Chinese nuclear momentum

[OVERKILL]

After years of partnerships with traditional nuclear vendors such as Westinghouse, SNC-Lavalin (CANDU Energy) Rosamtom and the like, they have, not surprisingly, developed domestic designs that are based on the designs built in these partnerships. They are now looking to build-out, en masse, these units.

Link to Asia Times article

Quote
China's southern Guangdong province is on a spree constructing nuclear power plants, with the latest addition to the province's nuclear plant cluster in the city of Huizhou, 90 kilometers northeast of Hong Kong.

Six reactors there will generate 50 billion kilowatt-hours per year to quench the province's thirst for electricity.

The 120 billion yuan (US$17.74 billion) megaproject, to be run by the state-owned China General Nuclear Power Corp (CGN), will bring the total number of nuclear reactors in Guangdong, a manufacturing powerhouse and China's largest provincial economy, to 26.

CGN's ultimate plan is to boost that number to 46, spanning 11 plants, to power Guangdong's booming economy, whose gross domestic product in 2018 is tipped to hit the 10-trillion-yuan mark and surpass South Korea and Canada.

The new reactors in Huizhou, already given the go-ahead by China's environmental watchdog, will be built around China's indigenous, third generation Hualong (China Dragon) pressurized water nuclear reactor standards. The total power generation capacity will be equivalent to Hong Kong's annual electricity consumption, according to CGN.

China's Hualong reactors are modeled after France's three cooling loop reactor design.


These reactors are 1,090MWe. 46 of them would have an installed capacity of >50GW and produce 408TWh/year. Combined with the existing fleet of 44 reactors at 40.6GW, this would yield a 90.7GW base that could produce 739TWh/year, putting it in 3rd place behind coal and hydro for generation output, which are at 4,000TWh and 1,144TWh respectively. Expected installed capacity is 150GW by 2030, which would usurp hydro with 1,222TWh of output. This is being done with the intention of displacing coal generation.

 

[Snagglefoot]

Thanks for the post. They are successful in that regard because they don't have to deal with the whims of popular opinion. China will get another serious head start because of this. Although we blast them for having so many coal plants, they are the ones who, in the end, will be doing the most the get to a low carbon energy solution. Unfortunately, being stuck with over a billion people creates challenges getting there.

 

[Danno]

Any concerns on the build quality of the important bits of these plants?

https://www.express.co.uk/news/worl...f-skyscraper-high-rise-viral-video-China

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by Danno
Any concerns on the build quality of the important bits of these plants?

https://www.express.co.uk/news/worl...f-skyscraper-high-rise-viral-video-China


Yes, I think there are always concerns. The most we can do is hope that QC is better for these than with some other industries. The track record so far gives promise however.

 

[pbm]

Unlike many Americans....I am far more concerned about China in the future than Russia, Russia, Russia.....

 

[eljefino]

Originally Posted by pbm
Unlike many Americans....I am far more concerned about China in the future than Russia, Russia, Russia.....


Why not both? One has ability and intent, the other has intent, and, well, sneakiness.

Ok, ok, they're both sneaky too.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by pbm
Unlike many Americans....I am far more concerned about China in the future than Russia, Russia, Russia.....


Yes, economically, China is a far, FAR greater threat than Russia with a GDP of 12.24 trillion vs 1.58. They are in the position of being able to dominate any industry they get involved in which now, in the energy sector appears to potentially cover everything from solar panels to nuclear reactors.

Many may be unaware, but Hinkley Point C, they only active nuclear construction project in the UK at the moment IIRC, since the suspension of the others due to the Hitachi situation, is funded by both the EDF and China's CGN, the same company noted in the OP.

 

[anndel]

Like all other Asian countries, they reverse engineer American/Canadian/European technology then either build their own or sell their product elsewhere, cheaper.

 

[billt460]

The Japanese are very technologically advanced as a society...... And they gave us Fukushima by the sea. I shudder to think what the Chinese are capable of doing.

 

[maxdustington]

Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
Thanks for the post. They are successful in that regard because they don't have to deal with the whims of popular opinion. China will get another serious head start because of this. Although we blast them for having so many coal plants, they are the ones who, in the end, will be doing the most the get to a low carbon energy solution. Unfortunately, being stuck with over a billion people creates challenges getting there.
https://news.sky.com/story/just-10-rivers-carry-90-of-plastic-polluting-the-oceans-11167581 Western environmentalism is practiced to make western environmentalists and bureaucrats rich, it has nothing to do with environmentalism.


