Ford WSSM2C950-A vs Ford WSS-M2C913-C

[Pasechnik]

Hi all. We just bought Benimar 2025 European Ford Transit chassis 2.0Diesel EcoBlue motorhome.
I am not sure if my vehicle is MK8 or MK9.

I used to US Ram ecosystem, where it is super easy to find any info in 5 minutes. Ford EU is just another story...

As always, I like to have my consumables on my garage shelf waiting instead of looking for them when I need something. So I started with engine oil. I tried EU Ford, they sent me to local Ford dealer... OK, I sent emails to a bunch of Spain Ford dealers... 1 of them was SO KIND to reply with the answer saying that I need to use "5w30 WSS-M2C913-C"..

Googling brought 2 answers... basically this EcoBlue 2.0 engine uses 2 types of Ford approved oils:

1. Ford WSSM2C950-A 0w30 Ford-Castrol Magnatec 0W30 D is official oil
2. Ford WSS-M2C913-C (or D) Ford-Castrol Magnatec 5W30 A5 is official oil

Both oils are great oils but different specs.

Castrol Magnatec 0W30 D is newer specs oil ASEA C2 Mid SAPS for newer diesel engines with aftertreatment systems (SCR, DPF, etc)

Castrol Magnatec 5W30 A5 is older specs oil ACEA A5/B5 Full SAPS (nothing about aftertreatment systems)

I found a bunch of Ford official online manuals for 2017 Transits and they use newer specs oil Castrol Magnatec 0W30 D

But at the same time 2019+ Transits use older specs oil Castrol Magnatec 5W30 A5

So, how comes, newer vehicle with more advanced aftertreatment exhaust system uses older specs oil which doesn't even mention exhaust aftertreatment systems, but older vehicle uses new specs oil?

Both older and newer Transits have wet belts, both have the same engines....
Do I miss something? Did Ford "downgraded" oil use for a reason?

Once Ford decided to use dumb wet belts to have +1% fuel economy but now they use less efficient oil and get -1% fuel economy....

When it comes to complicated oil questions there is no better forums than this one to get the answers. Can someone shine a light on this situation?

 

[Kalle.J]

I would use Mobil 1 ESP 0W30 (C3) or equivalent regardless.

ATO24.de shows 0W20 C5 with Ford WSS-M2C956-A1 for the 2.0 Ecoblue ENK6 engine.
Come back with kW/HP and or engine code.

 

[Jetronic]

Full saps oils are not less fuel efficient than mid-saps oils, and can be used without harm in engines with after treatment systems that don't consume large amounts of oil.

No oil can save a wet belt from degrading it seems, so just use something that's easy to get and of high quality like the Mobil ESP mentioned by KalleJ.

I would not use 0W-20 if you intend to use this motorhome as long as possible....

 

[Pasechnik]

I would use Mobil 1 ESP 0W30 (C3) or equivalent regardless.

ATO24.de shows 0W20 C5 with Ford WSS-M2C956-A1 for the 2.0 Ecoblue ENK6 engine.
Come back with kW/HP and or engine code.

I don't have the engine code, but here is my VIN: WF0DXXTTRDRD57245

The engine is 165HP

I tried Ford online manual and it shows Ford WSS-M2C913-C oil, which is 5w30.

I just don't get it why newer vehicle uses older specs oil, maybe 0w30 was too thin? I remember Ram EcoDiesel originally was using 5w30 oil, and there were many engine failures, so FCA switched to 5w40 oil.

Is it ok to use Ford WSSM2C950-A 0w30 Ford-Castrol Magnatec 0W30 D or better to stick to manual and use Ford WSS-M2C913-C Ford-Castrol Magnatec 5W30 A5?

 

[Kalle.J]

I don't have the engine code, but here is my VIN: WF0DXXTTRDRD57245

The engine is 165HP

I tried Ford online manual and it shows Ford WSS-M2C913-C oil, which is 5w30.

