Benefits of Running a Larger Oil Filter? (Cold starts etc)

[CR94]

Help me understand why we would run a filter other than what has been engineered and specified for our vehicles? The oil filter manufacturers have engineering teams to insure their filters meet/exceed the lubrication and filtration requirements of the manufacturers' engine.

They engineer and specify the cheapest-to-manufacture and lightest filter that will suffice, in other words the smallest. If that's good enough for you, despite the drawbacks of shrinking media area to a minimum ...

During the long period I owned my last previous car, the size filter the filter manufacturers recommended for it kept shrinking. Guess why.

 

[Bellavita]

They engineer and specify the cheapest-to-manufacture and lightest filter that will suffice, in other words the smallest. If that's good enough for you, despite the drawbacks of shrinking media area to a minimum ...

During the long period I owned my last previous car, the size filter the filter manufacturers recommended for it kept shrinking. Guess why.

Hi CR94,
I wonder if the filters have gotten smaller because the engines are cleaner burning combined with improvements in motor oils and fuel.
The filters I buy state a life in miles with an efficiency of 99% at 20 microns. As long as those are maintained I feel the product is sound. I'm not sure if those specs are considered the cheapest because OEM filters don't advertise any performance specs to compare to.

 

[fantastic]

They engineer and specify the cheapest-to-manufacture and lightest filter that will suffice, in other words the smallest. If that's good enough for you, despite the drawbacks of shrinking media area to a minimum ...

During the long period I owned my last previous car, the size filter the filter manufacturers recommended for it kept shrinking. Guess why.

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Hi CR94,
I wonder if the filters have gotten smaller because the engines are cleaner burning combined with improvements in motor oils and fuel.
The filters I buy state a life in miles with an efficiency of 99% at 20 microns. As long as those are maintained I feel the product is sound. I'm not sure if those specs are considered the cheapest because OEM filters don't advertise any performance specs to compare to.

I'll even throw in oil filter improvements.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Yeah I understand, but the one on my car is mounted inverted so the threads at the top. The only place for the oil to go is down into the filter. My other car, however, has it's filter mounted on the side facing slightly downward so I'd expect that could leak back down.

Anytime there are oil galleries located above the oil filter, regardless of how the filter is mounted, the oil in those galleries can leak down if the ADBV in the filter leaks.

 

[ZeeOSix]

I called FRAM about running the longer 7317 filter on the `20 CX5 in my sig. as I already have them in stock for my Honda's. The guy I spoke to said "NO" only the 6607 is allowed.

Fram said that because the 6607 is the one they specify (for whatever reason), and if you used something different than the 6607 and it failed and caused a problem, then Fram would not cover it per their warranty. It's not because it wouldn't work, it's because of their warranty.

Also there was some confusion on some Mazda forums about anti-drain back valve or not to have as the Mazda filter do not have an anti-drain back. So I reached a dead end with uncertain answers so I am running the 1WPE-14-302 in mine until I know better.

No matter what engine it's on, a filter with an ADBV will not cause any issues.

 

[ZeeOSix]

There is very little point, it's hard to be sure whether the media of larger filters would be safe to use (due to it being for different vehicles), and without cutting them open you don't know how much media area you are gaining anyway.

When looking at the same brand filters, if the diameter is the same between two filters, but one is longer than the other, then the longer filter will have more media area.

 

[DGXR]

I know it's been mentioned already but I want to emphasize the possibility of a larger filter being vulnerable to road debris or other damage, as well as contacting any moving parts in/near the engine bay (mainly steering & suspension). Just because you can doesn't mean you should. Carefully weigh the benefits against any potential risks. Also, will you fully use the benefits provided by a larger filter? My $0.02

 

[twX]

I know it's been mentioned already but I want to emphasize the possibility of a larger filter being vulnerable to road debris or other damage, as well as contacting any moving parts in/near the engine bay (mainly steering & suspension). Just because you can doesn't mean you should. Carefully weigh the benefits against any potential risks. Also, will you fully use the benefits provided by a larger filter? My $0.02

Agreed. By far the most important job an oil filter has is keeping the oil in the engine where it belongs. The benefits of improved efficiency or holding capacity are usually pretty marginal.

