welcome to the real world... Most of the bashing here on the board are from major koolaid drinkers and anything else but their koolaid is garbage.
06.gif


That's okay, a lot of them are ignored once their agenda is obvious.

Bill


Keep in mind that even FRAM has a following of Kool-Aid drinkers.
56.gif
 
Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: labman
There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


Welcome to the real world... Most of the bashing here on the board are from major koolaid drinkers and anything else but their koolaid is garbage.
06.gif


That's okay, a lot of them are ignored once their agenda is obvious.

Bill


Keep in mind that even FRAM has a following of Kool-Aid drinkers.
56.gif


Though i have no idea WHY!!!
smirk2.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Bluestream
Originally Posted By: SuperBusa

The biggest difference in flow between filters seems to be when the oil is cold. That is why you hear of guy have cold start-up noises with one filter vs. another. And it could also be due to ADBV design or performance issues.


When the oil is cold the flow is in by-pass anyway, so the make of filter is really irrelevant until it's thin enough to flow.


I wouldn't just assume that every filter is in bypass when the oil is cold. Realize that when the oil is cold, the flow volume is much less going through the filter due to the pump's pressure relief valve. This is turn caused the PSID to also be reduced at least from the flow volume factor.

There have even been theories that the PSID in the filter isn't much different with cold oil vs. hot due to the pump's pressure relief valve controlling the max possible oil flow at any given oil viscosity.
 
Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: labman
There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


Welcome to the real world... Most of the bashing here on the board are from major koolaid drinkers and anything else but their koolaid is garbage.
06.gif


That's okay, a lot of them are ignored once their agenda is obvious.

Bill


Keep in mind that even FRAM has a following of Kool-Aid drinkers.
56.gif



Really?
48.gif


Let's see to be koolaid drinker only uses their favorite brand. For me, I'd like for you to look through all of my cut open filters here and see how many Frams have I cut up? Notice that I use MANY brand of filters.

My point is (and it's obvious with you guys that you ignore FACTS
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) that look how many Frams are being sold (hint, its the NUMBER 1 SELLING filter) and where are all of the dead engines laying around?
whistle.gif


Maybe that is BECAUSE the filter performs fine. Millions and millions times a year.

I've always tried to be factual and non-biased (look for me posting "only" this or that, you will not unless I have all the info unlike you guys) because who knows who may be looking to support the board. Fram would be a great sponsor but why would they with all the nonfactual garbage folks spew here...
smirk2.gif


Sad that people can not base things in a technical forum on factual info.

Bill
 
Originally Posted By: daman
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: labman
There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


Welcome to the real world... Most of the bashing here on the board are from major koolaid drinkers and anything else but their koolaid is garbage.
06.gif


That's okay, a lot of them are ignored once their agenda is obvious.

Bill

No Koolaid garbage about it,you have to admit bill what would you rather use on your 2004 GMC 4.3l 4x4 pickup??






these orange fram o scraps?


page6-1032-full.jpg


page6-1035-full.jpg




or your quality constructed classic AC Delco or Pureone filters that you use??

img0680md.jpg


img0681n.jpg


p6300656.jpg


p6300659.jpg



Hmmmm no brainier.....



Well you already got called on posting of the Fram filters so I'll leave that one alone.

Answer? Any of them. I buy on value. Any of the filters work fine in my applications so I'd use any.

And have.

Bill
 
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah


Sad that people can not base things in a technical forum on factual info.


Seems to me that actual "Flow vs. PSID" and "Beta Ratio" info from the manufactures Engineering Department, along with many cut open photos showing no holes or blow-outs in the filters after use are "factual info". Right?
wink.gif


IF we could get such info from ALL filter manufactures then it would be easier for the Kool-Aid drinkers to switch flavor of said Kool-Aid.

You think you could get FRAM to conduct and send you Flow vs. PSID data on their filters? Or Beta Ratio data that is more technical than XX% @ >Y microns? Has anyone every tried corresponding with FRAM's Engineering Dept to get such data?
 
Again, EVERY filter has problems. EVERY BRAND.

When you are making thousands of something, unless you price it to a point where QC checks EVERY SINGLE item you will have defects.

Where are all the dead engines? All the dead Subaru motors using something other than the factory filters?

So your saying that all the brands you guys bash using their recommended filter in vehicles they recommend all fail? 50% fail? Whats the number to make something garbage according to your matrix? 1%?

Don't need to contact Fram. Their legal dept and the motoring public will make sure the filters they are recommending will work just fine. If something happens, they will cover the repair. Just like Champ, Bosch and every other filter manufacture.

And they all have had to pay out. Cost of doing business.

Bill
 
Well maybe if you stuck to that sort of thing, people might have some respect for you. Denying you commonly engage in subjective bashing will only seen as a joke by everybody except you and your Escrap friends.
 
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: daman
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: labman
There is an amazing lack of real data to back up the orange can of doom.


Welcome to the real world... Most of the bashing here on the board are from major koolaid drinkers and anything else but their koolaid is garbage.
06.gif


That's okay, a lot of them are ignored once their agenda is obvious.

Bill

No Koolaid garbage about it,you have to admit bill what would you rather use on your 2004 GMC 4.3l 4x4 pickup??






these orange fram o scraps?


page6-1032-full.jpg


page6-1035-full.jpg




or your quality constructed classic AC Delco or Pureone filters that you use??

img0680md.jpg


img0681n.jpg


p6300656.jpg


p6300659.jpg



Hmmmm no brainier.....



Well you already got called on posting of the Fram filters so I'll leave that one alone.

Answer? Any of them. I buy on value. Any of the filters work fine in my applications so I'd use any.

And have.

Bill

Noooo answer my question,,witch one would you rather use on your truck outa them filters???

and what heck you talking about being "called on" posting of them fram o scraps?, i said...i search the site for random pics big deal,so what does that have anything to do with anything??
 
Originally Posted By: labman
Well maybe if you stuck to that sort of thing, people might have some respect for you. Denying you commonly engage in subjective bashing will only seen as a joke by everybody except you and your Escrap friends.


Are you addressing me? Well, I bash Escraps (as do others for the same reason) because I believe they have a design (or manufacturing) flaw that can cause the media to fold over in use and cause a major media blow out.

I don't see any reports of this issue with any other filters out there. I'm sure if Purolators or Mobil 1 or Royal Purple or Amsoil or WIX or any other brand had reports of media blow-outs that they would be recognized as having an issue also, and receive same said bashing. Wouldn't you agree?
 
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