ENEOS Import Model S CVT Fluid

[fdcg27]

Interestingly enough, from what I can find searching around, the OEM supplier appears to be Idemitsu rather than Eneos.
The Subaru branded fluid also does not appear to be a whole lot more costly given the amounts needed over the lifespan of the car.
The best no-brainer solution might be to spend a couple of additional dollars and buy the Subaru branded fluid if one is really concerned about the OEM specs for the fluid.

 

[Adkcedarman]

Interestingly enough, from what I can find searching around, the OEM supplier appears to be Idemitsu rather than Eneos.
The Subaru branded fluid also does not appear to be a whole lot more costly given the amounts needed over the lifespan of the car.
The best no-brainer solution might be to spend a couple of additional dollars and buy the Subaru branded fluid if one is really concerned about the OEM specs for the fluid.

I did note that idemitsu is the OEM supplier for Subaru CVTF and that Idemitsu SB2 is the CVTF-ii equivalent but they do not offer a CVTF-iii compatible alternative to OEM CVTF-iii which is about $20 per quart versus $9 per quart of the Eneos Import Model S which is CVTF-ii and iii compatible fluid. That is why I made this thread to inform others about…

 

[kschachn]

Interestingly enough, from what I can find searching around, the OEM supplier appears to be Idemitsu rather than Eneos.
The Subaru branded fluid also does not appear to be a whole lot more costly given the amounts needed over the lifespan of the car.
The best no-brainer solution might be to spend a couple of additional dollars and buy the Subaru branded fluid if one is really concerned about the OEM specs for the fluid.

Or really concerned about warranty violation, which is one of the items brought up in this thread.

If that is true then it doesn't matter which aftermarket fluid is being used since there is only one OEM.

 

[Adkcedarman]

Or really concerned about warranty violation, which is one of the items brought up in this thread.

If that is true then it doesn't matter which aftermarket fluid is being used since there is only one OEM.

It does matter - using a non OEM compatible fluid is more problematic than one that is.

If it didn’t matter, Amsoil wouldnt stand behind their product with a warranty for vehicles they claim their fluid is compatible with.

 

[fdcg27]

I did note that idemitsu is the OEM supplier for Subaru CVTF and that Idemitsu SB2 is the CVTF-ii equivalent but they do not offer a CVTF-iii compatible alternative to OEM CVTF-iii which is about $20 per quart versus $9 per quart of the Eneos Import Model S which is CVTF-ii and iii compatible fluid. That is why I made this thread to inform others about…

So an aftermarket fluid is okay after all?

 

[kschachn]

It does matter - using a non OEM compatible fluid is more problematic than one that is.

If it didn’t matter, Amsoil wouldnt stand behind their product with a warranty for vehicles they claim their fluid is compatible with.

That makes zero sense. Valvoline CVT is compatible with CVT-III. It says so right in the tech sheet. So is any other fluid that says it is compatible.

And the thing about Amsoil - you're saying that if you use Eneos fluid the Subaru warranty automatically applies, not the one from Eneos?

Really.

 

[martinq]

So an aftermarket fluid is okay after all?

They're always okay but some people get really nervous about not spending the extra markup that the mfg brand provides.

The same goes for any parts or consumables like windshield wipers, oil / air filters, etc. None of the aftermarket fluid providers that I'm aware of have damaged a Subaru (or other) CVT (or transmission) that I'm aware of.

 

[hjp]

Was looking for a CVTF II fluid, went with Idemitsu SB2 but the ENEOS ECO CVT was tempting. In the end I went looking for something formulated specifically for my application, for peace of mind its hard to argue with (actually looking back, seems rather easy to argue insufferably unfortunately..) choosing a specific Japanese formulation for a Japanese vehicle.

 

[4wd]

They're always okay but some people get really nervous about not spending the extra markup that the mfg brand provides.

The same goes for any parts or consumables like windshield wipers, oil / air filters, etc. None of the aftermarket fluid providers that I'm aware of have damaged a Subaru (or other) CVT (or transmission) that I'm aware of.

