Cam lobe wear using Rotella T6

Messages
21
Location
Phoenix, AZ, USA
Has anyone here ever heard of excessive cam lobe wear after using Rotella in their bikes? A reputable mechanic in my area states that he's seen abnormal lobe wear on bikes running Rotella T6. I've never heard of this issue. I'm riding an '03 BMW K1200GT and it has what is known as the "brick" engine. I normally run Rotella T6 with no known issues.
 
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2,406
Location
Chicago IL USA
I have a hard time believing T6 is causing or failing to prevent cam lobe wear in a motorcycle. The TDI PD engine is notorious for wearing cams and T6 does a mighty fine job lengthening the life of the camshaft in it. Perhaps give it a little dose of Lubro-Moly MoS2 if you don't have a shared sump wet clutch, otherwise I'd run T6 without worry.
 
Messages
2,935
Location
Canada
Originally Posted By: bepperb
What oil is he trying to sell you?
I agree that the source of the information likely has something to gain by making claims against anything but what they sell. When I sold the KLR, the individual brought it to a Kawasaki dealer to give it a once over. He came back to me to tell me that the mechanics had never heard of anyone using Rotella T in a motorcycle. My response was that the mechanic was either very inexperienced or was trying to peddle their oil brands. I then showed him the JASO rating on the oil jug. Not that it mattered. The buyer wasn't the brightest guy in the world.
 
Messages
1,506
Location
Ruidoso, NM USA
It seems like we all 'fret' about Zinc levels and camshaft wear....but has anyone seen first person abnormal camshaft wear on a modern motorcycle that has has reasonable care with a name brand Oil? I have 138,000 miles on my K75C BMW "brick", some of that on T6, and my camshafts look like new.
 
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Messages
44
Location
LA, CA
don't know about BMW but KTM has had some issues with camshaft lobes due to a defect in material or hardening process. cam lobes will become pitted which in time will wipe out the buckets.
 
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10,783
Location
Jupiter, Florida
Originally Posted By: ammolab
It seems like we all 'fret' about Zinc levels and camshaft wear....but has anyone seen first person abnormal camshaft wear on a modern motorcycle that has has reasonable care with a name brand Oil? I have 138,000 miles on my K75C BMW "brick", some of that on T6, and my camshafts look like new.
Yes, I have. I used to use Spectro oils exclusively, as they were right down the street from where I lived. I was able to get large quantities for free, sometimes in 2L Pepsi containers!!! I operated a number of Honda 4 stroke bikes. Mostly the 200, 250, 500 and 600 XR's. Plus a few of the street legal versions. The older 500 camshafts and followers were nothing but trouble, especially on the street bikes. The Honda camshaft failures were due to design and metallurgy. Spectro sure did not cure the problem.
 
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22,685
Location
Apple Valley, California
Originally Posted By: ammolab
It seems like we all 'fret' about Zinc levels and camshaft wear....but has anyone seen first person abnormal camshaft wear on a modern motorcycle that has has reasonable care with a name brand Oil?
The Kawasaki KLR250 and Mojave quad (same basic engine)are known to eat the intake cam. The Exhaust cam sits in a tub of oil but the intake cam is up in the wind. Mine and the neighbor kids mojave were constantly eating the intake cam untill I switched to Rotella. I don't know what oil was in the kids quad but mine was getting Motul every 500 miles and it still ate a cam regularly.
 
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1,069
Location
Florida /Texas
Yeah castrol r4 5w40 on my DRZ400 (MA rated) group 4 pao(change every 1700-2000 mile street ridden 95%, cams showed lobe wear at 27,000 mile, and defintely rounder lobes at 40,000 mile, lost their Peaks. Bike saw alot of RPM. That was a very thin 5w40, Rotella 5w40 is slightly heavier , I ran both in the bike, but the first 30,000 mile was all R4. I think the R4 is great oil, but The 10w50 viscosity is a better choice, lobe wise in a bike.IMO I have no problems with Hydrocracked 15w40's, much heavier at full temp.
 
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Messages
1,506
Location
Ruidoso, NM USA
Are you guys talking LUBRICATION failure? Sounds like defective Camshafts or faulty engine design, no? Sounds like the OP was getting a warning about the oil and the lubrication doom that was caused by its use in bikes.
 

FusionGuy37

Thread starter
Messages
21
Location
Phoenix, AZ, USA
Yeah, all I was saying was that I was told Rotella has shown "excessive" cam lobe wear in BMW bike engines. Personally I've never seen a negative UOA for Rotella that has shown any kind of excessive wear. The guy who told me this is very opinionated and moreover, grumpy. Ahh well, I'm going to continue using Rotella without worry.
 
