Best Way To Rust-Proof?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Originally Posted By: supton

User beware: it's a light oil, and it will attract dirt. If you read FF's website, their usage document, they call it "dusting". Seems to make the dirt stick pretty good. I know, it's underneath, but you can see it in the wheelwells.


Sounds like it's not much more than what the country new car dealers used to do.. Spray the underside with used motor oil and drive it down a dusty road, "yes sir we undercoated it for you"...
 
Two ways to do it:

If you want to drive it forever garage it when the salt flies.

If you want to drive it for its useful life just spray the underside with fresh water when you can, and by the time it rots out in 20 years you will be ready for a new car.
 
I am just getting into the DIY rust proofing game myself. I am evaluating several different rust proofing compounds and will be gathering data over the next few weeks, months, and years. I am not interested in paying someone to do carwell or krown, nor are any of those treatments available in my area. I am focused on the do it yourself chemcials and their equipment only at this point.

So far I rust proofed my 2011 siverado with Corrosion X Heavy Duty by spraying it in with 6 spray cans and then using a paint brush to spread it around evenly. It dried to a greasy/waxy coating which is really thick. It as been 4 weeks now and really seems durable. It does collect some dirt but it doesn't hold the dirt real firm and you can use gentle garden hose water pressure to rinse the dirt out of the corrosion x without thinning or removing the corrosion x at all. I am not sure if this is a bad thing or not but I have to say it. Corrosion X HD did seem to soften the factory rubbery/waxy undercoating that came with my truck. The areas of it that were already damaged from rock impacts or whatever have now softened, curled up and fell away from the frame, leaving the corrosion X HD coating but bare metal underneath. The un-damaged area of the factory coating are still perfect with the corrosion X HD sitting pretty on top. Now, I am guessing the softening/falling off process would have happened over time without the corrosion X HD anyways so I am not upset but this may really anger some folks who try it. Fluid film says it also may sofetn some types of undercoats so this may just be par for the course with any type of rust proofing spray. The only real down side I can see with Corrosion X HD is that it is very expensive, Over $100 a gallon bulk or 14$ + shipping for a 12oz areosol can.

My 2002 pontiac sunfire was rust proofed with non areosol fluid film (Fluid Film NAS) using a latex paint spray gun. The spray gun I bought worked perfectly and the application process was perfect. I used the gun to shoot everything and then went back and used their aerosol can attachment to spray inside all the voids and access holes I could find. I did not drill any holes, I just used every space I could find. the process cos me 3 cans of areosol and about 1/3 of a gallon of the bulk NAS formula. The process took me about 4 hours and gave my 30 gallon compressor a bit of a workout. I let my car sit for 24 hours and then drove normally. The fluid film creeped into every litte nook and cranny and got inver everything everywhere you could imagine on the car! It even quieted down my squeeky suspension and seemed to soften existing rust I had. I was really loving fluid film up till this point. Now the bad news... the bulk fluid film I sprayed (a pretty thick coat at that) in and around the wheel wells was 100% gone after driving only 20 minutes in a rain storm. The rest of the car held up pretty well but it collected alot of dirt. It has now been 2 weeks and the fluid film is holding up just OK. The underbelly of the car is still coated well with fluid film (and dirt) but basically any area of the undercarriage that is in reach of the wheel well wash, is dry. At this point, I can't see how fluid film could possibly survive a winter in the rust belt. Fluid film works really well inside the cavities of your car but frankly I am not so sure it is durable enough to be used as an undercoat/rust proof. I really want to like fluid film because it is non toxic, inexpensive $45/gallon bulk (with free shipping) and very versatile but the durability does not look good enough for me.

