2005 V6 Honda accord. what suggestions do you have for a good filter with anti drain back qualities?
I have tried fram ultra and pure one.
I have tried fram ultra and pure one.
Filter Recommendation with good Anti drain back
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Forgot to mention, I use Mobil 1 Synthetic and Pennzoil Ultra with 8K OCI
Did you have trouble with the ADBV on the PureOne or the Fram Ultra? I'm looking at both of those right now.
Previously I bought 3 Mobil 1 filters online and all of them failed the "blow test". I installed 1 on the car because I doubted how this could be true, but the oil pressure gauge showed it was a real problem. I haven't bothered with the other 2.
The basic Purolator I put in it's place was sealed tight.
If you buy it in a store, you can blow into the center of the filter to make sure the ADBV doesn't leak.
I think there's been some uncertainty about how long the PureOne is supposed to last, so I might hesitate to use it on your OCI. It might be a borderline case.
Fram Ultra is advertised for well over your miles and seems to be well built.
Previously I bought 3 Mobil 1 filters online and all of them failed the "blow test". I installed 1 on the car because I doubted how this could be true, but the oil pressure gauge showed it was a real problem. I haven't bothered with the other 2.
The basic Purolator I put in it's place was sealed tight.
If you buy it in a store, you can blow into the center of the filter to make sure the ADBV doesn't leak.
I think there's been some uncertainty about how long the PureOne is supposed to last, so I might hesitate to use it on your OCI. It might be a borderline case.
Fram Ultra is advertised for well over your miles and seems to be well built.
Mobil 1 or Royal Purple. Every once in a while they have great deals at Pep Boys. Would not pay full price for these. Pure One rest of the time.
I use a Mann also, but it has a nitrile anti drain back so I didn't suggest it. Nice filter though.
I use a Mann also, but it has a nitrile anti drain back so I didn't suggest it. Nice filter though.
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You want a silicone (orange) ADBV vs. a Nitrile (black) ADBV which can harden and shrink from hot oil. Whichever brand that uses silicone you like. Based on what you tried so far, IMO ADB is not your problem. Both were high efficiency filters which are harder to push oil through. May cause a lag. Try a lower efficiency filter, see what happens. If the filter is responsible for the startup tick at all, that is. Years ago it used to be, not that much anymore.
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
You want a silicone (orange) ADBV vs. a Nitrile (black) ADBV which can harden and shrink from hot oil. Whichever brand that uses silicone you like. Based on what you tried so far, IMO ADB is not your problem. Both were high efficiency filters which are harder to push oil through. May cause a lag. Try a lower efficiency filter, see what happens. If the filter is responsible for the startup tick at all, that is. Years ago it used to be, not that much anymore.
thanks! Can you recommend one?
You want a silicone (orange) ADBV vs. a Nitrile (black) ADBV which can harden and shrink from hot oil. Whichever brand that uses silicone you like. Based on what you tried so far, IMO ADB is not your problem. Both were high efficiency filters which are harder to push oil through. May cause a lag. Try a lower efficiency filter, see what happens. If the filter is responsible for the startup tick at all, that is. Years ago it used to be, not that much anymore.
thanks! Can you recommend one?
Originally Posted By: kenpoed
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
You want a silicone (orange) ADBV vs. a Nitrile (black) ADBV which can harden and shrink from hot oil. Whichever brand that uses silicone you like. Based on what you tried so far, IMO ADB is not your problem. Both were high efficiency filters which are harder to push oil through. May cause a lag. Try a lower efficiency filter, see what happens. If the filter is responsible for the startup tick at all, that is. Years ago it used to be, not that much anymore.
thanks! Can you recommend one?
Well, if you want to try a cheap flow/efficiency test on the fly, you could buy a cheap 97% @20u $3.97 purolator classic from walmart and slap it on. I would probably take Mud's MC recommendation. MC filters are lower efficiency (+-94% AFAIK) and silicone ADBV.
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
You want a silicone (orange) ADBV vs. a Nitrile (black) ADBV which can harden and shrink from hot oil. Whichever brand that uses silicone you like. Based on what you tried so far, IMO ADB is not your problem. Both were high efficiency filters which are harder to push oil through. May cause a lag. Try a lower efficiency filter, see what happens. If the filter is responsible for the startup tick at all, that is. Years ago it used to be, not that much anymore.
thanks! Can you recommend one?
Well, if you want to try a cheap flow/efficiency test on the fly, you could buy a cheap 97% @20u $3.97 purolator classic from walmart and slap it on. I would probably take Mud's MC recommendation. MC filters are lower efficiency (+-94% AFAIK) and silicone ADBV.
kenpoed, why are you looking for a filter with the best ADBV?
The oil filter on the J-series V6 is right at the bottom, with the base facing up.
The oil filter on the J-series V6 is right at the bottom, with the base facing up.
