brake rotors

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Yes, this is odd.
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I prefer the term 'eccentric'
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my brake bleeding habit comes from my old racing days where we'd bleed/flush the system before qualifying and racing.

I reckon if we thought it was that important to do then, the least I can do on the road cars is every 18 months.
The same goes for braided hoses and 'good' pads.
 
I have not had any problems replacing warped rotors under warranty. This has been a recurring problem on my Saturns and some other GM stuff too. AFAIK, it's a normal gripe. To me, replacing them is a minor inconvenience. Fixed for free, my wallet remains happy.

I buy the cheap chinese rotors at my local midsized regional discount auto parts store ("VIP"). They are warrantied against defects in material and manufacture for one year.

Imperfect steel, or poor cooling in the foundry, qualifies. I suspect many people only have one car so they buy a second new set of rotors before they pull the first ones off... and by then they forget to bring them back.

It probably depends on your store's attitude. I guess they could probably turn them to "fix" the situation under warranty but I've always gotten new ones.
 
There are several different "lifetime" warranties

The original part is warranted for it's lifetime. It's replacement ..isn't

The original replacement part is warranted "as long as you own your car" type. This was a favorite warranty for the cheap aftermarket battery/shocks. The owner on his second battery rarely owned the same car when it failed. Ownership was shorter back in the day of the "lifetime" battery warranty.

and then there's those that, if you can maintain the paper trail ..are forever.

and those like Craftsman/Snap-On ..no paper trail needed ..warranted forever.

There are others, I'm sure.
 
Well, let's take the case of rotors (or pads). I go to my cheapo oil change place, they put new rotors on n new pads. I hear the warning squeal n take it back. What should I expect to pay? "Only the labor" since the parts have a "lifetime" warrenty? Why do I think that ain't gonna happen?
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A little off-topic...when replacing pads I usually just very lightly scuff the rotor surface to remove old pad material, then I bed the pads.

Bedding is easy to do, here's a good link. There are a few variations but most are pretty similar.

http://www.stoptech.com/whitepapers/bedintheory.htm

My Expedition weighs 3 tons (yup) and has a blower so I go thru a LOT of pads.
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Did steam erupt from your ears when your wife told you she'd been hearing a grinding noise "for some time now"?
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quote:

Originally posted by robbobster:
A little off-topic...when replacing pads I usually just very lightly scuff the rotor surface to remove old pad material, then I bed the pads.

Bedding is easy to do, here's a good link. There are a few variations but most are pretty similar.

http://www.stoptech.com/whitepapers/bedintheory.htm


20 years of driving and probably 10 brake jobs, and I have neverr done any of that. Just put in the new pads and drive normally. Never had a problem.
 
quote:

Originally posted by kreigle:

quote:

Originally posted by robbobster:
A little off-topic...when replacing pads I usually just very lightly scuff the rotor surface to remove old pad material, then I bed the pads.

Bedding is easy to do, here's a good link. There are a few variations but most are pretty similar.

http://www.stoptech.com/whitepapers/bedintheory.htm


20 years of driving and probably 10 brake jobs, and I have neverr done any of that. Just put in the new pads and drive normally. Never had a problem.


I used to never do it either. Then an autocross buddy showed me what happens to green pads (pads that haven't been heat-cycled) on an autocross course. They fade really bad. Pedal to the floor within one lap. Once they cool, they are more resistant to fade and never again did the pedal go to the floor.

So bedding can serve two functions: establilsh transfer layer + heat cycle so your pads aren't green.

Keep in mind that this type of abuse is not what most street cars have to deal with. But when it comes to brakes, I'll go the extra mile to make sure my brakes will perform optimally.

In addition to the above link, here are a few descriptions of green fade. You can google "green fade brakes" (no quotation marks) and find more:
http://www.h-e-l.co.uk/HEL_Performance_Brake_Doctor_Brake_Fade.htm

http://people.ucsc.edu/~kbrandt/mustang/brakfade.shtml

[ March 11, 2005, 03:57 PM: Message edited by: robbobster ]
 
quote:

Originally posted by kreigle:

quote:

Originally posted by robbobster:
A little off-topic...when replacing pads I usually just very lightly scuff the rotor surface to remove old pad material, then I bed the pads.

Bedding is easy to do, here's a good link. There are a few variations but most are pretty similar.

http://www.stoptech.com/whitepapers/bedintheory.htm


20 years of driving and probably 10 brake jobs, and I have neverr done any of that. Just put in the new pads and drive normally. Never had a problem.


"Never having a problem" is entirely different from optimum braking and wear.

If you never did this how do you know you wouldn't double the life of your rotors, make them wear more evenly etc?

I drive hard and break hard. I have always worn out my brake pads and rotors way before I thought they should. MAYBE this is why?
 
No, no steam robbobster. After 26 years of marriage I have come to expect such things. And no matter what she does or whatever happens, it is never her fault. By default all blame comes to me.
 
