How about some sort of on-board oil centrifuge?
Best filter period.....
- Thread starter BUDSHAD
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Amsoil EaO filter
Second that!
Right behind it is O'l McDonalds EiEiO
Work at a winery and run a centrifuge to clean up wine and juice. Runs maximum around 1000 gallons / hour. Basic problem you would have with an onboard oil centrifuge is that when it get's loaded it has to be "dumped" or it will become so solid it won't expel out of the ports. We have to watch that even with stuff like wine that there is not too long a delay between dumps elses you risk imbalancing the centrifuge. NOT good. When you have around 700 lbs of Stainless Steel spinning at some 5400 rpm, you don't want that getting away from you.
Now.. how about specs on filter thread diameters and pitch? Same with oil ring gasket? I changed from the PH3387A in my Buick (shorter filter) to the PH 3980, which is exactly the same center thread and gasket configuration, and all things being the same except it is longer. I change with 5 quarts rather than with 4.5 quarts. I don't use the Fram, I have the Mobil1 in there at the moment. Mobil 1 filter for the replacement of the PH3980, or WIX 51036, or Purolator L24011 is the Mobil 1 M1-201 filter.. just for your info.
Finally, a question that has never been asked on this forum before.
More details before that question can be answered. Are you a Walmart kind of guy? Do it yourself or bring to dealer? Lease for 3 years or drive into the ground? 1960 pickup or 2007 BMW? Extended oil changes so you can save our planet from wasting oil for needless oil changes when extended oil changes are a super idea, or normal 3K dino oil changes because your brother in-law says thats whats best and hey if he knows a lot about beer (drinks Piels) he must know a lot about oil.
for you guys that like to go CHEAP, just wash out the old one with gasoline and reuse it
or dumpster dive at the local Quack Lube, these only have 3k miles on them
or dumpster dive at the local Quack Lube, these only have 3k miles on them
I use PureOne or Mobil 1 on most of our cars, Fleetgard or Donaldson on our diesels and construction equipment, and Mahle or Mann on German cars.
The new Amsoil EaO sounds like the best filter and will be my next purchase for any of our vehicles.
The new Amsoil EaO sounds like the best filter and will be my next purchase for any of our vehicles.
Big question that always goes through my mind is "how good are they REALLY filtering?" I figure that for the most part the filter is just taking out medium sized crud or particulate matter that would definitely score a surface, like a grain of sand or such.
During the time a car (vehicle) is going down the road doesn't the filter just "by-pass" any filtration to allow the "full flow" of the oil though it to keep up with the rpm of the engine and the oil pump?
Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't an oil filter allow unfiltered oil to circulate through during high engine revs/ oil pressure just to keep up? Isn't that what the spring and valve do in the filter.... allow it to give full flow of oil so the engine doesn't become starved?
Seems like the only time it is really filtering is when it is at idle and then only when the filter is fairly new and not becoming clogged with debris. If a filter becomes coated it ceases to filter and then the increasing pressure allows ALL the oil to circulate through totally unfiltered.
It would be inter sting to take a filter off a vehicle that had a few thousand miles on it, screw it onto an oil pipeline apparatus (in a shop or such) and create a way that the bypass flap is completely shut off, so that NO oil goes though the bypass and ALL oil has to go through the filter. Then put a pressure gage on the filter and see exactly how much pressure it is building up and if and how much flow there really is at that point.
Vern
During the time a car (vehicle) is going down the road doesn't the filter just "by-pass" any filtration to allow the "full flow" of the oil though it to keep up with the rpm of the engine and the oil pump?
Correct me if I am wrong but doesn't an oil filter allow unfiltered oil to circulate through during high engine revs/ oil pressure just to keep up? Isn't that what the spring and valve do in the filter.... allow it to give full flow of oil so the engine doesn't become starved?
Seems like the only time it is really filtering is when it is at idle and then only when the filter is fairly new and not becoming clogged with debris. If a filter becomes coated it ceases to filter and then the increasing pressure allows ALL the oil to circulate through totally unfiltered.
It would be inter sting to take a filter off a vehicle that had a few thousand miles on it, screw it onto an oil pipeline apparatus (in a shop or such) and create a way that the bypass flap is completely shut off, so that NO oil goes though the bypass and ALL oil has to go through the filter. Then put a pressure gage on the filter and see exactly how much pressure it is building up and if and how much flow there really is at that point.
Vern
Nebraskan..buy a GM filter with no built in by-pass and use it on an application where a by-pass in the filter should be.
Tell us what happens.
And do not send me any repair bills...
One can look at this two ways...Engine companies don't care about filtering and want to sell replacement parts for thier engines and keep their repair shops full..
Or that the filter does prolong the life of the engine.
As all filters remove particles smaller than the eye can see at 20/20 vision--the particles that are the main culprits of engine wear...it's a matter of how good they do their job versus OEM spec.
Otherwise it's all a ruse and parts per million counts of wear metals in oil analysis means nothing. Take the filter completely off and plug the hole....
Tell us what happens.
And do not send me any repair bills...
One can look at this two ways...Engine companies don't care about filtering and want to sell replacement parts for thier engines and keep their repair shops full..
Or that the filter does prolong the life of the engine.
As all filters remove particles smaller than the eye can see at 20/20 vision--the particles that are the main culprits of engine wear...it's a matter of how good they do their job versus OEM spec.
