Equivalent LED T8/T12 tubes?

[y_p_w]

Originally Posted by Rmay635703
Originally Posted by y_p_w
When we had 4 T20 tubes working, it was way too much light.


Holy obscure lightbulb Batman

My mistake. Four F20T12 fluorescent tubes. My mind was on T8 since that's what I put in its place.

 

[PandaBear]

I did a conversion a few years ago from the magnetic ballast T12 to the AC direct no ballast LED tube. It went from 40W to 20W each and is about 1.5x as bright as before. I'd do the conversion to no ballast, it is worth the trouble and you don't have to worry about ballast going bad ever, and it is more efficient in the long run.

 

[SHOZ]

A new ballast cost as much as two 120v LEDs.

 

[JTK]

Another thing to consider when you're converting a fluorescent fixture to LED is you might find you only need half the amount of LED replacement lamps installed in the fixture.

That's how much more light LED tubes will give off compared to T12 or T8 fluorescent.

 

[Carmudgeon]

I'm getting ready to try some of the Toggled T8 retrofits in the kitchen, but I haven't been able to find much talk about them except for here and a thread on GJ, so they, and the company remain a bit of the unknown.

Any additional feedback?

The alternative are the Hyperikon tubes, I'm leaning toward the Toggled because I can get them in odd quantities, at HD for easy buy/return, and because they include tombstones, which Hyperikon used to bundle in the box, but must be requested separately now. All that, and being single-ended simplifies things greatly for me.

I'm done dealing with ballasts, and short-lived tubes due to rapid-short cycling from people popping in and out of the kitchen. Aside from the lesser energy savings, the retrofits that are ballast-compatible add a layer of complexity that's also less desirable.

 

[y_p_w]

I'm getting ready to try some of the Toggled T8 retrofits in the kitchen, but I haven't been able to find much talk about them except for here and a thread on GJ, so they, and the company remain a bit of the unknown.

Any additional feedback?

The alternative are the Hyperikon tubes, I'm leaning toward the Toggled because I can get them in odd quantities, at HD for easy buy/return, and because they include tombstones, which Hyperikon used to bundle in the box, but must be requested separately now. All that, and being single-ended simplifies things greatly for me.

I'm done dealing with ballasts, and short-lived tubes due to rapid-short cycling from people popping in and out of the kitchen. Aside from the lesser energy savings, the retrofits that are ballast-compatible add a layer of complexity that's also less desirable.

They've worked flawlessly for me so far. The only annoyance is that I've got dimmable and non-dimmable on the same switch and the non-dimmable ones take a split second longer to light up.

The tombstones seem kind of cheap though. They're some no-name stuff from China and may already have wires inserted. I've put in Leviton myself. They also contain wire nuts, so I've got a bunch of spares.

 

[Carmudgeon]

They've worked flawlessly for me so far. The only annoyance is that I've got dimmable and non-dimmable on the same switch and the non-dimmable ones take a split second longer to light up.

The tombstones seem kind of cheap though. They're some no-name stuff from China and may already have wires inserted. I've put in Leviton myself. They also contain wire nuts, so I've got a bunch of spares.

I still haven't made a move, and am now leaning toward the Hyperikon tubes, which have much more accumulated experience, and slightly brighter on paper, at least.

The cost of their single-ended tubes, plus buying tombstones is in the same ballpark, and only a minor factor.

I contacted Toggled, and one important thing they cleared up for me is that the single tube packages that HD sells are a slightly older model than the two packs, and do not include tombstones, so for purposes of consistency and convenience, that route offers no benefit. I'd have to buy two double packs anyway.

One thing I have found odd is that it's harder to find decent tombstones in chain stores, at least. Used to be able to choose from different profiles, from trusted brands like Leviton. Now, if they even have them, it's down to one choice.

 

[y_p_w]

I still haven't made a move, and am now leaning toward the Hyperikon tubes, which have much more accumulated experience, and slightly brighter on paper, at least.

The cost of their single-ended tubes, plus buying tombstones is in the same ballpark, and only a minor factor.

I contacted Toggled, and one important thing they cleared up for me is that the single tube packages that HD sells are a slightly older model than the two packs, and do not include tombstones, so for purposes of consistency and convenience, that route offers no benefit. I'd have to buy two double packs anyway.

One thing I have found odd is that it's harder to find decent tombstones in chain stores, at least. Used to be able to choose from different profiles, from trusted brands like Leviton. Now, if they even have them, it's down to one choice.

The ones I got from HD were the 24" versions although they were shipped straight from the manufacturer. They came with tombstones. The brand is "ZING EAR" which are unlike any other I've seen. There's a UL listing. However, they don't have a cardboard backing like the other tombstones I've used. They're all plastic on the outside although it looks like it snapped in place with two plastic pieces. I know it's not ideal, but I've poked through cardboard in order to help release a wire. It's kind of odd how they were packaged. The 48" (single tubes) came packaged with 2 along with 2 wire nuts - one tombstone in a plastic bag with two nuts and the other (dummy) one loose. The 24" single tubes came packaged with a tombstone connected to white/black wires and two wire nuts, plus a dummy tombstone. I don't say dummy in that they are nonworking tombstones, but they're for the dummy end.

I found Leviton tombstones at my local Ace Hardware. I bought a pair when I accidentally cracked one inserting a tube. Home Depot listed them only for shipping and not in store.

 

[alarmguy]

Since you already replaced ballasts in the past and have an understanding of wiring.
Why not remove the ballasts and install LED Tubes?

 

[y_p_w]

I spoke too soon about the tubes being "flawless". My wife started noticing one of the 4' dimmable tubes was flickering. I checked it out, looked at the socket connection, and tried swapping the tubes to see if it got better. It was always the same tube. I tried using pliers to maybe get better contact by bending the pins out, but that didn't do anything either. What they ended up doing was actually rotating a little bit so the pins were further bent in. The contact with the pins was still good though, but it looks like these things were loose internally.

It would work if I pressed the tube towards the ceiling or pulled it towards the floor to put pressure on the connector. I don't believe this was affecting the contact with with tombstone, but possibly improving contact internally to the power supply.

Well, toggled supposedly has a lifetime warranty for residential use, so I contacted customer support by email. Gave them all the information including the model number, what was going wrong, and even the serial number printed on the flickering tube. I attached a copy of the Amazon.com invoice, my address, and contact info. I just got a notice that I'm getting a new tube shipped, and there no request for a return. I'm kind of disappointed that this failed, but at least their customer service is really good.

 

[y_p_w]

Well, toggled supposedly has a lifetime warranty for residential use, so I contacted customer support by email. Gave them all the information including the model number, what was going wrong, and even the serial number printed on the flickering tube. I attached a copy of the Amazon.com invoice, my address, and contact info. I just got a notice that I'm getting a new tube shipped, and there no request for a return. I'm kind of disappointed that this failed, but at least their customer service is really good.

So it took over a week for the replacement to arrive. I kept on getting updates that included a Saturday delivery. Then Monday. Then Wednesday. Then Thursday. But they meant Thursday. It was a retail package just like the one that I bought from Amazon, complete with the sticker, two wire nuts, and two tombstones. Since everything was already properly wired, I just put it in and it's back to normal again.