Direct Injection specific oils

Pennzoil motor oil
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Interesting! Never heard of it. I thought SN + is addressing the crisis? Third topic I've learned about today.
 
Use a dexos 1 Gen 2 oil and run a used oil analysis with actual fuel dilution numbers not interpreted and then set a safe OCI from there or take it one step further and send the used oil analysis to a lab that will report on the soot levels.
 
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Sorry. I don't buy into this with only 250 PPM of calcium for detergent with nothing else. It would make a decent racing oil because it's changed after each race and the majority of engines are torn down.
 
I speak with Lake Speed Jr somewhat regularly. Driven's oils are carefully thought out, and I wouldn't hesitate to use them. I'm most likely going to give their LS30 oil a try in my Tahoe next OCI.

Their XP series of oils are strictly racing oils. They use only short chained, secondary type ZDDP, just 200-250 ppm of Ca, a TBN of 1.3-1.5, and 1500+ ppm blend of tri-nuclear / organomolybdenum. Their XP3 10w30 oil has a NOACK of just 4.5% and HTHS of 3.6 cP. Their XP2 (closest to a 0w-12) is what the racers of Joe Gibbs racing use in their cars.

The HR and DT series are a more typical formula with 2700-2900 ppm Ca, 9.5-10.0 TBN, and 1100-1300 ppm ZDDP.
 
Originally Posted by dave1251
Sorry. I don't buy into this with only 250 PPM of calcium for detergent with nothing else. It would make a decent racing oil because it's changed after each race and the majority of engines are torn down.


Mobil knew about this 8 years and everyone was wondering why their oil had 1,100 ppm of calcium. Most oils have 700 to 1,350 ppm of Ca. and minus Sodium too remember. That are LSPI speced. AMSOIL Signature Series has 1,300 an is 100% LSPI certified. Boron and Magnesium in it's place and who knows behind the VOA scene we can't see.

Plus SN+ oil is no grand spec, compared to Mercedes Benz and VW specs it is SO meagerly.
 
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"Plus SN+ oil is no grand spec, compared to Mercedes Benz and VW specs it is SO meagerly."




This makes no sense whatsoever.
 
Originally Posted by cdlamb
Driven Racing Oil. Has anyone heard of it?

Yes. While I'm not saying they make junk oils, they seem to pop out of the woodwork with every real or imagined problem, particularly those that get a lot of overblowing on the net, and the promised ability to solve it at $20 per litre. They next need to coattail onto an article about the Hemi tick and Ford's concern over CK-4 oils.

With the used oil analysis listed in the article, I'm not exactly what they're trying to accomplish by doing used oil analysis on ultrashort OCIs on a new vehicle with less than 5,000 miles, much less trying to compare wear from brand to brand and viscosity to viscosity. That is the type of thing Joe Gibbs likes to do, though. I also share some of dave1251's concern here. Why didn't they get TBN checked on these used oil analysis? Were they being cheap or was it something that might not have reflected well on them, even over a short OCI?

I particularly like their genuine concern for people that have older, flat tappet engines that really aren't even high performers with high valve spring pressures. They're so concerned they provide a product that costs more over two oil changes than actually replacing the cam and lifters. Basically, if there's anything about lubrication that concerns someone, Joe Gibbs will have a pricey "solution" at the ready.
 
Originally Posted by Mainia
Originally Posted by dave1251
Sorry. I don't buy into this with only 250 PPM of calcium for detergent with nothing else. It would make a decent racing oil because it's changed after each race and the majority of engines are torn down.


Mobil knew about this 8 years and everyone was wondering why their oil had 1,100 ppm of calcium. Most oils have 700 to 1,350 ppm of Ca. and minus Sodium too remember. That are LSPI speced. AMSOIL Signature Series has 1,300 an is 100% LSPI certified. Boron and Magnesium in it's place and who knows behind the VOA scene we can't see.

Plus SN+ oil is no grand spec, compared to Mercedes Benz and VW specs it is SO meagerly.



You missed it. A street driven oil needs more detergent then 250PPM with a TBN of 2.
 
Originally Posted by dave1251
Originally Posted by Mainia
Originally Posted by dave1251
Sorry. I don't buy into this with only 250 PPM of calcium for detergent with nothing else. It would make a decent racing oil because it's changed after each race and the majority of engines are torn down.


Mobil knew about this 8 years and everyone was wondering why their oil had 1,100 ppm of calcium. Most oils have 700 to 1,350 ppm of Ca. and minus Sodium too remember. That are LSPI speced. AMSOIL Signature Series has 1,300 an is 100% LSPI certified. Boron and Magnesium in it's place and who knows behind the VOA scene we can't see.

Plus SN+ oil is no grand spec, compared to Mercedes Benz and VW specs it is SO meagerly.



You missed it. A street driven oil needs more detergent then 250PPM with a TBN of 2.


