Ford dropping almost all cars from its NA lineup.

Status
Not open for further replies.
What can you expect when the Honda Accord and Toyota Camry continue to be bestsellers? People who buy those cars feel more confident that their car will treat them better than a Ford will.

By building trucks the way they do, they build vehicles that Honda and Toyota don't match.
 
As said above, Ford can import product from other continents as needed. They only need to ensure that what is built in other locations is capable of meeting all standards for North America. Pretty easy when done on large scale.

However, they are going to lose the buyer that wants a car - ahead of the changing market scenario - from all trucks & CUV's
 
Cross-overs are built on car chassis anyway. Remember that. You can turn a crossover back to car on a modular production basis, so don't get too worried. ... Market agility it's called.
Example: The current Focus shares a platform with the puffed-upward C-Max, and raised, 2"-stretched Escape too.
The Focus Active will be a shorter Ford Escape, as seen here:
https://www.autoblog.com/2018/04/10/ford-focus-active-crossover-everything-we-know/
 
HemiHawk mentioned the Ford 500 (FIVE HUNDRED, actually)

Wasn't the FIVE HUNDRED named to serve as a platform to introduce a CVT (which turned out to be lousy)?

I figured Ford didn't want to trash the "good Taurus name" with an experimental car.

Not a major point in this conversation. Just askin'.
 
Originally Posted By: artificialist
What can you expect when the Honda Accord and Toyota Camry continue to be bestsellers? People who buy those cars feel more confident that their car will treat them better than a Ford will.

By building trucks the way they do, they build vehicles that Honda and Toyota don't match.


Honda and especially Toyota build trucks too. Not F150 levels but they are taking up some significant market space. So even if Toyota only sells 300,000 Tundra/Tacomas, while Ford sells 800K, that is 300K in sales not surrendered into another company's sale report.

Rethink that... small/mid SUV sales (EDIT, I Cropped it down to monthly sales):

Nissan Rogue 36,184
Toyota RAV4 26,655
Chevy Equinox 26,405
Honda CR-V 24,326
Ford Escape 18,947
Jeep Cherokee 14,621
Mazda CX-5 13,463
Subie Forester 10,848
Jeep Compass 10,192
VW Tiguan 8,370

Mid-Sized
Ford Explorer 28,566
Jeep G. Cher. 23,622
Toyota Highl. 21,041
Jeep Wrangler 13,700
Subaru Outback 18,248
Ford Edge 13,660
Hyundai S. Fe 13,146
Toyota 4Runner 11,954
Honda Pilot 18,602
Chevy Traverse 12,313

You see, non-Ford companies are keeping pace with Ford in everything but the F-150 market. Heck, even Subaru is within 60K units of the Explorer.
 
Last edited:
Midsize cars single month for example (FYI, most sales are down by like 33% as of AY 18):

Toyota Camry 24,638
Nissan Altima 20,185
Honda Accord 17,677
Ford Fusion 10,352
Chevry Malibu 7,553
Hyundai Sonata 6,027
Kia Optima 5,198
Subaru Legacy 3,288
VW Passat 2,434
Mazda 6 1,552
Buick Regal 568
Chrysler 200 251
Volkswagen CC 49
Dodge Avenger 1

First note... who in the heck bought a Avenger????

Sure that 10K Fusion Sale is not as much as the Edge (13K) and the margins are not there but that is still 10K in monthly sales not going to GM or anyone else. Granted, the Edge/Escape will suffer in the gas price issue.
 
Originally Posted By: FutureDoc
First note... who in the heck bought a Avenger????

I thought they didn't make those anymore??
 
Originally Posted By: Brybo86
What I dont get is all the hate on here from MPG snobs.
Ford is selling little deathboxes at a loss.
They want to stop making them.

On one hand the MPG crowd are "snobs"

Yet he calls compacts "deathboxes"


But it's the first crowd showing hate.

The irony.
 
Originally Posted By: FutureDoc
Midsize cars single month for example (FYI, most sales are down by like 33% as of AY 18):

Toyota Camry 24,638
Nissan Altima 20,185
Honda Accord 17,677
Ford Fusion 10,352
Chevry Malibu 7,553
Hyundai Sonata 6,027
Kia Optima 5,198
Subaru Legacy 3,288
VW Passat 2,434
Mazda 6 1,552
Buick Regal 568
Chrysler 200 251
Volkswagen CC 49
Dodge Avenger 1

First note... who in the heck bought a Avenger????

...a wannabe superhero....


To Ford dropping sales of all cars from its NA line up:

meh.
12.gif
 
As I said in another thread, I could not care less; the only Ford I've seriously considered owning has been the Mustang GT with the Performance Package.
Although I wouldn't mind a Fiesta ST for a work beater...
 
Originally Posted By: FutureDoc

.
.
Mazda 6 1,552
Buick Regal 568
Chrysler 200 251
Volkswagen CC 49
Dodge Avenger 1

First note... who in the heck bought a Avenger????

Probably the last one from leftover stock at a dealer.
 