I just don't get it why newer vehicle uses older specs oil, maybe 0w30 was too thin? I remember Ram EcoDiesel originally was using 5w30 oil, and there were many engine failures, so FCA switched to 5w40 oil.

Is it ok to use Ford WSSM2C950-A 0w30 Ford-Castrol Magnatec 0W30 D or better to stick to manual and use Ford WSS-M2C913-C Ford-Castrol Magnatec 5W30 A5?

Okay probably BKFA/BKAA engine then. No DPF?
9.3L or 12L Sump?

Could narrow it down if we know FWD/RWD/AWD.
VIN is from Benimar so does not help as much.

A5/B5 with Ford WSS-M2C913-C, Ford WSS-M2C913-D.

Basically A3/B3 0/5W30 if you don't have DPF, and C3 if you do.

 

[userfriendly]

Mobil Delvac 1300 meets;
API CK-4/SP
ACEA A-11-22 and E7
Ford WSS -M2C171-F1

40c 80
100c 12
150c 3.6
SA .9
BN 9.4

 

[kschachn]

I just don't get it why newer vehicle uses older specs oil, maybe 0w30 was too thin? I remember Ram EcoDiesel originally was using 5w30 oil, and there were many engine failures, so FCA switched to 5w40 oil.

No that’s not how it works. The winter rating does not determine the operating viscosity. HT/HS does and that is dictated by the approval. Forget grade and deal with the ACEA Sequence here.

 

[YZJB]

Yes, Ford changed the spec from 0W-30 C2 to 5W-30 A5.

Your Transit 2.0L EcoBlue requires 5W-30 A5 meeting Ford WSS-M2C913-D.

End of story.

PS: your owner’s manual says this!

 

[Pasechnik]

Okay probably BKFA/BKAA engine then. No DPF?
9.3L or 12L Sump?

Could narrow it down if we know FWD/RWD/AWD.
VIN is from Benimar so does not help as much.

A5/B5 with Ford WSS-M2C913-C, Ford WSS-M2C913-D.

Basically A3/B3 0/5W30 if you don't have DPF, and C3 if you do.

Sorry. The vehicle is 2025 Euro 6 with EVERYTHING.... DPF, AdBlue, EGR, Catalytic Converter every eco device is added.

It is FWD 8 speed auto.

 

[Pasechnik]

No that’s not how it works. The winter rating does not determine the operating viscosity. HT/HS does and that is dictated by the approval. Forget grade and deal with the ACEA Sequence here.

You are absolutely right. Oil weight is not that critical nowadays.

Actually I checked both oil specs (Castrol Magnatec 0W30 D and Castrol Magnatec 5W30 A5) and Castrol Magnatec 0W30 D

Both oils have very close thickness specs at all temps.

Castrol Magnatec 5W30 A5 Viscosity, Kinematic 100C is 10.1
Castrol Magnatec 0W30 D Viscosity, Kinematic 100C is 9.9

They are very different by ACEA specs.

 

[Pasechnik]

Yes, Ford changed the spec from 0W-30 C2 to 5W-30 A5.

Your Transit 2.0L EcoBlue requires 5W-30 A5 meeting Ford WSS-M2C913-D.

End of story.

PS: your owner’s manual says this!

Yes, you are correct, manual says exactly Ford WSS-M2C913-D.

ACEA C2 is newer, more eco friendly DPF friendly oils why switch back to ACEA A5/B5 oils?

Any mechanical issues, like main bearings or con rod bearings issues, or camshaft failures?
It must be serious reason to go backwards...

The question is WHY?

I know there is no better place to ask oil questions than HERE!

 

[YZJB]

Yes, you are correct, manual says exactly Ford WSS-M2C913-D.

ACEA C2 is newer, more eco friendly DPF friendly oils why switch back to ACEA A5/B5 oils?

Any mechanical issues, like main bearings or con rod bearings issues, or camshaft failures?
It must be serious reason to go backwards...

The question is WHY?

I know there is no better place to ask oil questions than HERE!

It’s not backwards, it’s just different.

