anyone here own a Kimber 1911?

[crater]

WOW. I have been asking stupid questions on how to work on my car, not knowing there was an actual firearms section. Now we are talking about something I can relate to....

In regards to Kimbers, I currently have two. Leaving in about 1/2 hour to go get another.

I have the ULTRA CDP and CUSTOM II. The Ultra is my daily carry and I trust it with my life. I had some issues at first, but after about 300 rounds and changing to Wilson Combat mags, it has been 100 percent. It loves the Federal 165 gr
Hydra Shocks. The Custom II has been 100 percent out of the box.

I am going to get a 4" Pro Carry this afternoon. Why, I don't know. Maybe to shoot my car with..

 

[Doug C]

UPDATE: I used to have a Kimber. I traded it for a S&W 629 Performance Center 3". No regrets; never really felt that comfortable with the Kimber. I am a dinosaur Wheel-Gunner!

 

[JetSnake]

As far as I can tell, the Glock 19 is 9mm only. People aren't actually using a 9mm for carry, are they? In law enforcement, the 9mm has proved to be an ineffective weapon and most are switching to the 40. I've always heard stories about the 9mm but didn't think they were true until I started working at Federal cartridge where I build the bullets for the 9mm and work with ballistic testing. I hear a lot of stories where the cops are shooting a guy with a 9mm and they just keep running.

 

[chevrofreak]

quote:

---

Originally posted by JetSnake:
As far as I can tell, the Glock 19 is 9mm only. People aren't actually using a 9mm for carry, are they? In law enforcement, the 9mm has proved to be an ineffective weapon and most are switching to the 40. I've always heard stories about the 9mm but didn't think they were true until I started working at Federal cartridge where I build the bullets for the 9mm and work with ballistic testing. I hear a lot of stories where the cops are shooting a guy with a 9mm and they just keep running.

---

I say you are completely full of it. Federal makes one of the most effective 9mm rounds available (9BPLE) that eqauls most .40 and .45 rounds for stopping power.

 

[JetSnake]

First, many of the rounds listed below are not Hydra Shok rounds so lets start with those. All of the 'Classic' loadings you mentioned such as the 9BP and 9BPLE are loads that use just a standard hollow point bullet. The
Classic line is our lower priced product that offers shooters a good, but less expensive alternative. These bullets are not Hydra Shok bullets however, just good old hollow points.

The Premium line is our higher end product. In this line you will find both the Hydra Shoks (P9HS1G1, P9HS3G1, etc.) and the HST (PHST1, PHST2). Hydra Shock bullets were created and designed about 1989. This was cutting edge technology for that era in terms of performance.

HST is our newest product and was just completed about a year ago. It represents the very best blend of the two styles (bonded, non-bonded). It is not chemically bonded, but because of the way the jacket and core are mechanically mated it holds its weight very much like a bonded bullet. Through barriers such as glass and sheetrock it performs remarkably well and actually expands greater than either the Hydra Shok or the Tactical. HST is the next generation of bullet and it offers better performance than Hydra Shok.

Tactical products (LE9T1 and LE9T5) are a Law Enforcement only line that is loaded not with Hydra Shok, but with a bonded bullet. The bonded bullet is much more capable of defeating barriers and staying together, offering superior penetration, weight retention and expansion over non-bonded bullets. Neither the Classic, Hydra Shok or HST are bonded.

So in a nutshell: Classic = std. hollow points; Hydra Shok is better, HST is the next generation of bullets while Tactical is the overall best bullet available by Federal in terms of performance through all the FBI testing protocols. HST is not far behind however and in some of the tests it actually outperforms Tactical, while costing about 25% less money.

 

[chevrofreak]

The HST has a very good track record so far, so, why were you saying 9mm isn't effective?

 

[Drew99GT]

I think more law enforcement agencies still use 9mm than any other caliber. The peppiest 9mm rounds you can but are equal if not peppier than the peppiest .45 rounds you can buy. Please correct me if I'm wrong but that was the conclusion I came to after looking at ballistics data a while back.

 

[Footpounds]

If by "peppier" you mean sheer velocity, I think you are correct. The fastest .45 can't beat the fastest 9mm. However, if by "peppier" you mean energy, then I think you are mistaken. The hottest .45 load packs more punch than the hottest 9mm load.

 

[Blake Sobiloff]

...but a good bullet (like the 4th generation Speer Gold Dot) will consistently expand to nearly the same size in either caliber and penetrate almost equally. I used to be a .45 snob, but the newest generation of bullets have really brought parity to the smaller calibers like 9mm and .40S&W. Use whichever you can shoot the best.

 

[chevrofreak]

Quote:

---

...but a good bullet (like the 4th generation Speer Gold Dot) will consistently expand to nearly the same size in either caliber and penetrate almost equally. I used to be a .45 snob, but the newest generation of bullets have really brought parity to the smaller calibers like 9mm and .40S&W. Use whichever you can shoot the best.

---

You'll never convince a lot of the diehard .45ACP fans of that though.

 

[Snake42]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
Well, I have my gun there "in case" and like knowing all I have to do is point and pull the trigger. Really, I got the Glock to have as more of a defense weapon and it's essentially "cocked and locked" all the time (when chambered).

I wasn't trying to dog on Kimber, they are a fine gun but not for me currently. If I had a collection with many guns (like it sounds you do JHZR2), then I'd likely buy another one.