Something else to keep in mind if you're oversizing in order to go multiple OCIs between filter changes, is that spin-on filter canisters will fatigue and weaken over thousands of pressure cycles, increasing the chance of the filter bursting. There's a reason ISO 4548 includes a test for this. They can also get rusty, which will weaken them further. Larger filters may be more exposed to salty road spray as well.

 

[Plawan]

A larger filter, given the same material, pleating, and construction otherwise, will tend to reduce the pressure drop across the filter at the same oil flow volume which improves filtration efficiency and reduces bypass events. It can also extend filter life through increased loading capacity, allowing it to filter longer before becoming clogged. There's also the slight increase in oil capacity and increased can surface area to aid in cooling.

Just be mindful of other things like the presence of a bypass. Some engines have the filter bypass built into the block and thus don't have it in the filter, allowing for more filter area. If that's your case, and your longer filter contains a bypass, you could end up with the same or slightly less total filter area compared to the smaller one without a bypass.

Great answer

 

[wpod]

I like the idea of a larger filter but in reality with proper maintenance barring any manufacturing or quality defects the engine odds are the engine will out last the rest of the car .

 

[MuzzleFlash40]

My Buick specs the short Fram PH3387 and I just picked up the longer PH3980. There’s really no reason not to, same by pass specs and gives the engine a little extra oil capacity.

 

[wemay]

Generally filters do not start in "bypass mode". Only really cold oil combined with a significant flare of engine rpm and of thick viscosity may cause BP to occur for a very brief moment of time. This has never proven to be substantially harmful. Jim Allen, many years ago, ran some dP BP testing and concluded that BP events are generally rare, and even when they do occur, nothing bad is happening; his UOAs were fine.

This is an overblown topic that seems to rear its head a few times a year; I guess it's time again ....

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[BigTimeTA]

The best oil filter is air-filter. Anything else is just a nonsense.

 

[ZeeOSix]

The best oil filter is air-filter. Anything else is just a nonsense.

Better remove your oil filter.

 

[BigTimeTA]

Better remove your oil filter.

I see this like I see army and police. If you've a useless army, you can bet the police is not going to be better. It's less than useless.

 

[ZeeOSix]

I see this like I see army and police. If you've a useless army, you can bet the police is not going to be better. It's less than useless.

Should probably read some wear vs oil cleanliness studies. Not one study says that dirtier oil results in the same or less wear than cleaner oil.

 

[BigTimeTA]

Should probably read some wear vs oil cleanliness studies. Not one study says that dirtier oil results in the same or less wear than cleaner oil.

Oh, I was trying to say that one is more important than the other.. way more important. Paying attention to the air filter is more imperically beneficial more than a bigger oil filter will ever be. Oil filter is dealing with wear metals and soot, etc and it's very basic to have, but if air filter is not doing it's job, oil filter is not going to be of use. Silicon vs wear metals? thank you, I'll take wear metals any day of the week. lol.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Oh, I was trying to say that one is more important than the other.. way more important. Paying attention to the air filter is more imperically beneficial more than a bigger oil filter will ever be.

Of course the air filter is "more important" on a comparative basis ... but in order to keep engine wear down as much as possible it takes more than just a good air filter.

Oil filter is dealing with wear metals and soot, etc and it's very basic to have, but if air filter is not doing it's job, oil filter is not going to be of use. Silicon vs wear metals? thank you, I'll take wear metals any day of the week. lol.

And what if the air filter isn't very good, or there's a leak past the air filter? What do you think is the only thing left to filter out what does get by the air filter and into the engine and oil sump? Yeah, the oil filter. So it's ridiculous to think and believe that the oil filter isn't very important and has no real use like some here believe.

 

[Chris142]

I use a factory size filter for the FJ
The Tacoma has a bottom mounted filter, I’ve switched to a Baxter spin on conversion

I tried larger filters on our fj. Just makes the timing chain beat up the runners.

 

[FlyingVan]

I don't think he said that the oil filter is not important so take it out completely. He is saying that it won't matter if the oil filter is smaller or bigger, it doesn't matter if the oil filter is 99% at 20 microns or at 30 microns, use whatever oil filter you want and don't worry about it. But make sure you use a good air filter and make sure that it filters as it should because that will destroy an engine in short time.

In other words, use whatever oil filter and your engine won't know the difference.