Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Max_Wander
OVERKILL I appreciate the fine details. Yes the big numbers on pump gas are somewhat appealing, but again, not my cup.
That's fine. The issue I had was not with what you prefer or do not, it was your condemnation of Ford for something that has nothing to do with their engineering, and is not Ford-engine specific.
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I don't mean to come off like an [censored] (it just happens sometimes) and I'm def. not a Honda freak, look they even have cams failing with stock parts and roller fingers!
Yes, you did for sure
Though I'm sure I did as well.
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What I do appreciate is the engineer's kindness of an over-built production engine. A little known Japanese IRON block, for example, with high flowing DOHC, 4 valve/cyl head on an engine that didnt come turbo from the factory, will STILL make 550+whp reliably entirely stock (and still uses flat bucket lifters). Never ever heard of cam problems.
And there are lots of engines like this from a number of manufacturers.
BuickGN's 3.8L for example.
The 4.6L modular Ford found in the '03/'04 Cobra, will handle over 1,000RWHP on the stock internals no problem.
The 5.4L in the Ford GT.
The 5.4L in the Mustang GT500.
The Ford 427 SOHC from the sixties, 657HP bone stock.
The Ford BOSS 429
The Chrysler 426 HEMI
The aluminum-headed GM 427
The 340 Mopar
Ford's BOSS 302
Ford's 351 Cleveland
and the list goes on......
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When you do these things on a BBx, the springs have to return NEEDLESS amounts of MASS in a timely fashion; the pushrod and the HUGE single valve need a spring strong enough. But install a spring strong enough and lobes go missing. This is where problems come in. You and bubba are right in this case, does he really need such high spring rates for his redline? and the engine builder should have matched the right parts, either lower spring rates and flat tappets or his existing springs and rollers all over. But that's just whatcha gotta deal with, I spose. Perhaps I can't pin this one on FORD (although I don't find cam in block designs to lubricate as well as a OHC where each lobe gets dipped in oil on each revolution), but you can't blame the lube either.
It is a big engine, with huge cylinders, and with huge cylinders, come huge valves. Even if it was retrofitted with overhead cams and 4-valve heads, because of the bore size, the valves could still be quite large.
Ford's 427 SOHC had massive valves in an overhead cam configuration. They also made a DOHC version of the small block Windsor in the early 60's that ran in the Ford/Lotus Indy car.
The mass is hardly needless. It is present due to the size of the engine. An engine of a family that Jon Kaase (I don't know if you are familiar with the name) manages to massage in the neighbourhood of 2,000HP from ALL MOTOR and allows the Purvis Ford racing team to run bottom 6's at well over 200Mph with.
What I fail to see is the logic with the continued use of flat tappets in these engines. Roller kits are relatively inexpensive and completely eliminate this headache. Ford went roller on the Windsor in 1985 in the Mustang, it is not like this is something new for those familiar with engines from the blue oval. People continue to use flat tappet because the cams are cheap and so are the lifters.
As far as cam-in-block lubrication, I have owned FOUR good 'ol cam-in-block 302's, one of which is STILL flat tappet! That's in my 1978 Glasstron. The one in my Mustang has the ORIGINAL cam bearings (all of them do actually) in it, and is on its third camshaft. The bearings look brand new, and I'm still using the ORIGINAL lifters! That engine has had the LIVING SNOT driven out of it. There is no lubrication problem. It is obviously roller.
And to clarify, I never blamed the lube. It was likely the break-in procedure or improper setup that caused the issue.
Very nice! I like the Kaase example; to run 6's all motor is definately respect worthy, no question! Nothing short of cubes can do that, and I guess thats what makes them exclusive. Honestly, I've always wanted to do a boosted SBC, with one of the smaller, more obscure geometries like a 267 for it's near square bore/stroke or a 262 for it's smaller bore. Even when thinking american muscle, i'm a romantic
BuickGN, get ready for the 'ricer respect' for your car, after the Fast and Furious (#4) hits the theatres. They put Vinnie behind the wheel of a GN!