Otherwise it's all a ruse and parts per million counts of wear metals in oil analysis means nothing. Take the filter completely off and plug the hole....
Filter guy did'nt BOB do that?
When I lived back in Nebraska, I rebuilt a VW motor for my 1974 Super Beetle. They don't come with a regular spin on oil filter, just a wire screen, similar to the one you see in the kitchen drawer. I put on an aftermarket oil pump and filter. Point is, that all they had was just a screen for a filter.
My Cousin was telling me that before 1955 GM motors came with no oil filter, and if you wanted a filter it was an add on accessory. Now you look at the size of the small spin on filters and you wonder what they are up to? It's like they put on a spin on filter just the make the consumer feel good. My Buick PA filter is the little dinky 3887A, and one I would think would be on a motorcycle or a lawn tractor for it's size. My Cousin also has an Internataional tractor and turck. They take the same size filter and same looking oil gasket, except for different numbers. I believe all he uses is Baldwin filters, made at Kearney Nebraska. So, he asks the guy at the parts store the difference in the two filters? One is for by pass systmes and one if for full flow systems, don't switch them around.
What are the majority of most engine designs today then? Full flow or by pass? Once a filter is coated if it is too tight for oil flow, then it just becomes a covering "plate"?
My Cousin was telling me that before 1955 GM motors came with no oil filter, and if you wanted a filter it was an add on accessory. Now you look at the size of the small spin on filters and you wonder what they are up to? It's like they put on a spin on filter just the make the consumer feel good. My Buick PA filter is the little dinky 3887A, and one I would think would be on a motorcycle or a lawn tractor for it's size. My Cousin also has an Internataional tractor and turck. They take the same size filter and same looking oil gasket, except for different numbers. I believe all he uses is Baldwin filters, made at Kearney Nebraska. So, he asks the guy at the parts store the difference in the two filters? One is for by pass systmes and one if for full flow systems, don't switch them around.
What are the majority of most engine designs today then? Full flow or by pass? Once a filter is coated if it is too tight for oil flow, then it just becomes a covering "plate"?
Don't you mean orange can of DEATH.quote:
Originally posted by The Critic:
Orange Can...
But its hard to beat Amsoil...
I did that in my wife's previous car. I got as far as UOA's with Mobil 1 and K&N filters using Mobil 1 oil, no difference in insolubles. We traded the car in before I got to do one with an AC filter.
I have been doing this, but have not got enough results to make any real, solid conclusions yet. What has surprised me so far is that I've gotten outstanding (i.e. outstanding particle counts) results from the K&N. This filter, of course, is reputed to sacrifice filtration in favor of flow. At this point, I'd have to say maybe, maybe not. It could be that it actually filters very well, contrary to the reputation, or maybe my engines are just really clean to begin with. Obviously, it will take some time, and one engine, back-to-back "testing" is inherently limited, because the variables beyond your control always drift from one run to the next. But hey, that won't stop me from trying. I'll post more results as I get 'em. Yep, the K&N is the priciest of the Champ labs products, but it's built like a tank (for example, its skin just won't flex at all like the Puro), and of course, it's the only one that's got the "safety-wireable" nut on top.
''During the time a car (vehicle) is going down the road doesn't the filter just "by-pass" any filtration to allow the "full flow" of the oil though it to keep up with the rpm of the engine and the oil pump?''
Do a search on Gary Allen. He rigged up pressure gages before and after the filter and claims the delta pressure seldom reaches the bypass spec. Be interesting to hear if it bypasses more later in the OCI.
''I would like more Bitog members to run their own tests using their standard OCI and UOA and see if the filter makes any difference.''
Gasp, Aruuuuuuuuugh! Base our decisions on facts? Be interesting to see reports of Fram, ST, Purolator, AC, WIX, K&N, M1, etc. Is Fram that bad, and are the more expensive filters better? What brave soul is going to do a Fram test for us? Somebody about to trade?
Do a search on Gary Allen. He rigged up pressure gages before and after the filter and claims the delta pressure seldom reaches the bypass spec. Be interesting to hear if it bypasses more later in the OCI.
''I would like more Bitog members to run their own tests using their standard OCI and UOA and see if the filter makes any difference.''
Gasp, Aruuuuuuuuugh! Base our decisions on facts? Be interesting to see reports of Fram, ST, Purolator, AC, WIX, K&N, M1, etc. Is Fram that bad, and are the more expensive filters better? What brave soul is going to do a Fram test for us? Somebody about to trade?
Thanks labman!! I belive I did read that thread, and it is correct with local race mechanic I know, here locally. Cars running down the road have the majority if not all the oil being filtered though the filter, and only if the filter was really clogged up would the bypass valve allow oil to flow though that way. I stand corrected for sure!
But they also agreed with me on this.... that if the car had a very good bypass filter setup, and you put on a full flow filter on the engine where it normally goes, as long as you pay attention to the bypass filter and change it regular there should be no need to worry much about the full flow for several years. If the bypass is doing it's job then there will be little if any thing in the oil for the full flow filter to act upon, and therefore, be virtually there as a backup to the bypass system.
Vern
But they also agreed with me on this.... that if the car had a very good bypass filter setup, and you put on a full flow filter on the engine where it normally goes, as long as you pay attention to the bypass filter and change it regular there should be no need to worry much about the full flow for several years. If the bypass is doing it's job then there will be little if any thing in the oil for the full flow filter to act upon, and therefore, be virtually there as a backup to the bypass system.
Vern
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