A5 oils tend to have higher SAPS and ZDDP so may provide better wear protection compared to low SAPS oils like C2.

Ford has probably worked out that the durability of the emissions equipment bolted to the 2.0L EcoBlue is not adversely affected by a high SAPS oil, so they prefer to use it to help reduce wear.

It may also be more compatible with the wet timing belt and oil pump belt found in the 2.0L EcoBlue (by the way - change the oil every 6 months maximum is my recommendation to help preserve the life of the wet belts).

 

[Pasechnik]

It’s not backwards, it’s just different.

A5 oils tend to have higher SAPS and ZDDP so may provide better wear protection compared to low SAPS oils like C2.

Ford has probably worked out that the durability of the emissions equipment bolted to the 2.0L EcoBlue is not adversely affected by a high SAPS oil, so they prefer to use it to help reduce wear.

It may also be more compatible with the wet timing belt and oil pump belt found in the 2.0L EcoBlue (by the way - change the oil every 6 months maximum is my recommendation to help preserve the life of the wet belts).

Ford originally had some astronomical life expectancy for wet belts, even better than many chains. It was a good sale point especially considering that 2.0 EcoBlue is widely used in commercial vehicles. Also they clamed unbelievable 1% fuel economy... All this went through the window when wet belts showed their REAL life expectancy and their replacement cost 1000+ euro... if done without engine damage.

May be they decided to throw away "huge" 1% fuel economy and got some better belt life? Who knows?

All this is just speculations, it would be nice to hear some real Ford stories, may be some Ford specialists will chime in?

 

[Pasechnik]

Also, I might me wrong, but is it better to have full SAPS oil if higher % sulfur fuel is used?

I will be using motorhome in western parts of Europe, Turkey, Georgia etc, so higher sulfur fuel is expected in these areas.

Can someone correct me if I am wrong?

Thanks

 

[Kalle.J]

Also, I might me wrong, but is it better to have full SAPS oil if higher % sulfur fuel is used?

I will be using motorhome in western parts of Europe, Turkey, Georgia etc, so higher sulfur fuel is expected in these areas.

Can someone correct me if I am wrong?

Thanks

I stand by my first recommendation, C3 has higher HTHS then C2 and A5/B5.

Also this:
"Effective January 1, 2011 Turkey adopted European fuel quality standards, limiting sulfur to 10 ppm in both diesel and gasoline."

"Since 2017, the quality of gasoline in Georgia has been equal to the Euro 5 standard. The tightening of standards has led to increased compliance control measures."
https://1tv.ge/lang/en/news/does-fuel-quality-in-georgia-meet-standards/

 

[Kalle.J]

Sorry. The vehicle is 2025 Euro 6 with EVERYTHING.... DPF, AdBlue, EGR, Catalytic Converter every eco device is added.

It is FWD 8 speed auto.

Hehe, that didn't help. But A5/B5 looks to be the spec. Same as my Volvo, but I still run A3/B4.

Just don't follow that OCI, will make that engine last a whole lot longer.

 

[Pasechnik]

Hehe, that didn't help. But A5/B5 looks to be the spec. Same as my Volvo, but I still run A3/B4.


Just don't follow that OCI, will make that engine last a whole lot longer.

I just checked Ford's 40,000 km or 2-year checkup.... It seems like it's the first oil change....

Are they out of their minds? 40k kms first oil change... I am the oil school... first oil change 1000km, then 10k km or 10k miles max.

I own '17 Ram EcoDiesel 10k miles oil changes, bypass TP (yes Frantz toilet paper oil filter) I drop it every 5k km and add about 1L of oil. The way it is installed it takes about 5 minutes to change it. My oil is as clean @ 10k miles as in cleanest gas vehicle after oil change, no kidding. Yes, my Ram is fully deleted since new...

 

[Kalle.J]

I just checked Ford's 40,000 km or 2-year checkup.... It seems like it's the first oil change....

Are they out of their minds? 40k kms first oil change... I am the oil school... first oil change 1000km, then 10k km or 10k miles max.

Yes they are.