Dodge TSB...Don't Mix Oils. Don't Use Additives.

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Darren270

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This is a copy and paste of a Dodge Technical Service Bulletin that I found while looking up service bulletins for my 97 Dodge Ram.

I know most, if not all, car manufacturers warn against using oil and fuel additives. But I thought it was interesting that they specifically mentioned not mixing oils due to "low temperature engine failure."

Obviously, I don't agree with this. What about the guy who needs to top off his truck and happens to buy a quart of Pennzoil even though his truck is filled with Valvoline? Not to mention those that purposely mix oils.

Anyway, I thought it was interesting. Thoughts? Opinions?


The Service Bulletin:

Date: May 4, 2001

Models: All (BR/BE) Ram Truck

2001 (AB) Ram Van/Wagon
2001 (AN) Dakota
2001 (BR/BE) Ram Pickup
2001 (DN) Durango
2001 (JR) Sebring Sedan/Stratus Sedan/Sebring Convertible
2002 (KJ) Liberty
2001 (LH) Concorde/Intrepid/LHS/300M
2001 (PL) Neon
2001 (PR) Prowler
2001 (PT) PT Cruiser
2001 (RG) Chrysler Voyager (International Markets)
2001 (RS) Town & Country/Caravan/ Voyager
2001 (SR) Viper
2001 (ST) Seebring Coupe
2001 (TJ) Wrangler
2001 (WG) Grand Cherokee (International Markets)
2001 (WJ) Grand Cherokee
2001 (XJ) Cherokee

NOTE: This bulletin applies to all DaimleChrysler models / engines built before and after the 2001 model year.

Discussion:

Engine oil additives/supplements (EOS) should not be used to enhance engine oil performance.

Engine oil additives/supplements should not be used to extend engine oil change intervals.

No additive is known to be safe for engine durability and can degrade emission components.

Additives can contain undesirable materials that harm the long term durability of engines by:Doubling the level of Phosphorus in engine oil. The ILSAC (International Lubricant Standard Approval Committee) GF2 and GF3 standards require that engine oil contain no more than 0.01% Phosphorus to protect the vehicles emissions performance. Addition of engine oil additives/supplements can poison, from added sulfur and phosphorus, catalysts and hinder efforts to guarantee our emissions performance to 80,000 miles and new requirements of 150,000 miles.

Altering the viscosity characteristics of the engine oil so that it no longer meets the requirements of the specified viscosity grade.

Creating potential for an undesirable additive compatibility interaction in the engine crankcase.

Generally it is not desirable to mix additive packages from different suppliers in the crankcase; there have been reports of low temperature engine failures caused by additive package incompatibility with such mixtures. Do not mix different brands of oil in the crankcase.



Policy: Information Only
 
im sure this was another gimmick to scare people into having their dealer service the vehicle and help them make sure they use dealers oil, bought at a high price per qt to top off with, that's my guess.
 
99% of people wont top up with the same oil and what makes those engines special? I try not to mix oils and i do think they work better not mixed but the harm it does is most likely very small and un measurable.

I didnt see donnys post. Thats what i was thinking as well.
 
Last edited:
They can't SAY only service it at the dealer, using our oil, or they have to provide it for nothing.

But they can use a scary fluff piece as evidence that you should.

Note no mention of warranty implications should they be mixed, or mention that API requires oils to be compatible.
 
Originally Posted By: Darren270
But I thought it was interesting that they specifically mentioned not mixing oils due to "low temperature engine failure.".


Originally Posted By: Dodge TSB
Generally it is not desirable to mix additive packages from different suppliers in the crankcase; there have been reports of low temperature engine failures caused by additive package incompatibility with such mixtures. Do not mix different brands of oil in the crankcase.


A little bit of more careful reading can help prevent you from making mis-statements that others read and then repeat incorrectly elsewhere.
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Note no mention of warranty implications should they be mixed, or mention that API requires oils to be compatible.


Nor any mention that it might be prudent to mix oils that are the same grade, specifically the specified grade. Sure, one shouldn't top up a Dodge in the north in the winter with three quarts of 20w-50, but if it's the appropriate grade, it's hardly a big deal.
 
Sounds more like the successful campaign that Korea used many years ago when electricity was scarce. They convinced people that fans and air conditioning consumed the oxygen in the air and could cause death if used all night.

Anyway, even within a brand, there are changes in formulations. For the API license, all it takes is some paperwork. No identification of the labels or batches.

And as Garak says, obviously 20W-50 where 5w30 is recommended will cause cold start problems. People rarely mention brand, spec and visc in the same sentence (except nuts like us)
 
Originally Posted By: Darren270
Do not mix different brands of oil in the crankcase. [/b]



I know they mean well and are just trying to cover their rear ends, but this TSB is somewhat humorous. Several years ago before the Chrysler bankrupcy, Johnny, a retired Pennzoil salesman, posted on here that Chrysler was using two different suppliers for their oil. If you had your car serviced at the dealer and used their Mopar oil, it was from one supplier. If you bought a quart of Mopar oil in a bottle, of the same weight, it was from another supplier. I don't know if they still two suppliers or not, as Johnny hasn't been a poster lately.
 