Messages
22,685
Location
Apple Valley, California
Originally Posted By: FusionGuy37
Yeah, all I was saying was that I was told Rotella has shown "excessive" cam lobe wear in BMW bike engines. Personally I've never seen a negative UOA for Rotella that has shown any kind of excessive wear. The guy who told me this is very opinionated and moreover, grumpy. Ahh well, I'm going to continue using Rotella without worry.
Go back and tell him your going to put Pennzoil in the bike and see what he says.
 
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4,315
Location
Central Wisconsin
The early Honda V-4 engines were very hard on camshafts. Not an oil problem, it was a design and manufacturing problem. The cams were not heat treated properly. There was a by-pass oil line mod that fixed the problem by 'over oiling' the cams. It worked well. Don't know what year Honda fixed the problem in house.
 
Messages
1,069
Location
Florida /Texas
My DRZ was not a design issue, it was a film strength issue. Im fairly certian heavier film strength would have aided alot in reducing that Lobe wear. My VFR was broken in on Rotella 5w40, In the first 8,000 miles I was dummping oil about every 1100, cause the oil was degrading so quickly. I had it tested and the rotella was a 30 weight at 1100 miles. Switched to amsoil 15w40, doubled the distance on change and produced indentical wear numbers and degrade as the rotella5w40. Rotella was like $4, per quart and amsoil was $8 perquart. Double the money was worth double the distance. Plus the ams shifted smoother.BONUS!
 
Messages
26,146
Location
MA, Mittelfranken.de
Originally Posted By: dwendt44
The early Honda V-4 engines were very hard on camshafts. Not an oil problem, it was a design and manufacturing problem. The cams were not heat treated properly. There was a by-pass oil line mod that fixed the problem by 'over oiling' the cams. It worked well. Don't know what year Honda fixed the problem in house.
They didn't fix the problem. CBR1000 engines also had cam problems through the whole production run despite pressure squirter's feeding each lobe with massive amounts of oil. The engines that used double followers had the most issues, the VF1100C and VF750C (V65/V45) had these also. Each lobe operated 2 valves so the pressure on the lobe was incredible and without proper break in they failed very early. According to Honda these engines were not hot fired at the factory just cold run so it was up to the dealer to break the cams in (good luck with that). Replacement cams broken in properly would go over 100K with ease. I bought my 93 CBR1000 grey market in the crate in Holland then brought it to Germany and did my own final assembly. I broke the cams it properly the first time i fired the engine and sold the bike with 160K on the clock 12 years later without ever changing a camshaft while a high percentage had gone through cams by 10K.
 
Messages
1,506
Location
Ruidoso, NM USA
Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: dwendt44
The early Honda V-4 engines were very hard on camshafts. Not an oil problem, it was a design and manufacturing problem. The cams were not heat treated properly. There was a by-pass oil line mod that fixed the problem by 'over oiling' the cams. It worked well. Don't know what year Honda fixed the problem in house.
They didn't fix the problem. CBR1000 engines also had cam problems through the whole production run despite pressure squirter's feeding each lobe with massive amounts of oil. The engines that used double followers had the most issues, the VF1100C and VF750C (V65/V45) had these also. Each lobe operated 2 valves so the pressure on the lobe was incredible and without proper break in they failed very early. According to Honda these engines were not hot fired at the factory just cold run so it was up to the dealer to break the cams in (good luck with that). Replacement cams broken in properly would go over 100K with ease. I bought my 93 CBR1000 grey market in the crate in Holland then brought it to Germany and did my own final assembly. I broke the cams it properly the first time i fired the engine and sold the bike with 160K on the clock 12 years later without ever changing a camshaft while a high percentage had gone through cams by 10K.
Cold run / hot run would that not be the same for a camshaft break in? Unlike say a piston or valve? What would proper Hot run dealer break in consist of?
 
Messages
26,146
Location
MA, Mittelfranken.de
Cold running just checks the build but isn't long enough to break the engine in. Hot fired and run at 2500 RPM for 20min is needed for proper cam break in. Parts need to be at operating temp to break in properly. Most engines tolerate this not being done because of lower spring pressures but a few like the ones i mentioned do not. Some cars engines running aftermarket big cams must even use lighter springs initially to break the cam in then switch to the higher rate ones after.
 
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1,069
Location
Florida /Texas
What is the breakin mainly for, the journals or the lobes? Reason I ask most Motorcycles that Ive seen , dont use cam journal Bearings, but sit right into soft aluminum head, only the oil film keeps from eating it.
 
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