Originally Posted by OVERKILL
Originally Posted by pbm
Unlike many Americans....I am far more concerned about China in the future than Russia, Russia, Russia.....


Yes, economically, China is a far, FAR greater threat than Russia with a GDP of 12.24 trillion vs 1.58. They are in the position of being able to dominate any industry they get involved in which now, in the energy sector appears to potentially cover everything from solar panels to nuclear reactors.
Russia doesn't have enough money to as relevant in geopolitics as China. They are the 21st century evil empire, and there will always be someone to bribe to open the gates for them.

I think that Russia being enemy #1 is an appeal to an aging population's former ideological enemy. In 2019 the EU has replaced them as the totalitarian boogeyman, but we need to keep fighting our 20th Century enemies to distract us from our 21st Century enemies.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by anndel
Like all other Asian countries, they reverse engineer American/Canadian/European technology then either build their own or sell their product elsewhere, cheaper.


These were not reverse engineered. There were various partnerships in place to build reactors in China, and the knowledge transfer was very upfront. These companies wanted to build units and that's become increasingly difficult in the western world. China was willing to do it, but only through a partnership so that they could then develop their own designs, which they have now done, and not surprisingly, those designs are all based on those partnerships.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by billt460
The Japanese are very technologically advanced as a society...... And they gave us Fukushima by the sea. I shudder to think what the Chinese are capable of doing.


Fukushima was a GE design and was brought to us by gross negligence via Tepco's failure to follow through with site upgrades that were advocated by both the nuclear safety commission and General Electric. That's why the plant that was even closer to the Tsunami faired just fine.

 

[Snagglefoot]

Seems to me America developed lots of stuff using info from German rocket scientists. Also the British supplied a lot of early steam technology to America, steam locomotives, boilers for steamships etc. Every developing society learns from another. No one is innocent.

 

[Snagglefoot]

That link about the garbage from river was a real eye opener. Seems to me getting rid of poverty is the first priority towards reducing environmental problems.

 

[philipp10]

Originally Posted by Snagglefoot
Seems to me America developed lots of stuff using info from German rocket scientists. Also the British supplied a lot of early steam technology to America, steam locomotives, boilers for steamships etc. Every developing society learns from another. No one is innocent.

Americans have a mentality that we are superior. Having traveled to China a lot, they started with little 30 years ago and the strides they many are almost scary. Yes, they reverse engineer....so does pretty much every American corporation. Every place I have ever worked has brought in competitors products for tear downs. I think what will ultimately trip up China is it's planned economy and corruption. No society can beat out the US when you have a "central planning commission"...

 

[Al]

Glad to see it.
They have the ability to not worry about the populace thinks.

 

[c502cid]

Originally Posted by eljefino
Originally Posted by pbm
Unlike many Americans....I am far more concerned about China in the future than Russia, Russia, Russia.....


Why not both? One has ability and intent, the other has intent, and, well, sneakiness.

Ok, ok, they're both sneaky too.

Don't confuse politicians with the people. The Chinese people (and for that matter the Iranian people among others I have met) love Americans and want to increase relationships with them. In all my years of international business travel, with 9 trips to China alone, I find that for the most part, it's governments and their media that portray nations as "evil".

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

Originally Posted by c502cid
I find that for the most part, it's governments and their media that portray nations as "evil".


"History" is written by the victors, usually to put their own interests in the best light at the expense of the real truth.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted by Al
Glad to see it.
They have the ability to not worry about the populace thinks.


That's it in a nutshell. They couldn't give a rat's behind what GreenPeace or any of the other activist groups, fossil fuel interests or the like thinks. They aren't trying to cater to any court of popular opinion, be it ingrained activism or whimsical myopic populist nonsense. They are building for the long-term and have plans to have nuclear their largest source of generation by 2050.

 

[Al]

Originally Posted by OVERKILL
That's it in a nutshell. They couldn't give a rat's behind what GreenPeace or any of the other activist groups, fossil fuel interests or the like thinks. They aren't trying to cater to any court of popular opinion, be it ingrained activism or whimsical myopic populist nonsense. They are building for the long-term and have plans to have nuclear their largest source of generation by 2050.

If a government bows to the will of the people to determine the long range goals of the country, they likely will not be successful. This is both the strength but also weakness of our Constitutional Republic. Many times the politicians bow to the will of the people not bc its good for the country but bc they need to get re-elected.

Right now China does not have that problem but eventually dictatorial governments are overthrown. And of course some of their success is bc they steal our secrets..oh well..I digress.