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
im sure this was another gimmick to scare people into having their dealer service the vehicle and help them make sure they use dealers oil, bought at a high price per qt to top off with, that's my guess.


I'm not seeing that. It looks like Dodge is telling us what we have been accepting for years.

Mobil 1 does not recommend the use of additives; is that a scare tactic as well? Valvoline doesn't recommend the use of their high ZDDP race oils for a daily commute; is that another scare tactic? As for the compatibility of oils, we all know that poor blending can lead to some undesirable characteristics.
 
I think there words are wise to follow. There are additives from STP (Studebaker Testing Products) to MMO to PFTE (Slick 50) and hundreds in between. Some are worse than others. IMHO better lubrication comes from better oil, not additives.

As for mixing oils, most people don't change their own oil and thus don't have a QT of bulk oil to add.

I carry a QT of PP in my Jeep which is close enough for PP or PU which is what I run, and for my Dodge w/Cummins, it takes 12 QTs so I check it but I doubt if being down a QT would be a problem.
 
Originally Posted By: Darren270
This is a copy and paste of a Dodge Technical Service Bulletin that I found while looking up service bulletins for my 97 Dodge Ram.

I know most, if not all, car manufacturers warn against using oil and fuel additives. But I thought it was interesting that they specifically mentioned not mixing oils due to "low temperature engine failure."

Obviously, I don't agree with this. What about the guy who needs to top off his truck and happens to buy a quart of Pennzoil even though his truck is filled with Valvoline? Not to mention those that purposely mix oils.

Anyway, I thought it was interesting. Thoughts? Opinions?


The Service Bulletin:

Date: May 4, 2001

Models: All (BR/BE) Ram Truck

2001 (AB) Ram Van/Wagon
2001 (AN) Dakota
2001 (BR/BE) Ram Pickup
2001 (DN) Durango
2001 (JR) Sebring Sedan/Stratus Sedan/Sebring Convertible
2002 (KJ) Liberty
2001 (LH) Concorde/Intrepid/LHS/300M
2001 (PL) Neon
2001 (PR) Prowler
2001 (PT) PT Cruiser
2001 (RG) Chrysler Voyager (International Markets)
2001 (RS) Town & Country/Caravan/ Voyager
2001 (SR) Viper
2001 (ST) Seebring Coupe
2001 (TJ) Wrangler
2001 (WG) Grand Cherokee (International Markets)
2001 (WJ) Grand Cherokee
2001 (XJ) Cherokee

NOTE: This bulletin applies to all DaimleChrysler models / engines built before and after the 2001 model year.

Discussion:

Engine oil additives/supplements (EOS) should not be used to enhance engine oil performance.

Engine oil additives/supplements should not be used to extend engine oil change intervals.

No additive is known to be safe for engine durability and can degrade emission components.

Additives can contain undesirable materials that harm the long term durability of engines by:Doubling the level of Phosphorus in engine oil. The ILSAC (International Lubricant Standard Approval Committee) GF2 and GF3 standards require that engine oil contain no more than 0.01% Phosphorus to protect the vehicles emissions performance. Addition of engine oil additives/supplements can poison, from added sulfur and phosphorus, catalysts and hinder efforts to guarantee our emissions performance to 80,000 miles and new requirements of 150,000 miles.

Altering the viscosity characteristics of the engine oil so that it no longer meets the requirements of the specified viscosity grade.

Creating potential for an undesirable additive compatibility interaction in the engine crankcase.

Generally it is not desirable to mix additive packages from different suppliers in the crankcase; there have been reports of low temperature engine failures caused by additive package incompatibility with such mixtures. Do not mix different brands of oil in the crankcase.



Policy: Information Only



BOW down and worship the GOD of emissions.
 
Sounds like Daimler was cheaping out,afraid that a mismatch of products would ruin emissions parts and cost them warranty money.The funny part is Chrysler/Mopar sells a product called "Engine oil supplement"!!
 
this is 1997 we're talking about. The 90s in general. I remember people being scared to mix oils, so this TSB supports that.

That same logic doesn't apply today.
 
I'd bet this is because people put Lucas and motor honey and whatever else in there and then the oil looks like a 20wt in the winter. Then they slam the go pedal and wonder why their car doesn't last.
 
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
I'd bet this is because people put Lucas and motor honey and whatever else in there and then the oil looks like a 20wt in the winter. Then they slam the go pedal and wonder why their car doesn't last.


Bingo!
 
Originally Posted By: Darren270
.............. But I thought it was interesting that they specifically mentioned not mixing oils due to "low temperature engine failure." ..........


They didn't say that. You've misread.
 
Quote:
They didn't say that. You've misread.


They did say that. Read it again (or in its entirety this time).
 
Old, worn-out diesel oil in european severe use at VERY cold temps (-20 to -29 C!). NO indication of sample size. So just change your oil. I'm mixin', mixin' and mixin' some more!




Originally Posted By: SubLGT
Originally Posted By: Darren270
.............. But I thought it was interesting that they specifically mentioned not mixing oils due to "low temperature engine failure." ..........


There is some truth to that statement. See:

http://www.infineum.com/Documents/Crankc...icants-2010.pdf

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2388540&page=1
 
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