Flakes of metal in oil filter

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Hey guys. Truck is a 2014 tundra with the 5.7, 240k miles. I switched over to HPL 5w30 HDEO from Schaeffers 5w30 supreme 9000. I put 7883 miles on the oil before I changed the filter (I didn't want to go a full 10k as usual based on what I've read and seen on this forum and the carbon build up in the filters), I've been letting it dry out a few days. Upon inspection I didn't find the carbon build up others have posted (I'm assuming this is from the the 5k OCI Toyota oil the PO used and the Schaeffers 10k OCI I used since then, bought the truck with 172k), but have found 60+ metal flakes in the oil filter. They're not magnetic, so I'm assuming they're aluminum. All the oil filters I cut open previously never had any metal flakes. And I've cut open every filter for every oil change I've done on this truck. My driving habits haven't changed, and I have UOAs from previous oil changes and everything looks great. I did get a sample of oil when I changed my filter (fumoto valve on the oil pan), ill be sending it off this week. What in world is happening? Is this a bad batch of oil? Mechanical anomaly? These engines can run for many hundreds of thousands of miles, so I wasn't expecting to see this from what was a healthy engine last UOA. The only thing that changed was the oil used. I'm not placing blame on the HPL oil, it's just the only thing I can think of that has changed.
 

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Not magnetic? I think that rules out anything that rotates? Kia joke in there somewhere. Maybe it's filter mfg debris.
 

Sumo91

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I would never consider running OCI's that long on an engine with that many miles.
It's like an 80 y.o. man partying 'till dawn.
5000 mile or less OCI FTW
 

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Debris captured by the filter won't necessarily appear in UOA (though it might). Even if the metals are the same, it's different kinds of wear that can have different root causes. That's why in aviation we do both UOA and filter inspection.

The small number of tiny particles in your photo appears to be in the "normal" range for most aviation piston engines. At least, if something catastrophic happened it would be worse. But it's the trend that matters. If you didn't have them before, and now you do, then something bad happened. In aviation what we usually do when we get a UOA report or oil filter that is unusual but not catastrophic -- is change the oil then use the engine normally for a while, then take another oil sample and cut the filter open and inspect again.
 

Sumo91

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Debris captured by the filter won't necessarily appear in UOA (though it might). Even if the metals are the same, it's different kinds of wear that can have different root causes. That's why in aviation we do both UOA and filter inspection.

The small number of tiny particles in your photo appears to be in the "normal" range for most aviation piston engines. At least, if something catastrophic happened it would be worse. But it's the trend that matters. If you didn't have them before, and now you do, then something bad happened. In aviation what we usually do when we get a UOA report or oil filter that is unusual but not catastrophic -- is change the oil then use the engine normally for a while, then take another oil sample and cut the filter open and inspect again.

I'm definitely gonna be checking the next few filters. It doesn't look like alot in the picture, but when I expand the filter completely, it looks bad. Tons of shiny metal flakes, ill try to get a picture of the entire filter with the flash turned on, maybe that will show what I'm seeing in person. I just took some up close pictures to give an example. I'd say 60-100 or more metal flakes in the filter.
 

wwillson

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@Sumo91 I have cut dozens of filters and have never seen a single element that didn't have metal flakes, not one. If you really want to see the metal, take the cut element into the bright sunlight and tilt it back and forth, you'll see lots of metal flakes. It doesn't matter who makes the engine or the oil, you're going to see metal. Also, if you can see the metal with your eye, the ICP can't, so just because you can see flakes, doesn't mean the metal will be elevated in your UOA. Almost certainly there is nothing out of the ordinary with your filter or engine.

Can you show us some pictures of the flakes?

[edit] I just saw your pictures above and got bored looking at them. :) You don't have a metal problem. What you see is perfectly normal.

If you want to see what lots of metal looks like - check this filter out that I cut.

