Did the CRC Intake Valve Treatment.

[NitroM3]

The only way to clean the back of DI valves is to remove the intake and walnut blast them or literaly scrub the valves. The carbon build up isn't soft or gummy it is hard and baked on. Think of food and grease spills on the bottom of your oven, even with oven cleaner you have to scrub the baked on stuff. A lot of you will flame me for this but a quality dual port catch can will significantly reduce the deposits. Will it eliminate them 100%? No. Eventually the intake hs to come off and be mechanically removed. On some vehicles it is an easy proceedure, on others its very complex. Save your money on the CRC stuff and invest in a catch can, you'll be very suprised by the amount of junk it accumulates.

I want preface again that "we" perform in the shop this procedure on customers engines at least every other month? Generally speaking for the none car enthusiasts it works very well.



Catch cans:

Not all catch cans will work, work well or work at all on some DI engines. There are dozens of poorly design catch cans, universal catch cans and catch cans that are flow restrictive to the engineered designed flow rate of the PCV system on some engines, yet these catch cans sold are supported by a lot of HYP from end users. The other thing is that very few forget that on a crankcase ventilation PCV system there are two areas that you should be running catch cans. The PCV system carries an oil vapor that also travel in the breather or none positive side of the PCV system. How and why do you think that throttle bodies need servicing and cleaning on some engine that are DI? Many retailers or manufactures of catch cans don't mention the down side of catch cans and the need to have available all the specifications of catch cans offered. I really know of NONE that do that and if you call them I doubt any of them would have it either? Check it out. ha! Mainly because it is hard enough to sell something that will likely not perform as they would like consumers to think and to convince you that you need 2 catch when the world over the years has established a single catch can is really all you need. HA!
Anyone that can use a FLOW METER can do some rudimental testing to support much of my response. Also for the reports of catch cans working really well from some sources like "reviews" I noticed in most cases if you Q&A a person I often found are on high millage engine. So a properly performed compression test followed up by leak down test will often reveal that the oil contamination and the amount of vaporized oil caught in a catch can from the PCV system is mostly from an engine that is not in the best health to begin with.

 

[Silver]

I'd be mighty careful not to lean out the intake mixture, and I'd still worry about the short time it's washing cylinder walls clean of lubricant, or attacking valve seals. Last time I did a seafoam treatment I got a very pronounced knocking for a second while the engine obviously took too much in. It may have been user error, but it made me realize the risks just aren't worth the supposed, and unproven benefits.

That being said, I've seen gunk on intake valves that would wipe off with a rag. So I believe some of it can be easily cleaned, but I'd choose a gas treatment over shooting stuff into the intake.

 

[NitroM3]

I'd be mighty careful not to lean out the intake mixture, and I'd still worry about the short time it's washing cylinder walls clean of lubricant, or attacking valve seals. Last time I did a seafoam treatment I got a very pronounced knocking for a second while the engine obviously took too much in. It may have been user error, but it made me realize * the risks just aren't worth the supposed, and unproven benefits.

That being said, I've seen gunk on intake valves that would wipe off with a rag. So I believe some of it can be easily cleaned, but I'd choose a gas treatment over shooting stuff into the intake.

If your vehicle was a ECU/ECM EFI and OBDII from 2000 (1995 was actually the beginning of OBDII) and newer then more likely you simply went beyond the capacity of the sensor sending the information to the engines computer to adjust for "knock" the result the fueling and timing was changed and adjusted to its programed limits at the engine speed you were doing the service at. Next time you can monitor your knock senor accessing the diagnostic connector and watch this actually happen.

I personally * dont use the chemical can spray treatment into the intake system.

 

[Silver]

If your vehicle was a ECU/ECM EFI and OBDII from 2000 (1995 was actually the beginning of OBDII) and newer then more likely you simply went beyond the capacity of the sensor sending the information to the engines computer to adjust for "knock" the result the fueling and timing was changed and adjusted to its programed limits at the engine speed you were doing the service at. Next time you can monitor your knock senor accessing the diagnostic connector and watch this actually happen.

I personally * dont use the chemical can spray treatment into the intake system.

No it wasn't ping, it was knock. Metal parts clunking against each other. I think I borderline hydrolocked it.

 

[NitroM3]

No it wasn't ping, it was knock. Metal parts clunking against each other. I think I borderline hydrolocked it.