The cost spread has become huge … what I find interesting is that some of the most expensive ATF choices are just a semi - something you won’t see in motor oil …

 

[fdcg27]

There are several threads on various Subaru boards about the performance of various CVT fluids in service.
Some report everything is great with Valvoline CVT fluid, others report problems.
At the end of that day, I don't think we can recommend the use of anything lacking OEM certification in these CVTs.
As a Subaru owner I'm a little conflicted. I really don't feel like paying the $13.00/qt from the cheapest dealer I've found, but I'm willing to do that to avoid any problems.

 

[Pablo]

Let’s get to the nitty gritty

What actual documented problems have we seen AM CVT fluid?

 

[Adkcedarman]

So an aftermarket fluid is okay after all?

Sure! I never said it wasn’t. I personally prefer to use specialized aftermarket options however. Universal isn’t precisely tailored enough for me. I maintain my vehicles to make them last - I’m not up for gambling with a maybe.

 

[GW.]

Let’s get to the nitty gritty

What actual documented problems have we seen AM CVT fluid?

There isn’t any. In fact this generation of Subaru cvt’s have been excellent on any appropriate fluid. The early failures were valve body related, or people attempting lifetime fluid intervals.

 

[Adkcedarman]

That makes zero sense. Valvoline CVT is compatible with CVT-III. It says so right in the tech sheet. So is any other fluid that says it is compatible.

And the thing about Amsoil - you're saying that if you use Eneos fluid the Subaru warranty automatically applies, not the one from Eneos?

Really.

My Subaru warranty remains and is much harder for the dealer or Subaru to fight provided I used a quality aftermarket fluid such as Eneos or Amsoil that clearly states compatibility. I’m not an expert on what warranty applies in which situation for every nuance but it is my understanding that if Subaru refused to cover transmission work because Amsoil was used, apparently Amsoil offers a warranty (honestly uncertain what the details and fine print is!) because they are so certain their fluid is fully compatible and would not be the cause of a failure.

 

[martinq]

By definition most the aftermarket CVT fluids are superior to the majority of OEM fluids. Valvoline, Mobil, Castrol, Amsoil... they all stand behind their products and their recommendations and have done so consistently for decades. This isn't anything new, this is another day talking about quality lubrication products and applications.

I'm feeling the itch to put another spreadsheet together...

 

[Adkcedarman]

By definition most the aftermarket CVT fluids are superior to the majority of OEM fluids. Valvoline, Mobil, Castrol, Amsoil... they all stand behind their products and their recommendations and have done so consistently for decades. This isn't anything new, this is another day talking about quality lubrication products and applications.

I'm feeling the itch to put another spreadsheet together...

Not to sound like @kschachn but how do we quantify the claim that most aftermarket CVT fluids are superior to the majority of OEM fluids? In the case of Nissan some years ago I would agree, lol.

 

[kschachn]

Not to sound like @kschachn but how do we quantify the claim that most aftermarket CVT fluids are superior to the majority of OEM fluids? In the case of Nissan some years ago I would agree, lol.

Same way you’d quantify that Eneos is somehow most appropriate or superior.

 

[fdcg27]

By definition most the aftermarket CVT fluids are superior to the majority of OEM fluids. Valvoline, Mobil, Castrol, Amsoil... they all stand behind their products and their recommendations and have done so consistently for decades. This isn't anything new, this is another day talking about quality lubrication products and applications.

I'm feeling the itch to put another spreadsheet together...

This seems a bold statement.
Have any data to back it up?

 

[kschachn]

My Subaru warranty remains and is much harder for the dealer or Subaru to fight provided I used a quality aftermarket fluid such as Eneos or Amsoil that clearly states compatibility. I’m not an expert on what warranty applies in which situation for every nuance but it is my understanding that if Subaru refused to cover transmission work because Amsoil was used, apparently Amsoil offers a warranty (honestly uncertain what the details and fine print is!) because they are so certain their fluid is fully compatible and would not be the cause of a failure.

Just know that Asian manufacturers do not license their fluid.

 

[GW.]

This seems a bold statement.
Have any data to back it up?

Hard data is hard to come by either way. Historically OEM fluids provide adequate performance while balancing price, fuel economy, cost of ownership etc. For some companies it’s all about performance with no restraints.(Amsoil HPL come to mind)

My Jeep is a good example, gear oil recommendation is 75W-85 while Dana recommends 75W-90. Jeep says the transmission has lifetime fluid. ZF recommends 60k intervals.