To give fluid film a fair shake, I just ordered the heavy duty thick film (grease) version of fluid film called fluid film AR. It is not recommended as an undercoat because it is difficult to apply (brush only) and really takes the convience of a sprayer away but it is supposed to be much more durable than the NAS fluid film. My plan is to just paint on the fluid film AR in the high wash areas and see how it does. I have also seen people melt the fluid film AR by putting it in a wax candle melter and then spray it with a spray gun while it is still hot and liquid, I may give that a try as well. I need more time to check out fluid film AR but in the mean time, I can't recommend fluid film as a vehicle rust proof at this point, it simply isn't durable enough. If you really want to use fluid film as an undercoat, it will need to be touched up quarterly at least...... YMMV

Finally, I just received a shipment of 6 cans of Amsoil Heavy Duty Metal Protector for testing as an undercoat/rust proof. I will be treating my father's 2002 jeep wrangler with it and I will report back when I do. At this point, its advantages seem to be a reasonble price $8.20 + shipping (that is without the dealer/prefered customer pricing) for a 16 oz can and the fact that it is more of dry, waxy film which should (hopefully anyway) not rinse away so easily and collect less dirt than fluid film. The biggest downside I see with the amsoil is that it is not available in a bulk form and is more toxic and less versatile than fluid film. Stand by for more data from me on amsoil.
Sorry for the long post but I wanted to share my DIY rust proofing data/opinions that I have gathered at this point. I am sure someone can benefit from it. Post up if you have any questions or input.
 
Last edited:
I'm not going to be doing this job myself.

Here are two things I found out:

1.) Krown costs $120 per treatment. You are locked into that amount every year.

2.) Rust Check has an initial cost of $180, and then it's $35 each year after that. They spray on a "sealing/healing" solution after the initial $180 treatment.

So, in 5 years of treatment....Krown will cost me $600. Rust Check will cost me $320. Half price.

That's considerable savings.
 
Originally Posted By: AMC
Now the bad news... the bulk fluid film I sprayed (a pretty thick coat at that) in and around the wheel wells was 100% gone after driving only 20 minutes in a rain storm.


Very interesting. I am now going to have to look at mine to see if that occurred. I agree, I was hoping this would be a good solution. I'll have to see what is left. Question, though: on my three vehicles the wheelwheels have heavy plastic liners and thick undercoat; it's only the screw heads that are really exposed.

Then again, my daily driver gets 20k/year. I wonder if fogging the wheelwheels every tire rotation would work.
 
Originally Posted By: Phishin
I'm not going to be doing this job myself.

Here are two things I found out:

1.) Krown costs $120 per treatment. You are locked into that amount every year.

2.) Rust Check has an initial cost of $180, and then it's $35 each year after that. They spray on a "sealing/healing" solution after the initial $180 treatment.

So, in 5 years of treatment....Krown will cost me $600. Rust Check will cost me $320. Half price.

That's considerable savings.


Yes, I want to try DIY rustproofing as well this year, however even if one chooses to use Krown, that $600 that would've been spent in 5 years to treat the car, will easily be wiped out for a good rust repair job done at a body shop, if no rustproofing was used. So, all in all, even with the expense of Krown treatment, the savings in rust repair can be substantial.
DIY will make rustproofing dirt cheap though.
 
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Two ways to do it:

If you want to drive it forever garage it when the salt flies.

If you want to drive it for its useful life just spray the underside with fresh water when you can, and by the time it rots out in 20 years you will be ready for a new car.


no, actually, rustproofing works.
 
Originally Posted By: Zero
What about Ziebart, are their service worth the time and money?


i think ziebart is more of a layer of stuff that works for a little while but over time contains the moisture and salt. it isn't like rustcheck or krown I don't think
 
Originally Posted By: supton
Originally Posted By: AMC
Now the bad news... the bulk fluid film I sprayed (a pretty thick coat at that) in and around the wheel wells was 100% gone after driving only 20 minutes in a rain storm.


Very interesting. I am now going to have to look at mine to see if that occurred. I agree, I was hoping this would be a good solution. I'll have to see what is left. Question, though: on my three vehicles the wheelwheels have heavy plastic liners and thick undercoat; it's only the screw heads that are really exposed.

Then again, my daily driver gets 20k/year. I wonder if fogging the wheelwheels every tire rotation would work.


Ive wondered about this too. But my assumption is that exposed, straight surfaces in good shape dont really need rustproofing.

The rustproofing is critical in nooks and crannies where water / environmental moisture can sit and create an environment to facilitate rust. Also nicks and scratches where other coatings dont exist.

The reason I like corrosionX and Krown/Carwell better than FF is that they have surface chemistry to them (just like motor oils) to passivate the exposed metal surfaces where a gouge or chip may have gone below the galvanization and/or protective coating.