The Driven XP oils with just 250 ppm Ca are not advertised for street use. They are strictly race oils. Short chained, secondary ZDDP. Loads of tri-nuclear / organomoly blend. No VIIs. A friend of mine runs this oil in his MASS Street Stock car. He only changes the oil once a year at the beginning of the season. After each race weekend, he changes the cheap Fram filter and tops off 0.5 quart to refresh the oil.

http://www.drivenracingoil.com/dro/products/competition-race-engine-oilshtml

Driven XP3 10w30

KV100..............11.7
KV40................67.87
VI.....................169
TBN.................1.3
HTHS...............3.64

Ca....................256
P.......................963
Zn.....................809
Mo....................1755

They are formulated very differently from their street oils.

http://www.drivenracingoil.com/dro/products/street-performance-engine-oilshtml

http://www.drivenracingoil.com/dro/products/hot-rod-engine-oilshtml

Driven LS30 5w30

KV100..............11.04
KV40................64.1
VI.....................166
TBN.................10.1
HTHS...............3.48

Ca....................2850
Mg....................160
P.......................1190
Zn.....................1300

I don't have specifics on the DI20, DI30, DI40, and DI60 oils but know they are formulated with a Ca/Mg blend like other dexos 1 Gen 2 and SN Plus oils.
 
It's probably fair to say that oil additives don't so much 'make oil better' as 'make it last longer'.

If all you want is a oil that runs for say an hour & after that, you'll dump it, then most (not all) additives are a bit of a waste of space; just use straight base oil (preferably a thick one). Even simple Group I oils will be perfectly adequate for a short time before they start breaking down!

Of course, from that low base starting point you can always 'make things better'. Moving from Group I to PAO and adding some ZDDP makes sense from a wear point of view. Be aware though that both things will markedly extend the life of the oil as both push back the point at which the oil oxidises. This is precisely the game you play when you're formulating racing oils.

IMO, racing oils are not an appropriate answer to the problems you see with TGDI engines (not unless you plan to change your oil every week!).
 
everyone is pretty moot about DI issues! manufacturers deny it and magazines and writers alike fear losing business $$$$ if said advertisers don't like what is said. it makes good discussions but theres a LOT of bull poop on it. seems some engines fare better than others but when going over 100 thou its VERY likely you will have issues $$$$. some manufacturers are started to use BOTH forms of injection because they KNOW its needed and prolly runs better with better mpg's, of course cost is ALWAYS an issue IMO. i will stick with my older port injected rides as being retired drive little and they will likely last as long as needed!!!
 
Driven is Joe Gibbs' company (former Washington Redskins Football Coach Joe Gibbs). He owns a NASCAR team and driven is his company as well. I've used Driven engine break-in oil and so far no issues.

As far as DI engines, I though SN Plus addressed this issue. If I had a car/truck with a GDI engine, I would use any SN Plus oil on the market.
 
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Some of the fears of GDI engines are way overblown coupled with capitalized words and plenty of exclamation points.


Use a SN+ dexos 1 Gen 2 oil from the brand of your choice. Run oci of 5 or 7.5 k miles and you will be fine.
 
Originally Posted by benjy
everyone is pretty moot about DI issues! manufacturers deny it and magazines and writers alike fear losing business $$$$ if said advertisers don't like what is said. it makes good discussions but theres a LOT of bull poop on it.

I think you might be on the right track but the wrong tangent. The biggest thing that magazine writers do when it comes to maintenance issues is complain about frequency and cost. C&D does it all the time. Oil change frequency and cost are numbers that they [think they] can compare directly and impartially. You give them a long term test vehicle that has an oil change over $100 or so (the magazines always seem to overpay anyhow; they have something with a 5 litre sump of conventional and a $3 filter, they still pay close to $100) and/or a higher frequency of oil changes, and they'll let you know in no uncertain terms in the article how annoyed they are.

Oil change is $300? Never mind that it's a 15 L sump of an E7, E9 5w-40. Oil change is sooner than 5000 miles? Doesn't matter to them that it's a small sump, DI, and they've driven the snot out of the thing.
 
Originally Posted by PimTac
Some of the fears of GDI engines are way overblown coupled with capitalized words and plenty of exclamation points.


Use a SN+ dexos 1 Gen 2 oil from the brand of your choice. Run oci of 5 or 7.5 k miles and you will be fine.



Agree.
 
Originally Posted by cdlamb
https://www.enginelabs.com/engine-t...fic-oil-could-save-your-ecoboost-engine/

http://www.drivenracingoil.com/

Driven Racing Oil. Has anyone heard of it?

*Low Calcium , Low NOACK oil which meets A1/A5 min. for fuel dilution (Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 D1/Gen2) , Fram Ultra oil filter , <5,000 mile max OCI's , use top tier gasoline and running a can of CRC Intake Valve Cleaner through the intake manifold every 15K miles is my personal recipe for dealing with the GDI issues ... Time will tell if I'm right .
 
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