Auh ok but I said a knock, but I doubt you came anywhere close to Hydrolock with that small can of seafoam. Hydrolocking is hard to do on most engines manufactured from 1985 (new emission federal standards implemented) maybe an exception with some like Mazda's Skiactiv engine? I have not really looked in to that yet. Not sure why I would need that information anyway? HA! To hydro lock your engine you would have to have enough fluid to introduce into a running low RPM engine that would first fill the combustion chamber at it highest volume and then the engine would have had to be on the compression stroke . Believe it or not it is harder then most think to hydrolock a low compression engine. Now it you had Tunnel Rammed 396 RAT with 12.5:01 domed pistons then ya it pretty easy to hydrolock an engine if you dumped a bunch of liquid into the engine at idle speeds.. But then you would be called in my circle of friends that "wingnut" guy.. LOL!

 

[ad244]

Good information thanks for posting this up. I'd like to try the CRC before doing my next oil change

I usually use the seafoam

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...44-20&linkId=655657fb8c486d4fc7b04ca81b2b9155

 

[ad244]

Before I go and bash these products let me just say, I get it. I think everyone should do what they feel is best and if it makes you feel good, do it. Do it. Absolutely, because at least you’re showing pride in ownership and in the long run you’ll end up doing something that will help your vehicle over the course of its life. But this isn’t it.

I’ve done the same, it did basically nothing (Taking my manifold off expecting to see some form of sign that my treatments with CRC did something).

And when I discovered THAT, I did a little “test” of my own on CRC cleaner. I had a carbon coated valve laying around in the shop (nothing too bad) and sprayed an entire can DIRECTLY on the valve. Nothing. So then I let the valve soak directly in a solution of sea foam for two hours. Nothing. I then unloaded another half a can directly on to the valve AFTER heating the valve up to 200 plus degrees and next to nothing - as I continued to spray the remainder of the second can. Oh and I also agitated the valve back and forth in the solution while it was soaking for two hours.

And the before and after photos, videos, scopes, whatever with these products need to be compared to whatever would happen with untreated valve/combustion chambers. Because gasoline, heat, combustion take place and things will change. These YouTube videos generally show what it looks like after treatment (which usually is next to nothing). Show what happens while using nothing at all, I imagine it’ll look remarkably the same.

I think the only way these cleaners would “work” is if they were sprayed once a week, or more.

Well it needs the combustion pressure and heat to really make the cleaner effective especially with PEA based cleaners....

 

[Al]

Good information thanks for posting this up. I'd like to try the CRC before doing my next oil change

I usually use the seafoam

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...44-20&linkId=655657fb8c486d4fc7b04ca81b2b9155

I use a can of seafoam in each vehicle every few thousand miles. But don't use it in the intake manifold (I don't think)

 

[Propflux01]

Auh ok but I said a knock, but I doubt you came anywhere close to Hydrolock with that small can of seafoam. Hydrolocking is hard to do on most engines manufactured from 1985 (new emission federal standards implemented) maybe an exception with some like Mazda's Skiactiv engine? I have not really looked in to that yet. Not sure why I would need that information anyway? HA! To hydro lock your engine you would have to have enough fluid to introduce into a running low RPM engine that would first fill the combustion chamber at it highest volume and then the engine would have had to be on the compression stroke . Believe it or not it is harder then most think to hydrolock a low compression engine. Now it you had Tunnel Rammed 396 RAT with 12.5:01 domed pistons then ya it pretty easy to hydrolock an engine if you dumped a bunch of liquid into the engine at idle speeds.. But then you would be called in my circle of friends that "wingnut" guy.. LOL!

What do you consider “low compression”? Most newer engines nowadays often run upwards of 10/1.

 

[NitroM3]

What do you consider “low compression”? Most newer engines nowadays often run upwards of 10/1.

I think you know exactly what I was talking about. And if not , in my response I also gave some information about cylinder volume.

The comment about a RAT motor was to perhaps draw out Perfroamcne Engine builders on this forum.

If all this makes no sence then please research and learn about compression ratio's and how the numbers are really derived.

BTW my Mazda specification indicate compression ratio of 14.0:1 HA!

 

[Propflux01]

I think you know exactly what I was talking about. And if not , in my response I also gave some information about cylinder volume.

The comment about a RAT motor was to perhaps draw out Perfroamcne Engine builders on this forum.

If all this makes no sence then please research and learn about compression ratio's and how the numbers are really derived.