 

Sumo91

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@Sumo91 I have cut dozens of filters and have never seen a single element that didn't have metal flakes, not one. If you really want to see the metal, take the cut element into the bright sunlight and tilt it back and forth, you'll see lots of metal flakes. It doesn't matter who makes the engine or the oil, you're going to see metal. Also, if you can see the metal with your eye, the ICP can't, so just because you can see flakes, doesn't mean the metal will be elevated in your UOA. Almost certainly there is nothing out of the ordinary with your filter or engine.

Can you show us some pictures of the flakes?

[edit] I just saw your pictures above and got bored looking at them. :) You don't have a metal problem. What you see is perfectly normal.

If you want to see what lots of metal looks like - check this filter out that I cut.

Holy cow! That filter you posted is terrible!

I did look at my filter with both a flashlight and in the sunlight, it's definitely got some glitter in there. Previous filters didn't look like this, which is why I'm concerned (the pictures I posted don't do it justice, I just wanted to get an up close photo of the flakes I'm talking about). Maybe I'm just overthinking it, maybe I didn't look hard enough at my past oil filters. I'm not sure. I just wanted to make a post and get some different opinions. I feel better now reading some of these posts. But I'll definitely be keeping am eye out going forward. I appreciate you taking the time to reply! I always look forward to your posts
 
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What I see appears to be normal, especially for an engine with over 200K miles on it. You could try switching back to the oil you used in the past again and see if there's any difference.
 
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Tundra v8 engine is not very demanding as far as engine oil is concerned ... Curious why you are using a fancy oil?
btw, not suggesting that the issues (if any) are oil related.
 

Sumo91

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Tundra v8 engine is not very demanding as far as engine oil is concerned ... Curious why you are using a fancy oil?
btw, not suggesting that the issues (if any) are oil related.

I don't believe the issues are oil related. I just wanted to post any variables and be detailed about any changes, and get some opinions from there.

And I use great oil due to my driving conditions. Towing, off roading, living in the south where it's hot, etc. I keep my vehicles indefinitely as well, so I want them to last as long as possible, so I use the best stuff, whether it be oil or parts.
 

ZeeOSix

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Not magnetic? I think that rules out anything that rotates? Kia joke in there somewhere. Maybe it's filter mfg debris.
Cam bearings and pistons are aluminum. Rod and crank bearings are non magnetic material. Cam chain tensioner back bones are typically aluminum, but the tensioner material (nylon?) would have to be worn through for the chain to chew aluminum. But if no cam chain tensioner material seen, then probably not that.

If the engine doesn't seem any different sounding I'd cut the next filter again to monitor.
 

Sumo91

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Cam bearings and pistons are aluminum. Rod and crank bearings are non magnetic material. Cam chain tensioner back bones are typically aluminum, but the tensioner material (nylon?) would have to be worn through for the chain to chew aluminum. But if no cam chain tensioner material seen, then probably not that.

If the engine doesn't seem any different sounding I'd cut the next filter again to monitor.

This is the kind of thinking I was looking for! Thank you very much. Cam chain tensioner guide could very well be worn out with this many miles, the drivers side tensioner tends to get weak on these trucks since the oil gallery is so small (the new ones from toyota have a much larger gallery) and allows a slight bit of timing chain "slap" om start up, I've heard it a couple times, but not as bad as alot of people on the tundra forums. I'll remove the oil fill neck and peek down there with a flashlight to see if I notice anything out of the obvious.
 
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My 2005 bmw 325i is now at 245k miles.

I have been discovering non metalic flakes since the first oc i did at 150k miles when i just got it.

Car has always had 15k ocis all its life.
In the beginning i was concerned about this but now i recon its "normal" it still the same after almost 100k miles since i had it.

Did on uoa and it checked out fine.

Screenshot_20220520-215717_Gallery.jpg
 

Sumo91

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My 2005 bmw 325i is now at 245k miles.

I have been discovering non metalic flakes since the first oc i did at 150k miles when i just got it.

Car has always had 15k ocis all its life.
In the beginning i was concerned about this but now i recon its "normal" it still the same after almost 100k miles since i had it.

Did on uoa and it checked out fine.

View attachment 100806
Thanks for the reply! I think I'm over it now honestly. I guess it was just the initial shock of seeing it, and I made a post immediately. Truck is still running great.
 
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