The problem with most Glock owners is they don't understand that a Glock is in exactly the same condition as a 1911 that is cocked and not locked. The Glock is cocked with a round in the chamber and the only thing preventing the gun from firing is that little safety lever in the trigger that has to be depressed so the pistol can be fired. A 1911 is cocked with a round in the chamber and the only thing preventing the gun from firing is the grip safety which must be depressed so the gun can be fired. Me, I prefer the added protection of the thumb safety on the 1911.

 

[Snake42]

Originally Posted By: chevrofreak

quote:

---

Originally posted by JetSnake:
As far as I can tell, the Glock 19 is 9mm only. People aren't actually using a 9mm for carry, are they? In law enforcement, the 9mm has proved to be an ineffective weapon and most are switching to the 40. I've always heard stories about the 9mm but didn't think they were true until I started working at Federal cartridge where I build the bullets for the 9mm and work with ballistic testing. I hear a lot of stories where the cops are shooting a guy with a 9mm and they just keep running.

---

I say you are completely full of it. Federal makes one of the most effective 9mm rounds available (9BPLE) that eqauls most .40 and .45 rounds for stopping power.


Taint likely bro, when the 9mm is fully expanded (if it expands) ain't no bigger than the 45 before it expands at all. Also the 9mm tends to over penetrate and exit the target without expending all it's stopping power so that much is lost. The 9mm is somewhere between the 38 special and the 45 in stopping power.

 

[Snake42]

Originally Posted By: Blake Sobiloff
...but a good bullet (like the 4th generation Speer Gold Dot) will consistently expand to nearly the same size in either caliber and penetrate almost equally. I used to be a .45 snob, but the newest generation of bullets have really brought parity to the smaller calibers like 9mm and .40S&W. Use whichever you can shoot the best.


How can there be parity between the calibers when both expand the same percentage of their initial diameter. Therefor the 9mm cannot offer parity with the 45 because it can never expand to the same diameter?

 

[Snake42]

Just in case anybody is wondering, I own and shoot Kimbers, Colts,Smith$Wessons,Glocks,Kahrs,Brownings,Rugers,Walthers and
Barettas so I don't really get down on any brand of gun.

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: Snake42
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
Well, I have my gun there "in case" and like knowing all I have to do is point and pull the trigger. Really, I got the Glock to have as more of a defense weapon and it's essentially "cocked and locked" all the time (when chambered).

I wasn't trying to dog on Kimber, they are a fine gun but not for me currently. If I had a collection with many guns (like it sounds you do JHZR2), then I'd likely buy another one.


The problem with most Glock owners is they don't understand that a Glock is in exactly the same condition as a 1911 that is cocked and not locked. The Glock is cocked with a round in the chamber and the only thing preventing the gun from firing is that little safety lever in the trigger that has to be depressed so the pistol can be fired. A 1911 is cocked with a round in the chamber and the only thing preventing the gun from firing is the grip safety which must be depressed so the gun can be fired. Me, I prefer the added protection of the thumb safety on the 1911.


Sorry, carrying around a firearm with a fully exposed hammer cocked and one in the chamber doesn't give me the warm fuzzies. Plus, 1911s are huge. 45ACP is not gonna blow someone off their feet compared to 9mm. 9mm +p+ from Buffalobore or Corebon is gonna stop someone from uglying your face just the same as 45 ACP.

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
Sorry, carrying around a firearm with a fully exposed hammer cocked and one in the chamber doesn't give me the warm fuzzies.

Not much different from a Glock, XD, etc...you just can't see it. Which apparently makes all the difference...

 

[Drew99GT]

Fully exposed hammer with single action only...BIG DIFFERENCE. Glocks are striker fired and the striker resets at half cocked, so if it goes off accidentally, it won't go bang. And when you pull the trigger regardless of anything, it goes BANG. Ancient technology vs. modern technology.

 

[Snake42]

Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
Fully exposed hammer with single action only...BIG DIFFERENCE. Glocks are striker fired and the striker resets at half cocked, so if it goes off accidentally, it won't go bang. And when you pull the trigger regardless of anything, it goes BANG. Ancient technology vs. modern technology.

I think that the wisest statement made recently on this thread is that you should be comfortable with what you shoot and shoot it well. I must apologize to everyone for losing sight of that condition and letting my personal feelings interfere with this discussion. Personal beliefs aside most of the pistols named here are perfectly capable of achieving the aim of stopping an aggressor. To each his or her own is, in my opinion, the best way.

 

[chevrofreak]

Originally Posted By: Snake42
Taint likely bro, when the 9mm is fully expanded (if it expands) ain't no bigger than the 45 before it expands at all. Also the 9mm tends to over penetrate and exit the target without expending all it's stopping power so that much is lost. The 9mm is somewhere between the 38 special and the 45 in stopping power.


You need to do some more research on this. Most 9mm hollowpoints are over .451" diameter when expanded. Even the cheap ones.

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: Snake42

I think that the wisest statement made recently on this thread is that you should be comfortable with what you shoot and shoot it well. I must apologize to everyone for losing sight of that condition and letting my personal feelings interfere with this discussion. Personal beliefs aside most of the pistols named here are perfectly capable of achieving the aim of stopping an aggressor. To each his or her own is, in my opinion, the best way.


agreed