Agree!
Fram Endurance Flashlight Test in canister
- Thread starter Glenda W.
- Start date
BrendanC
$100 site donor 2024
the media will absorb the oil.
EXACTLY WHY I ASKED HOW MUCH OIL WAS POURED IN.
I got the impression he filled it up all the way. Guess we’ll have to await his answer?
The gist of his argument was to imply all the oil poured in went out through the bypass leak. I’m not so sure the amount matters a whole lot…..any amount is going to be primarily absorbed by the filter.
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I showed you here: (No need for CAPS. Calm down.)
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/t...ashlight-test-in-canister.386911/post-7013113
The only way to do this would be to remove the filter from the can. Then you can see how much came out the bypass end vs what was poured in.Is that what you did? Hard to tell from the close ups. I assumed it was an intact filter.
Here is how much I poured in. I took this photo as quickly as possible after pouring in. I used a funnel so the oil hit the black poppet valve. There is a lip that contains the rounded part of the leaf spring that is inserted into the center tube. So the pooled oil sits away from the center tube and media. It looks like I filled slightly above the lip and some oil went over the lip. But at the point of taking the picture, the oil is level with the lip.
I have posted links below to others pictures to help you see that lip better.
And almost exactly 5 minutes later I took this picture:
My filter was made the day before @Fair enough 's. Have you seen his picture of the gaps?
Also, maybe take a look at the dissected filter pics in these 2 posts. I might be wrong but I see that the interface between the end cap and the leaf spring is away from the media. @Glenda W. poured oil onto the leaf spring / bypass valve on the dirty side and it seeped through to where I poured oil.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/fram-endurance-flashlight-test-in-canister.386911/
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/t...ashlight-test-in-canister.386911/post-7013502
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Fair enough, so we’re looking at what? 5-10 ml gone in 5 min? Just curious.
BrendanC
$100 site donor 2024
i believe this test to be a valid test but the results are inconclusive. you’re going to have a leak with metal on metal sealing unless there is perfect fit ups and tons of pressure. oil filters have been built like this for a long time. sure id love to see first brands go to a one piece cap with an integrated bypass and a coil springs but i just don’t think it’s necessarily a con towards them that they don’t.
I started noticing it go down straight away so most of it went quickly. I waited to take the picture when I thought the oil film would no longer reduce.
I wasn't expecting that result at all but @Fair enough 's pictures of the same filter that was manufactured the next day really reveal how poorly made the leaf spring is and make me question the overall quality of new XGs:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/t...ashlight-test-in-canister.386911/post-7013502
Lastly, even if the FE didn't have the same problem, I would still be choosing the OG XG, which incidentally I managed to get for less than the cost of the FE. Ascent tested the XG as having 35% more capacity than the FE (tested as an RP). So if the FE is a 25k mile filter, then the OG XG is a 34k mile filter. Since I want the option of running it 20k miles, the OG XG gives a lot more headroom before it is close to (intended) bypass territory.
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I wasn't excited or yelling at you. I was telling him that is why I asked, things get buried in this long thread.
Hard for me to tell in the pictures the volume of oil at T=0. There definitely could be weeping/soaking at the media IF overfilled.
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That's how you pre-fill a filter before installation.
From what I see, looks like he filled the bottom of the center tube just enough to bring the leve just below the center tube louvers and the black bypass valve. Although, looks like some louvers are touching oil, so could have been some leakage there. Not much oil depth, which means virtually no head pressure dP.
Yes agree. I mean there COULD be if a lot of oil was poured in. That is back to and why I asked how much in the first place.
If you're going to be doing PCs, I would suggest using WearCheck instead of Blackstone.
Blackstone has a history of measuring the particle count at only one particle size (probably around 14 or 21 micron), and then extrapolating the results for larger and smaller particles based on what particle size distribution is typical for an engine. More recently, they seem to be doing less extrapolation, but I have more confidence in PCs performed by WearCheck.
It's important to have an accurate particle count for every particle size, since a bypassing filter will have a much larger drop in beta ratio for large particles than it will for small particles, so the PC for large particles will be affected a lot more. The shape of the PC curve should provide a good indication of whether the filter was bypassing.
If you may end up doing multiple PCs to compare different filters, make sure that the recent running conditions of the engine before sampling are similar. I'd suggest idling a warm engine for a set amount of time before shutting it off, and waiting a set amount of time afterwards before taking the sample. It's best not to replace or disturb the air filter at any time, especially shortly before you take a sample.
Exactly, that’s why I just had my “Epiphany” on the matter. Lol
That could get messy depending on filter position…That's how you pre-fill a filter before installation.
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The new one has 36 pleats.
I pre-fill a filter that is mounted vertical with the base down (4.0L V6 Tacoma) and don't spill a drop. Just need to know how much pre-filling you can do without making a mess.
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