Ecore has the best bypass design?

[Big O Dave]

Often times I have read in TallPaul's posts (in particular) of the advantages of a threaded-end bypass, chief of which is that oil wouldn't flow across the dirty side of the filter element. His argument came to mind as I was looking at a cutaway drawing of the Ecore filter.

Here's my shot at describing the action of the various bypass types I've seen. If I'm wrong, please correct me!

Closed or "domed" end bypass: oil flows across the dirty side of the filter element and then (carrying debris picked up from the outside of the element) enters the bypass and goes directly into the engine.

Conventional Threaded-end bypass: the oil generally avoids flowing over the dirty side of the element and instead, flows from the filter intake into an adjacent bypass valve and is then directed into the engine, without the most of the extra debris from the dirty side of the element. This oil is still exposed to the outside of the element (the dirty zone), but flow over the element is minimized.

Ecore threaded-end bypass: this design appears to entirely avoid sending any oil at all outside of the element (into the dirty zone), and instead, directs all bypassed oil through separate bypass ports in the filter's baseplate and then into the engine.

Check out the cutaway drawing on page two of the Ecore brochure.

It seems to me that the Ecore has the best bypass design, eliminating any exposure to the dirty side of the filter.

What are your thoughts on this?

 

[Ugly3]

I sincerly doubt that oil coming into the filter at the thread end does an immediate 90 degree turn and goes out the bypass. Seems to me the oil would keep going straight until it reaches the dome end them come back to the top and exit.

I see little, if any, benefit to the thread end bypass set up.

 

[labman]

I have to go with the conventional threaded end bypass. I don't like the dome end where the oil flows over the media to get to the engine. Even with the insane design where the threaded end is down, the oil still has to flow past anything that settled out, and will be thick enough to carry it up to the dome.
Of course, most of the filtered out stuff is trapped in the pores of the media, or at least the bottom of the pleats, and isn't going into the engine.

The one flaw I see with the Ecore is that the colder it is, the stiffer even the most carefully formulated rubber is. Less bypass when you need it, and opening quicker once the oil is hot.

The oil will always flow from the inlet by the most direct route to where it can pass into the engine if the ABDV is working and the filter starts full of oil. If you are getting start up rattle, forget the bypass and find a good ADVB.

 

[kanling]

I have to agree with Big O Dave on this. I like the bypass design from the picture in the E-core brouchure. But, I really want to get a closer look since its hard to tell by that picture. If I don't see one cut open and described on BITOG I will do it myself.

By the way, I don't worry about bypass valves during the summer because I don't believe they ever operate then. That's just a guess, though.

 

[Filter guy]

Big O Dave..

You've figured out how the by-pass works on the various styles.

Oil entering the filter in an E-core, when it by-passes does allow flow out before the oil gets to the element.

We all know some oil is still filtered in by-pass mode unless the element is plugged. The diversionary flow of oil in the E-core design keeps incoming oil that bypasses from getting to the element.


Ugly3..you've got it wrong. The oil can not go into the can first and then back out through the by-pass in the E-core design..imo.

Why? Because the by-pass is also the anti-drain. So any oil coming "back" after entering the filter would push the antidrain against the inlet holes. With your line of thinking the oil might as well go back to the pan if it can reverse flow enough to get to the inlet holes where the by-pass is.


The oil takes the least resistance to flow..either through the by-pass or through the element.

There is no reverse flow happening with oil entering the filter to get out of the by-pass in the E-core design.

Just my take..

 

[T-Keith]

Actually the best bypass is in the block. This way it can be held to better tolerances and made of better materials(read: more expensive)

While the location is a good one, I have my problems with a rubber bypass. I've seen nitrile harden, this is a possibily on extended drains.

-T

 

[Ray H]

Theory, schmeory. I doubt the type or location of the bypass valve makes 10,000 butterfly sneezes' practical difference in the long run. (I know - some "expert" will post that salvage yards are full of cars whose engines died because of domed-end bypass valves . . .)

 

[Filter guy]

Tall Paul:
It is a misconception that the E-core endcaps are paper.

If they were, they couldn't seal the way the endcaps are sealed to the element with no glue.. It is the endcap media which plays an important roll in the sealing process to the element.

 

[Winston]

quote:

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Tall Paul:
It is a misconception that the E-core endcaps are paper.