Originally Posted By: gregoron
How about OEM?
Whats interesting about Asian OEM filters (Toyota and Honda anyways) is there appears to be a trend towards lower efficiency/faster flow. Amsoil performed tests in 2011 showing both Honda and Toyota OEM having very low efficiency. Why both manufacturers? Maybe they know something we don't. Here is the posted test. I think its reasonably accurate because it lists the MC FL820S close to the known efficiency. Neither Toyota or Honda disclose any filter details, so this is all we got..
How about OEM?
Whats interesting about Asian OEM filters (Toyota and Honda anyways) is there appears to be a trend towards lower efficiency/faster flow. Amsoil performed tests in 2011 showing both Honda and Toyota OEM having very low efficiency. Why both manufacturers? Maybe they know something we don't. Here is the posted test. I think its reasonably accurate because it lists the MC FL820S close to the known efficiency. Neither Toyota or Honda disclose any filter details, so this is all we got..
I have had a lot of problems with this on my Jeep. After testing a LOT of filters I had the best results with the Motorcraft "S" series and the Fram Tough Guard filters. Those two were head and shoulders above everything else I tried and I tried a lot of high quality filters including the PureOne. I don't think they make an "S" series for your Honda so you could try the Tough Guard.
I honestly don't know why the Tough Guard works so well, it does have a silicone ADBV but so did a lot of filters that didn't cut it. Construction is very similar to the orange can and those are noisy for me, so is the Extended Guard/Ultra but the Tough Guard is the bomb, go figure. I've seen a number of comments regarding good starting qualities with the TG for some reason, which is why I tried it, and it worked.
I honestly don't know why the Tough Guard works so well, it does have a silicone ADBV but so did a lot of filters that didn't cut it. Construction is very similar to the orange can and those are noisy for me, so is the Extended Guard/Ultra but the Tough Guard is the bomb, go figure. I've seen a number of comments regarding good starting qualities with the TG for some reason, which is why I tried it, and it worked.
The Ultra and the tough guard are both 99% high efficiency with silicone ADBV. But..the TG is single layer syn-cellulose blend. The Ultra is extended interval 2xlayer + screen synthetic.
This raises issue I'm thinking about. That its not about ADB at all, its about a restriction causing a lag in oil flow, and the assumption that we can put any filter on any engine. Restriction caused by a high efficiency filter, lag caused by a weak/underpowered oil pump. Maybe thats the real reason. Maybe there is a method to the madness of low efficiency OEM filters, they know what they designed and how strong the pump is. Design a filter accordingly. Speculating but I'm beginning to wonder...
This raises issue I'm thinking about. That its not about ADB at all, its about a restriction causing a lag in oil flow, and the assumption that we can put any filter on any engine. Restriction caused by a high efficiency filter, lag caused by a weak/underpowered oil pump. Maybe thats the real reason. Maybe there is a method to the madness of low efficiency OEM filters, they know what they designed and how strong the pump is. Design a filter accordingly. Speculating but I'm beginning to wonder...
I'm about to put in a Hyundai/Kia OEM oil filter in my Honda CRV. The reviews are great, silicone anti-drainback valve, and a really low price to boot (less than $5.00).
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
This raises issue I'm thinking about. That its not about ADB at all...
That is kinda my thinking as well, I don't really think it is just the silicone ADBV on the TG that is completely responsible for the good starts with the TG. I suspect something about the media has something to do with it as well, but I don't have that figured out.
This raises issue I'm thinking about. That its not about ADB at all...
That is kinda my thinking as well, I don't really think it is just the silicone ADBV on the TG that is completely responsible for the good starts with the TG. I suspect something about the media has something to do with it as well, but I don't have that figured out.
Originally Posted By: Kool1
I'm about to put in a Hyundai/Kia OEM oil filter in my Honda CRV. The reviews are great, silicone anti-drainback valve, and a really low price to boot (less than $5.00).
To tie this in to what I'm thinking..The Hyundai/Kia OEM reviews are great but why? I read it gets rid of the anti-drainback tick. Really? Is that really the problem, or is it simply a low efficiency Asian filter (like Toyota and Honda) designed for an underpowered/weak oil pump? Ahhh Now we getting somewhere on this suspicion I have ..
Hyundai Technical Service Bulletin
Subject USE OF AFTERMARKET ENGINE OIL FILTERS CAUSING ENGINE KNOCKING NOISE
Group ENGINE MECHANICAL
Number 05-20-002
Date JULY, 2005
Model ALL MODELS
CIRCULATE TO: [ ] GENERAL MANAGER
[X] SERVICE MANAGER [X] SERVICE ADVISOR [X] WARRANTY MGR [ ] SALES MANAGER [X] PARTS MANAGER [X] TECHNICIAN
DESCRIPTION:
Some vehicles may experience an engine knock noise with the use of an aftermarket oil filter. Aftermarket oil filters may use different materials, construction and specifications than genuine Hyundai oil filters, which may lead to pressure variations within the engine, thus contributing to an engine knocking noise.