Stuff that is just sitting or not getting substantial splashing should be fine with any product, though creeping is important.

For nooks and crannies, Id guess that any product, if applied in a rigorous way, would get in and protect fairly well. and if just displacing in those nooks and crannies, Im not sure that the surface chemistry is all that critical, thus why FF works OK for most stuff.
 
Yes, you and supton are on the right track. Fluid film will creep and migrate more than Corrosion X HD or amsoil HDMP but it does so at the cost of less durability. That is why I say, fluid does work well for the enclosed cavities of your car. But, in a high wash, exposed undercarriage area, it isn't durable enough.

The front of my Pontiac has plastic liners but the rear has no liners at all, factory applied rubberized undercoating only. Most of the fluid film is still in place on the struts and springs, the wheel wells themselves are dry though, not even a slight film anymore. This might be OK because these "high wash" areas also get rinsed constantly and I dont think dirty, salty water would ever have a chance to really collect. If you are really worried about the high wash areas, paint on a thick layer of fluid film AR. I plan on gooping on the fluid film AR to the frame and suspension components in all the high wash areas but not the sheet metal wheel wells themselves.

Here is a video of a guy testing fluid film and he finds the same thing I did, regular fluid film is not durable enough for the high wash areas.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_8MhkPB45k

Here is the same guy gooping on the fluid film AR. This guy cracks me up! He starts talking about fluid film AR at 4:19, you may want to skip the rest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HuZJJgmDydw
 
Originally Posted By: sciphi
I've used Fluid Film aerosol cans. It takes about 4-5 cans per car to do a very thorough job.

I got a bit of a chuckle reading this. One time I rustproofed my car and used 4 gallons of rustproofing. This is the amount used before cutting it with mineral spirits so it can be sprayed. I like to lay it on thick and have it last a long time.
 
but the issue of coming off in high wash locations still stands. And laying it on thick in those high wash locations may not buy more than a few extra minutes...
 
Originally Posted By: Kestas
Originally Posted By: sciphi
I've used Fluid Film aerosol cans. It takes about 4-5 cans per car to do a very thorough job.

I got a bit of a chuckle reading this. One time I rustproofed my car and used 4 gallons of rustproofing. This is the amount used before cutting it with mineral spirits so it can be sprayed. I like to lay it on thick and have it last a long time.


It does need to be re-applied every year.

What I've found with FF is that even though it appears to be washed off, the water still beads on the surface. It must leave some residue behind. Whether it's good enough to suffice a winter without re-application is something I'll discover in 4-5 years.
 
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
Originally Posted By: Phishin
I'm not going to be doing this job myself.

Here are two things I found out:

1.) Krown costs $120 per treatment. You are locked into that amount every year.

2.) Rust Check has an initial cost of $180, and then it's $35 each year after that. They spray on a "sealing/healing" solution after the initial $180 treatment.

So, in 5 years of treatment....Krown will cost me $600. Rust Check will cost me $320. Half price.

That's considerable savings.


Yes, I want to try DIY rustproofing as well this year, however even if one chooses to use Krown, that $600 that would've been spent in 5 years to treat the car, will easily be wiped out for a good rust repair job done at a body shop, if no rustproofing was used. So, all in all, even with the expense of Krown treatment, the savings in rust repair can be substantial.
DIY will make rustproofing dirt cheap though.


Excuse me? Which cars do you buy that rust in 5 years? I am looking for my cars NOT to rust over 15 year period! Do you think it is worth spending 15x120 = $1800 for rustproofing?
 
Last edited:
The major issue with rust proofing is you have to be extra careful applying it. Making sure every drain hole in the body does not get plugged. In my experience dealer applied rust proofing makes rust worst as it traps moisture in the panels. I found this out with body rot on the rust proofed side of car but accident side where it was not reapplied the body was perfect 10 years latter.

IMHO modern car makers do a wonderful job at the factory with rust proofing. Few folks will realize any benefit doing aftermarket and some the ill effects. I think it is akin to snake oil.
 
I coated the underside of my 2008 Jeep Liberty with Amsoil HD Metal Protector in late 2007 when I got it. I touch it up when I rotate tires or do oil changes. The product is holding up very well so far. I could probably touch it up once every two years if I become lazy, and still have no rust problems. YMMV
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom