F-14 Questions Answered - Ask Away

[y_p_w]

I completely forgot about Iran. But I've not seen any concrete reports. I'd imagine Iraq probably claimed some kills that might not have happened and Iron probably would acknowledge fewer than the truth.

I should have said in US service. Thanks for the correction!

Iran has said that they had several F-14s lost in combat, but I would think finding the number might be difficult. How many they still have in service is unsure, but they basically have to canibalize what they have for parts and hope that it's enough. I'm thinking by now they've resorted to try and make their own parts. They supposedly made their own version of the Phoenix missile and other weapons.

 

[burbguy82]

Iran has said that they had several F-14s lost in combat, but I would think finding the number might be difficult. How many they still have in service is unsure, but they basically have to canibalize what they have for parts and hope that it's enough. I'm thinking by now they've resorted to try and make their own parts. They supposedly made their own version of the Phoenix missile and other weapons.

Selling F-14s, should be illegal, although smart to sell to the enemies for sure.

 

[y_p_w]

Selling F-14s, should be illegal, although smart to sell to the enemies for sure.

This was over 50 years ago. But I heard that several countries evaluated the F-14 and passed on it. But Grumman would have loved to sell them and I don't believe the US had any kind of embargo on it for friendly nations.

 

[spasm3]

@Astro14

Collectible for you!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1844725877...zbATTdb29sfJa6kYvQllmiuXaP|tkp:Bk9SR6Tup4irZA

 

[y_p_w]

@Astro14

Collectible for you!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1844725877...zbATTdb29sfJa6kYvQllmiuXaP|tkp:Bk9SR6Tup4irZA

What use would it be without the rocket boosters?

 

[loneryder]

We just bought a farm in the Blue Ridge Mountains of southwestern Virginia and it is located under three practice routes for F-15E Strike Eagles out of Seymour Johnson AFB. Apparently our mountainous terrain is similar to Afghanistan and we get fly overs nearly every day - we call it the "roar of freedom" and love it! I have been trying to get some pictures of them, but these puppies are fast! I managed to take this one with a 500mm lens but he was pretty far off by the time I grabbed the camera and dashed out the door. I'll keep trying for better shots.

Tom NJ

They used to practice low altitude flying over my hollow here in WV. They came out of Dover and Martinburg, WV Air Nat Guard. One day I was out on my deck and one came over low and slow. I threw my fist into the air and the pilot wiggled his wings back at me. Made my day!!

 

[loneryder]

He was CO of VF-33 when I was at Oceana...his JOs were my peers, and many are still friends to this day. I've flown with Snort a few times, brought an airplane to an airshow for him and swapped lies (I mean stories) at the Oceana O'Club...he was a really, really great stick (pilot) and could fly the jet to its full potential...

Ever know a Regbo. His name was Reggie. He may be older.

 

[Random_Kiwi]

@Astro14 with the ejection seat, I know there is typically two methods (not all seats have both methods) to initiate ejection - the face curtain and the handle between your legs.

When you yank on that handle to start the ejection sequence, I assume that the handle doesn't actually move a large distance, and has a dual purpose of (assuming you keep holding onto it) helping to keep the air crews arms and elbows tucked in during the ejection sequence.

Is that correct?

 

[burbguy82]

This was over 50 years ago. But I heard that several countries evaluated the F-14 and passed on it. But Grumman would have loved to sell them and I don't believe the US had any kind of embargo on it for friendly nations.

yeah, i dont know much about the subject, but it would be an advantage, for our enemies to have our stuff i would think....especially the older stuff.

 

[Astro14]

@Astro14 with the ejection seat, I know there is typically two methods (not all seats have both methods) to initiate ejection - the face curtain and the handle between your legs.

When you yank on that handle to start the ejection sequence, I assume that the handle doesn't actually move a large distance, and has a dual purpose of (assuming you keep holding onto it) helping to keep the air crews arms and elbows tucked in during the ejection sequence.

Is that correct?

It moves about two or 3 inches. I’m not certain. I’ve never had to pull it. The face curtain, believe it or not, was designed to reduce flail and other injuries from a high-speed ejection. A lot of modern aircraft simply have the one ejection handle between your legs.

For example:

https://martin-baker.com/ejection-seats/us16e/

 

[Astro14]

Ever know a Regbo. His name was Reggie. He may be older.

I haven’t run across him. But it has been a long time since I was flying the airplane.

 

[Astro14]

@Astro14

Collectible for you!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1844725877...zbATTdb29sfJa6kYvQllmiuXaP|tkp:Bk9SR6Tup4irZA

That is both an incredible find, and a breathtaking asking price. I hate to tell you guys, but it’s not that comfortable of a seat. It’s ergonomic in the sense that it’s designed to protect you. But after an hour or two, it gets pretty hard and uncomfortable, and by the end of an eight hour mission, even my 27-year-old body was pretty unhappy with that seat.

 

[burbguy82]

That is both an incredible find, and a breathtaking asking price. I hate to tell you guys, but it’s not that comfortable of a seat. It’s ergonomic in the sense that it’s designed to protect you. But after an hour or two, it gets pretty hard and uncomfortable, and by the end of an eight hour mission, even my 27-year-old body was pretty unhappy with that seat.

I reckon that support and comfort do not go hand in hand when pulling g's.

HMMWV seats suck to.

 

[john_pifer]

Astro, forgive me if this has already been asked:

What was the loss rate of F-14s in non-combat/training operations as compared to say the F-18 nowadays? Comparable?

As former civilian CFI with moderate understanding of aerodynamics/flight control, in 46 pages of reading the only conclusion I can decisively make is that the F-14 seems to be one unforgiving aircraft comparatively speaking.