VEHICLES AFFECTED:
All Models
REPAIR PROCEDURE:
Perform an oil change on the vehicle and replace the aftermarket oil filter with a genuine Hyundai oil filter.
WARRANTY INFORMATION:
Normal warranty procedures apply.
This is not a warranty repair.
------------------------------------------------------
Description from above:
"Some vehicles may experience an engine knock noise with the use of an aftermarket oil filter. Aftermarket oil filters may use different materials, construction and specifications than genuine Hyundai oil filters, which may lead to pressure variations within the engine, thus contributing to an engine knocking noise".
My translation:
"The tiny arse oil pump is not strong enough to push oil through the tiny holes of a high efficiency filter. You gotta use our low efficiency better flowing filter. Dirty oil, but she won't tick".
I'm about to put in a Hyundai/Kia OEM oil filter in my Honda CRV. The reviews are great, silicone anti-drainback valve, and a really low price to boot (less than $5.00).
To tie this in to what I'm thinking..The Hyundai/Kia OEM reviews are great but why? I read it gets rid of the anti-drainback tick. Really? Is that really the problem, or is it simply a low efficiency Asian filter (like Toyota and Honda) designed for an underpowered/weak oil pump? Ahhh Now we getting somewhere on this suspicion I have ..
Hyundai Technical Service Bulletin
Subject USE OF AFTERMARKET ENGINE OIL FILTERS CAUSING ENGINE KNOCKING NOISE
Group ENGINE MECHANICAL
Number 05-20-002
Date JULY, 2005
Model ALL MODELS
CIRCULATE TO: [ ] GENERAL MANAGER
[X] SERVICE MANAGER [X] SERVICE ADVISOR [X] WARRANTY MGR [ ] SALES MANAGER [X] PARTS MANAGER [X] TECHNICIAN
DESCRIPTION:
Some vehicles may experience an engine knock noise with the use of an aftermarket oil filter. Aftermarket oil filters may use different materials, construction and specifications than genuine Hyundai oil filters, which may lead to pressure variations within the engine, thus contributing to an engine knocking noise.
VEHICLES AFFECTED:
All Models
REPAIR PROCEDURE:
Perform an oil change on the vehicle and replace the aftermarket oil filter with a genuine Hyundai oil filter.
WARRANTY INFORMATION:
Normal warranty procedures apply.
This is not a warranty repair.
------------------------------------------------------
Description from above:
"Some vehicles may experience an engine knock noise with the use of an aftermarket oil filter. Aftermarket oil filters may use different materials, construction and specifications than genuine Hyundai oil filters, which may lead to pressure variations within the engine, thus contributing to an engine knocking noise".
My translation:
"The tiny arse oil pump is not strong enough to push oil through the tiny holes of a high efficiency filter. You gotta use our low efficiency better flowing filter. Dirty oil, but she won't tick".
The problem I see with that hypothesis Leaky is the one filter that was specifically pictured on the Hyundai TSB was an e-core, a very good flowing filter with an absolute garbage combo bypass ADBV. I think part of the problem was the ecore valve.
So I don't think flow is entirely it...but I think it is part of it. Honda and Toyota are using very low efficiency (read high flow) OEM filters as you know, but I've never seen an efficiency rating on the OEM Hyundai/KIA filters. I sure would like to, I suspect they are very low as well.
So I don't think flow is entirely it...but I think it is part of it. Honda and Toyota are using very low efficiency (read high flow) OEM filters as you know, but I've never seen an efficiency rating on the OEM Hyundai/KIA filters. I sure would like to, I suspect they are very low as well.
Yeah, makes sense. But I think people are caught up with filter brand names when its partly pump/flow/design. Reading this response letter From Champion Labs, it looks like they tested in a lab and found nothing. Makes sense, without testing the filter on a Hyundai or with a Hyundai oil pump somehow, they will find nothing. http://www.showmetheparts.com/BIN/documents/Champ/Firestone Hyundai Bulletin.pdf
I guess a clue would be lowering efficiency. the tick goes away, maybe a weak pump. Hard one to prove one way or another regardless. Something for the oversized filter/oil bypass filter crowd to think about anyways.
I guess a clue would be lowering efficiency. the tick goes away, maybe a weak pump. Hard one to prove one way or another regardless. Something for the oversized filter/oil bypass filter crowd to think about anyways.
Have an oil change coming up on the Grand Prix. Super quiet, except for a very occasional startup tick. It has an ultra on it. Pretty oil all the way to its 9k change. going to try your tough guard suggestion. If that makes a difference I think we know why.
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