Originally Posted By: FutureDoc

Sure that 10K Fusion Sale is not as much as the Edge (13K) and the margins are not there but that is still 10K in monthly sales not going to GM or anyone else. Granted, the Edge/Escape will suffer in the gas price issue.


But can those declining sales and profits finance a redesign or refresh? If not, it makes sense to cut the product out. Some will migrate to the new product, some will go to the competition. But it makes no sense to continue to sell something that will cost you $$. And auto manufacturing has HUGE upfront costs with no guarantee of success.
 
Originally Posted By: FutureDoc
Sure that 10K Fusion Sale is not as much as the Edge (13K) and the margins are not there but that is still 10K in monthly sales not going to GM or anyone else.

Without knowing the exact margins, you really can't tell if those 10K Fusion sales are a good thing or a bad thing for Ford.

Let's play an optimist and assume that Ford is not losing money on each Fusion sale, but if they want to increase profitability, why should they continue producing and selling a low margin Fusion when they could be utilizing their resources to make more and sell more of the more profitable items such as trucks and SUVs instead? If you are an investor, would you hold onto to a poor performing stock when you could swap it out for a better performing one?
 
Ward's

Quote:
Unlike crosstown rivals Ford and FCA US, General Motors does not plan to dramatically pare its car lineup as buyers continue to flock toward trucks and CUVs. In fact, the Detroit automaker says more cars are coming.


Quote:
GM reportedly is eyeing discontinuing the Sonic compact car and Impala large sedan, but it would still carry a large stable of cars without the two.

Cars account for 32.4% of the U.S. market, down sharply from just a few years ago, whereas CUVs command 38.2% off rapid growth recently, according to Wards Intelligence data. The trend does not appear to be waning anytime soon, but cars still accounted for 6.1 million deliveries in 2017.
 
Originally Posted By: supton
Ward's

Quote:
Unlike crosstown rivals Ford and FCA US, General Motors does not plan to dramatically pare its car lineup as buyers continue to flock toward trucks and CUVs. In fact, the Detroit automaker says more cars are coming.


Quote:
GM reportedly is eyeing discontinuing the Sonic compact car and Impala large sedan, but it would still carry a large stable of cars without the two.

Cars account for 32.4% of the U.S. market, down sharply from just a few years ago, whereas CUVs command 38.2% off rapid growth recently, according to Wards Intelligence data. The trend does not appear to be waning anytime soon, but cars still accounted for 6.1 million deliveries in 2017.


Impala was improved in many ways but they had already ruined the name with the previous model … thin out the herd and feed the rest more and better hay … (heard that, Jeep division) ...
 
Originally Posted By: wemay
Originally Posted By: Brybo86
What I dont get is all the hate on here from MPG snobs.
Ford is selling little deathboxes at a loss.
They want to stop making them.

On one hand the MPG crowd are "snobs"

Yet he calls compacts "deathboxes"


But it's the first crowd showing hate.

The irony.


Hmm... I don't think I see it. The MPG snobs are sad that the cars are going away. But they never really sold well compared to SUV/trucks. Enthusiasts just aren't enough to carry a market. Fracking looks like it's around to stay so it's probably going to put a lid on the very top of where gas prices can go.

On the other hand, it's well known that small cars have at least a 2-3x higher death rate than larger cars/trucks, hence calling them a deathbox is actually accurate. The best advice regarding surviving an accident in a small car? Don't have one.
 
Originally Posted By: itguy08
But can those declining sales and profits finance a redesign or refresh? If not, it makes sense to cut the product out. Some will migrate to the new product, some will go to the competition. But it makes no sense to continue to sell something that will cost you $$. And auto manufacturing has HUGE upfront costs with no guarantee of success.


This.

Redesign that fail can belly up a company, especially in a declining market like sedan.
 
Originally Posted By: Sayjac
Conceding the Fusion segment to the other players. Interesting.

The Detroit Three saw declining rental fleet sales, I think Alan Mulally's predecessor was saying he wants less Fords ending up as rental cars. There was a point in time that if you got a rental car, it would be a Taurus/Corsica or Lumina/K-Car or Sebring. Now, Nissan is very aggressively pushing themselves with the rental companies, the Altima and Sentra are now the de facto rental car.

Also, most "business" men are only wanting to see short-term profits than long-term revenue and dividends for their shareholders. Ford just cut a blank check to Hyundai Kia, Toyota, Honda and Nissan but it will come back to bite them when CAFE tightens up again and oil prices soar.

One thing I do give Ford credit for - global platforms. Ford has probably pulled this off better than GM did. In case they want to build cars in NAFTA again, they can do a phase-in with some tooling changes.
 
Last edited:
I'm old enough to have observed a number of large businesses do this very same thing. To concentrate on the very profitable, and discard the rest.

It's universally a mistake, regardless of the business, or subject.

Handing over profits to others by limiting the scope of business is to cede or abdicate a competitive advantage. When times change, and they will, a company cannot compete with what they don't provide.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top