---

FG, yes and the Fram's endcaps are not cardboard. Oh, and cardboard is not "Card" or "Board" it is made from wood pulp, oh, but that is not the correct term either, it is "cellulose", oh yea thats right, most filter media is cellulose, so they are paper, ie wood, with some synthetic fibers thrown in for good measure, oh yea, sythetic fibers dont mean that the filter media works any better than just plain old cellulose, ie paper. Oh, I forgot my point....

Oh yea, I do not think much debris gets washed off the filter media when the filter is in bypass, even with an end cap bypass valve.

 

[Big O Dave]

quote:

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Originally posted by kanling:
...I really want to get a closer look since its hard to tell by that picture.

---

You will, kanling, you will. I'll eventually post photos.

 

[TallPaul]

When doing my AutoRx rinse cycle the filter had the globs of sludge in the creases. When I saw the globs also sitting in the dome end, I decided to avoid the dome end bypass.

It probably is a non-issue under normal operation on a relatively clean engine. But most threaded end bypass valves look a lot sturdier than the dome end bypass clickers and/or coil spring valves.

Also, someone tried to measure the openings and it seems they found a larger flow opening on the threaded end bypass.

The e-core bypass/anti-drainback is an elegant design and if it proves itself over time, I will consider it, but not with the paper endcaps that so easily peeled from a brand new e-core I bought and cut open.

 

[Ugly3]

quote:

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Originally posted by Filter guy:
Big O Dave..

You've figured out how the by-pass works on the various styles.

Oil entering the filter in an E-core, when it by-passes does allow flow out before the oil gets to the element.

We all know some oil is still filtered in by-pass mode unless the element is plugged. The diversionary flow of oil in the E-core design keeps incoming oil that bypasses from getting to the element.


Ugly3..you've got it wrong. The oil can not go into the can first and then back out through the by-pass in the E-core design..imo.

Why? Because the by-pass is also the anti-drain. So any oil coming "back" after entering the filter would push the antidrain against the inlet holes. With your line of thinking the oil might as well go back to the pan if it can reverse flow enough to get to the inlet holes where the by-pass is.


The oil takes the least resistance to flow..either through the by-pass or through the element.

There is no reverse flow happening with oil entering the filter to get out of the by-pass in the E-core design.

Just my take..

---

We need a Hydrolic Engineer to lend an informed opinion.

 

[Jim Allen]

I'd like to say this just once. I sure have learned a lot from this BB, but I'm getting fairly tired of having to wade through all the childish comments and bovine scatology. Sometimes gleaning knowledge from this board is like digging for coins in a manure pile. They are gold doubloons, to be sure, but that fact only makes the digging bearable, not fun. One of the downsides of this form of communication is that people have a tendency to say things in a rude manner they wouldn't have the poor taste or testicular fortitude to do face to face with another person. For that reason, boarders should make an extra effort at civility. Disagreements... fine! Make your arguments on the best facts you can present and do so in civil manner. If you think someone is getting a little pompous, exercise some grace and self control, let it pass and likely the others will do the same for you someday when you have a bad day. We all share a common interest here and that should make us polite aquaintences at least, if not friends.

 

[ZR2RANDO]

Nothing wrong with talking about it here..

1- If the bypass must be in the filter cartridge itself, at least the threaded/inlet end is the better location....the filter mount itself is best.
2- I agree with Labman as far as the bypass being made of rubber aspect...it will behave different in cold oil than it will in hot oil, (not in the best way with respect to when it is needed most, far as I’m concerned)
It is a cost cutter design, a spring loaded valve would be more dependable , especially after it’s been in use for awhile.

 

[brianl703]

Could someone apply a soldering iron to the material used on Champ's end caps and let us know what happens?

 

[Bio-T]

I think this thread is now on track and Thanks for keeping it on track in the future.

 

[Big O Dave]

Holy Crap!

All I wanted to do was talk about the Ecore bypass design, compared with the others... should I start a new thread?

 

[Big O Dave]

quote:

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Originally posted by brianl703:
Could someone apply a soldering iron to the material used on Champ's end caps and let us know what happens?

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Would that show if the end caps could be attached to the media with heat?

 

[Filter guy]

For metal end cap filters, the element is put through an oven and the glue ( plastisol ) in the end caps is cured with heat that way.

That is not how E-core end caps are cured.

Nor is a direct heating plate put on the endcaps to cure them.

There is no direct "heat" source at all used..

I'll let you ponder that..

 

[labman]

Heat paper enough and it will char without ever melting. Overheating a thermoplastic material will char it too, but it should pass through a point where it is softened. If Champion is advertising thermal bonded end caps, they had better have them, or they will have problems with the FTC.