We live on a modest hill and with both cars having an auto transmission, which picks up lots of speed as you go down a hill, we end up being hard on brakes. We use to have them done often at the dealer but still ended up with 'warped discs' often, and since it was getting expensive I decided to do the brakes. I used some Raybestos pads, fancy ones, and had to replace one rotor on one car, so I used a Ford rotor. Later on I had to replace the other rotor so I used a Napa rotor, which I assume is Chinese. One usually pulls to the right, the other to the left, so they balance out (joke :^)

In addition to using Raybestos pads, not the best of the best but apparently better than OEM, and also changing braking style, we cured what was 'warped discs'. Since using brakes won't unwarp a warped disc I assume it was getting glazed. We use to ride the brakes down the hill and now we use a cyclic pattern; braking, letting off, braking, letting off, etc.
 
I was impressed with the cheapo rotors and pads we put on my GF's integra.

Her car is used for either smooth, cruise control, 65 mph riding on the highway, or slow cruising around town/in traffic. Nothing too severe, and so we figured that we would save a few dollars and get the autozone lifetime pads, since they were on sale, and half the prioce of the usual OE equivalent pads that I get from my distributor. Pads are cheap enough that I figured if they are that bad, I can replace them quickly and easily.

I got the Albany 'lifetime' warranty pads for the front and rear from autozone. AZ was out of front rotors, but I got a set of rear rotors (Albany brand) from them. I got the house brand 'prostop' front vented rotors from pep boys.

Except on my truck, which has large vented rotors front and rear, which cost $100 each, I dont think its worth it to pay $10-15 to turn a rotor, especially if it is a solid one. Rotors are only as good as its heat storage capacity, and the less mass, the less capacity. Since the rotors (frt and rear) on my truck are oversized for towing, and I dont tow, I havent had an issue. Especially because they arent very succeptible to warping.

I was REALLY impressed with the new rotors and pads on the integra. I figured they would provide just good enough ho-hum performance, and that Id probably use them for 20k and then replace them early. Because of how well they do, Ill probably use these pads and rotors again, maybe on other cars too!

The performance was as good as on my friend's new integra I drove a few years back. Her integra also stopped better than when she had the pads done at the dealer last time.

So suprisingly, I have been really happy with autozone lifetime pads and the standard 1 year warranty rotors.

Just my experience. But whenever possible (I use the rule that if rotors are less than ~$50 each, or are solid, they should be replaced with the pads), Id say to do the rotors with pads, so its all new. That yields the best performance for me at least.

It may be different if you use through a set of pads in 20k miles or less... I can often get 100k of life on pads, even on my cars that get around-town and traffic driving. I dont think ive ever goten less than 40k miles on a set of pads, even on euro cars using soft pads. YMMV.

JMH
 
quote:

Originally posted by Frank D:
No, no steam robbobster. After 26 years of marriage I have come to expect such things. And no matter what she does or whatever happens, it is never her fault. By default all blame comes to me.

Looks like I'll remain single for the foreseeable future...
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I've only had one rotor fail (crack, in this case; never any warping) and that was due to manufacturing defect (back in 1975). Don't need brake jobs except every 75-90k. Learning to use brakes well is the biggest job.

That said, bedding them is a one-time deal and usually worth a short drive in the country. And annual fluid changes (or after mountain towing) is cheap enough.

I'll pay the premium prices because, **** , they're the brakes . . . the JEEP is going to get a PRAISE DYNO complete set-up soon (and will add ss braided lines and new m/c). Hopefully, margin of safety will improve along with life (90k-plus, versus 90k).

"Best" drums and rotors have been "Made in Canada" for my experience, so far.
 
Something else I remember reading or hearing about regarding warped rotors is to make sure your lug nuts are torqued to the right specs. Overtorquing the lug nuts can cause the rotors to warp. I love getting my car back from wherever (dealership, Canadian Tire, local tire store) after any work where the wheels have been removed and checking the torque on the lug nuts with my trusty torque wrench. Usually not one single nut is the same and usually they're cranked on to near failure by some grease monkey with an impact wrench...just another reason I like to do most maintenance on my cars myself.
 
I bet grease monkeys with airguns are the #1 cause of warped rotors
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Idiots.

If you're pads weren't worn evenly, you might want to make sure your calipers are free on their mounts, and not stuck. They should slide back and forth a bit.
 
Well I did the brakes on the Windstar Saturday and all went well. I installed new Wearever rotors from Advance and new Bendix pads also from Advance. I cleaned everything up real good and greased the slider pins well. The calipers seemed ok and they move around easily. The brake pads were $44.95 on sale and the rotors were $65.28 each with a one year warranty. The Wearever house brand rotors were the only ones in stock so I took them. The boxes they came in don't say where they were made. The braking action on the car is good, no vibration when braking at any speed. Forgot to add thanks for all the tips and advice.
 
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