BTW my Mazda specification indicate compression ratio of 14.0:1 HA!

If I knew exactly what you were talking about, I would not have asked.

 

[NitroM3]

If I knew exactly what you were talking about, I would not have asked.

Sorry, I seem to be getting a few already less then friendly replies from long time members here about my posting style! I am the new kid on the block so I must go through the acceptance time period before what I may say has value, belief or worth reading? I am use to it! In the real world it much different I can assure you. HA!
To answer your question and please do not take this wrong... "it depends"! It also means how are you using the term because most do not use it correctly or understand that their are actually several different types of compression. When I must deal with anything dealing with compression ratio's it is critical that I know the exact compression or I could make an error when rebuilding a complete long block with specialized camshaft(s) or inductive system and the drive ratio on blowers (superchargers). Or it is vitally important when I am engineering a new camshaft design specifications for a purposed application.

I think in this thread some people do not understand what it takes in most circumstances to Hydro lock an engine. Looking at what most on this thread placed in their signature for what vehicles they may own, I saw none that you could unless you actively wanted to hydro lock an engine with a can of intake cleaner following the direction on the can .

 

[PimTac]

Mazda is 13:1 in the US. 14:1 is the rest of the world.

 

[NitroM3]

Mazda is 13:1 in the US. 14:1 is the rest of the world.

Thanks I know that but I said mine..... but you are very correct.
I am not running stock Mazda Cams but my own NS cam set.
In other words I can no longer run less then 91 octane fuel
But thats another subject having to do with full access to the ECM cell and codes yet unbroken. Mainly the TCM that has integrated the programing with the ECM from Mazda. I have an automatic so like most automatic's changing Calibration tables is highly challenging and time consuming and that when you have a program and interface tool to access the ECU and TCM. No such thing as a flash "TOOOON" in my world. You do it correctly and the motor lives. HA!

 

[Propflux01]

Sorry, I seem to be getting a few already less then friendly replies from long time members here about my posting style! I am the new kid on the block so I must go through the acceptance time period before what I may say has value, belief or worth reading? I am use to it! In the real world it much different I can assure you. HA!
To answer your question and please do not take this wrong... "it depends"! It also means how are you using the term because most do not use it correctly or understand that their are actually several different types of compression. When I must deal with anything dealing with compression ratio's it is critical that I know the exact compression or I could make an error when rebuilding a complete long block with specialized camshaft(s) or inductive system and the drive ratio on blowers (superchargers). Or it is vitally important when I am engineering a new camshaft design specifications for a purposed application.

I think in this thread some people do not understand what it takes in most circumstances to Hydro lock an engine. Looking at what most on this thread placed in their signature for what vehicles they may own, I saw none that you could unless you actively wanted to hydro lock an engine with a can of intake cleaner following the direction on the can .

I do not correlate the post count number with the intelligence of the poster. I did not fully understand your post earlier, hence my reply. The part I bolded above made your post complete, however, there is at least one engine, the Hyundai 2.0L that the intake manifold can seemingly pool the liquid of a cleaner. this is what happened to me when I used it on an Elantra GT. When I opened the throttle full, after some driving, some apparently came up at once into one of the cylinders. It made a God-awful knock and nothing but a cloud of blue smoke behind it. Then it accelerated normally and never returned. My guess is when I floored it, it created enough turbulence to pull the product out from the lower nooks and cranny's and into one of the cylinders. While it may not have completely hydro locked, I believe it was very close.

 

[BLND1]

They key is to start early and do it semi-frequently. It's not magic in a can, it's not going to take a 100k engine and clean all the deposits off the valves. But it just might delay the inevitable, at least long enough until you sell the car or reach its end of life, 200k or whatever that may be.

There are plenty of Youtube before & after videos, the stuff does make a difference, but not as much as one would like.

ECS sells a media blasting kit for a reasonable cost. I’d rather just buy that and use it every 50-100k.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

I was just thinking with a ubiquitous dohc pentroof head, and the intake on the cam, you might be able to get in there with some carbcleaner and spray the back of the tulips. Its a bit harder with long reach plug threads though and dohc do not have much lift.

Also, at high rpm / WOT the injector maybe fogging whilst the valves are open due to time constraints to apply the correct semi-rich fueling. So the "Drove it like a Ronin S8 " may have a bit of merit, still.
-Ken