I work at BNA (Nashville TN airport), and an F-14 was crashed into a neighborhood right here back in 1996.

Pretty interesting (though tragic) story.

https://apnews.com/article/29192eb55f5d31adafbd21ce938d99c0

I know Astro’s not the biggest fan of Ward Carroll’s monetizing of his time as an F-14 backseater/radar operator/navigator, but his channel has a pretty good video about the crash.

John Stacy Bates, the aviator who crashed it, was actually a former F-14 back seater who took advantage of a Navy program to transition to the front seat.

Here’s Ward’s video.




EDIT: @Astro14 Do you have any comment on the BNA F-14 crash?

 

[IndyFan]

I greatly enjoy Ward Carroll 's channel. He's got some of the best expert guests out there on various topics. I'd say his is in my top 3 favs, with the F-14 stuff playing a significant part in that.

I also deeply value Astro sharing his incredible experiences and insights.

I eat this stuff up like a starving hog in a bowl of gravy.

 

[ZeeOSix]

It moves about two or 3 inches. I’m not certain.

Did pilots back in your F-14 days have and train on an emergency procedure trainer (EPT) simulator?

 

[Tomcatguy111]

Well, I can't recall an F-14 ever being lost in combat. So it would either be training or on duty...like when deployed.

I'm also not sure a loss from a landing mishap on return from a combat mission would be considered a combat loss. Maybe Astro can answer that one.

What's the difference between training and "training" ??

One F-14A+ from VF-103 was lost during Desert Storm. Although there’s been some debate over the years about whether it was the victim of a SAM or AAM from an Iraqi MIG. The crew ejected and pilot became a POW, RIO was rescued. Here is the story.
https://theaviationist.com/2015/05/...me-prisoner-of-war-during-the-first-gulf-war/

 

[Tomcatguy111]

One F-14A+ from VF-103 was lost during Desert Storm. Although there’s been some debate over the years about whether it was the victim of a SAM or AAM from an Iraqi MIG. The crew ejected and pilot became a POW, RIO was rescued. Here is the story.
https://theaviationist.com/2015/05/...me-prisoner-of-war-during-the-first-gulf-war/

Actually I have it backwards, RIO was captured, pilot was rescued. My mistake!

 

[bushande]

Wait. You mean Top Gun wasn't a documentary?

All joking aside, it's assumed that several IRIAF F-14s were lost in combat.

I completely forgot about Iran. But I've not seen any concrete reports. I'd imagine Iraq probably claimed some kills that might not have happened and Iron probably would acknowledge fewer than the truth.

I should have said in US service. Thanks for the correction!

Just for completion / clarification's sake:
I managed to go to Iran and see and photograph some of them myself. I've been trying to keep tabs on them and their whereabouts and whatever snippet of historical information is available for the past 15+ years. Here is the count as far as I am able to make out according to the documentation I was so far able to gather and my own observations within the country:

The IIAF (Imperial Air Force before the revolution) lost 2 units due to accidents

The IRIAF (Islamic Air Force after the revolution) has following losses documented:

10 losses during the war (1980-88) comprising of:
3 losses to A2A combat (Iraqi ambush operation "Giraffe" using newly acquired French Mirage F1s, the IRIAF retaliated about two weeks later downing several Iraqi fighters in the course)
6 losses to Iraqi SAM fire
1 loss upon an unsuccessful defection attempt (Remains of the bird were exhibited by the Iraqis in Bagdhad and cleared by US forces in 2003)

2 losses during the 90s (hardly any flying as the fleet apparently fell into disarray and slumber until around 2002)
They managed to create their own "Frankencat out of serial 3-6004 (BuNo 160302) by marrying the forward fuselage section to the rear of another serial, i.e. one of the two reported serials lost in the 90s. I have images of that ship in flight in early 2005.

Since 2005 following losses are documented:
Serial 3-6002/BuNo 160300 crashlanded in May 2008 sliding across the runway with a collapsed gear (similar to the VF-101 incident in 2001) but was restored and brought back to flying status again in 2012.
Serial 3-6062/BuNo 160360 was shot down by "friendly" fire on Jan 26, 2012 close to Bushehr with a TorM1 SAM operated by the IRGC revolutionary guard corps. Crew was lost
Serial 3-6003/BuNo 160301 crashed on May 14, 2019 at Isfahan upon landing, exited the runway and burned out. Crew ejected
Serial 3-6054/BuNo 160352 - crashed in June 2022 upon delivery from Mehrabat after overhaul due to engine failure, crew ejected.

Summa sumarum:
80 units ordered
79 units recieved
2 losses pre war
10 losses during the war
2 losses post war
3 losses in the '00s

According to that, they should still have 62 airframes available.
57 serials (already the recent crashes in the '00s deducted) can be documented via images and video clips between 2005 and 2024 as in some sort of working order, i.e. taxi, taking off, landing, flying. No idea about their true operational status though.
So there are 5 mystery airframes which are still missing (maybe lingering mothballed cannibalzed somewhere?!)

The last flying IRIAF F-14 has been spotted in early March 2024 arriving at the overhaul facilities at Mehrabat, i.e serial 3-6006 / BuNo 160304. It was last documented in 2011.

 

[billt460]

I didn't check through all 47 pages to see if this had been already posted. But in regards to the F-14 and the flat spin, I came across this. It really shows where the 6+ forward G's are coming from.

The center of rotation is quite far back, behind the cockpit. Almost intersecting with the center of the wing. And the rotation itself is very rapid. A bit like hanging off the end of one of those school yard merry-go-round's, while your buddies spin it as fast as they can until you fly off.

They eject at 1:56, and impact is at 2:38, 42 seconds later.