There is nothing to argue about bud. The proof is all online. All people have to do is read and make a few phone calls to Amsoil, Shell or Mobil.I seriously don't understand why anyone here would ever argue about motor oil.
View attachment 99534
Do I Need API SP?
- Thread starter Shel_B
- Start date
I put one link in here bud! There are many.
D
Deleted member 89374
AMSOIL is most likely the only one who will offer a somewhat meaningful conversation. They are charming people. I talked to them more than once.
I have talked to all of them.
Why your car only calls for SM and thing including that or oil made later will work.
If an old OM calls out SM, then it was most likely sent to print befofe SN was officially on the streets. And yes as all say, SP can be used in anything specifying anything before SP because new oils are always backwards compatible.
Don’t be a smart as*, you said I doubt DI engines make more soot than a diesel when I posted about TURBO DI making more soot if not more than a diesel and that’s why we have SP oil for the chains. Now your changing your tone bc you learned something new today!
Nothing in the marketing material you posted said anything about GDI engines making as much or more soot as a diesel beyond an unsubstantiated blurb. The "article" you shared amounts to "DI engines make soot and it is bad for chains - buy Amsoil." What you reference as gospel is this:
"Although most people associate soot with old-fashioned diesel engines, a modern T-GDI engine can produce more soot than an older diesel not equipped with a particulate filter."
This is clearly in reference to tailpipe soot. Yes, GDI engines may produce more tailpipe soot than a DPF-equipped diesel. What this has to do with actual soot levels in the oil, neither you or Amsoil will say. Soot level in the oil is what matters and is what is being discussed in reference to API SP, etc.
My vote is to definitely use SP, and in the appropriate viscosity.
A lot of this is click bait type of information. Millions and millions of vehicles with GDI are running all around the world accumulating millions of miles and we don’t see or hear of the piles of failed engines everywhere.
That’s bc the Europeans have been using these engines far longer and ACEA oil already addressed those issues. This is a newer issue for modern Newer engines that’s not European. API is always changing formulations. There are several engines that had to be replaced due to fuel dilution.
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The API does not change formulations, it performs tests and sets limits, formulations are handled by individual blenders.
Also, Toyota has been using DI for quite some time, but their D4S system (introduced in 2007), which includes Port Injection, has been reasonably effective at reducing the level of fuel dilution.
You still miss to provide proof. I doubt there's even any 'proof' existing
for your preposterous claim. Yes, (early) DI gas engines produce more
soot compared to most (not all!) port-injected gas engines. Yes, many
(early) DI gas engines emit higher levels soot at the exhaust tip (!) than
Diesel engines equipped with a particulate filter. However these facts
do NOT support your claim. I'm under the impression you confused the
above mentioned commonly known facts. Again, provide proof please.
As a hint, Diesel engine oil turns commonly black within 1000 mls. I've
NEVER seen that happen on a DI gas engine, even not after 10.000 mls.
.
Gas turboed DI engines seem to blow a lot of soot out the tailpipes (even though you can't really see it happening) and might be worse than a diesel in some situations ... 'net searches seem to validate that. But diesel engines have way more cylinder compression - typically between 15:1 and 22:1, resulting in compression pressures typically from 300-500 psi compared to 120-200 psi in a gasoline engine., and a much higher combustion pressure in a diesel I would think causes more ring blow-by of soot into the crankcase. I would venture to say that the incomplete combustion of diesel fuel would cause more soot than incomplete combustion of gasoline. Ever see "rolling coal" on a gasoline powered engine?
Most gas DI cars have lots of soot build up collected inside the tips of the tail pipes if they are never cleaned up. I've see it built up pretty bad on a Ford Escape with the tubo 4-cly ecoboot. My non DI gas vehicles barely have any soot built up in the tail pipe tips.
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This SAE article is downloadable in PDF too for free. In this paper, they conclude that "soot-in-oil levels" can be about the same between a DI gas and diesel engine. At least on the engines they used for the testing.
Conclusions
Three soot-in-oil samples were taken from a GDI engine after
different oil mileages, and comprehensively analysed. The
findings from this work suggest that soot-in-oil levels
measured in GDI engines can be comparable to those of diesel
engines; likewise agglomerate and primary size distributions.
However, the particle nanostructure can differ significantly
with some entirely amorphous particles observed. This could
imply a different interaction with the lubricating oil and subse-
quently altered wear behaviour of GDI soot.
Conclusions
Three soot-in-oil samples were taken from a GDI engine after
different oil mileages, and comprehensively analysed. The
findings from this work suggest that soot-in-oil levels
measured in GDI engines can be comparable to those of diesel
engines; likewise agglomerate and primary size distributions.
However, the particle nanostructure can differ significantly
with some entirely amorphous particles observed. This could
imply a different interaction with the lubricating oil and subse-
quently altered wear behaviour of GDI soot.
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There was supposed to be oil after API. API oil and formulations
Comparing GDI tailpipe soot to a DPF equipped diesel is rather silly though. If I deleted the DPF I'd have soot all up the back window. I'd the GDI car had a GPF or wild be squeaky clean.
The whole thing is silly. GDI cars make soot where their predecessors did not. But that doesn't mean you can compare them to diesel. I'd have to change my oil 5 times for it to look new and it would still turn black in 50 miles... from soot.