Based on my experience (have had too many used but more new) there is no clear winner overal as which is better. Depends on many factors including the car, the way it is used, money spent, and expectation. Having said that there is no substitude for a spanking brand new car that you personally hand pick from the lot, break it in and know the history. You also get the bragging right.
Another one of my points proven...
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and the smell that comes with it....
If only there were a time machine so we could see how the 2010s are holding out in 2020.
I think I'll wait for the trouble spots to become known, and for someone to take all kinds of pretty pictures and post instructions on a website on how to fix that known issue. And the aftermarket can invent a "problem solver" part that's heavier duty than the original. If I want them there are used parts on ebay and in yards. Look at the VW/Audi ignition coil situation where you couldn't get parts for one's new car!!
Never mind the reductions in excise tax and insurance.
I guess one could pick a powertrain that's been in production for nearly a decade, but you don't know if the PCM programming has been tweaked for the worse, or if some bean counter cheapened a gasket to the point of failure.
I think I'll wait for the trouble spots to become known, and for someone to take all kinds of pretty pictures and post instructions on a website on how to fix that known issue. And the aftermarket can invent a "problem solver" part that's heavier duty than the original. If I want them there are used parts on ebay and in yards. Look at the VW/Audi ignition coil situation where you couldn't get parts for one's new car!!
Never mind the reductions in excise tax and insurance.
I guess one could pick a powertrain that's been in production for nearly a decade, but you don't know if the PCM programming has been tweaked for the worse, or if some bean counter cheapened a gasket to the point of failure.
I hate buying clothes and houses but love buying cars and computers - the only two things I know anything about. On my 18th car now and will usually buy new, often with a year or more of enjoyable research.
My ideal would be to buy a new car with no warranty (suitably discounted) as I hate the way dealers treat cars and would rather do all my own repairs. The last new car I bought (a 2003 VW TDI in CA) the dealer smashed it up at the first service, only 5,000 miles. My current new car will never see a dealer's workshop.
My ideal would be to buy a new car with no warranty (suitably discounted) as I hate the way dealers treat cars and would rather do all my own repairs. The last new car I bought (a 2003 VW TDI in CA) the dealer smashed it up at the first service, only 5,000 miles. My current new car will never see a dealer's workshop.
Originally Posted By: eljefino
If only there were a time machine so we could see how the 2010s are holding out in 2020.
I think I'll wait for the trouble spots to become known, and for someone to take all kinds of pretty pictures and post instructions on a website on how to fix that known issue. And the aftermarket can invent a "problem solver" part that's heavier duty than the original. If I want them there are used parts on ebay and in yards. Look at the VW/Audi ignition coil situation where you couldn't get parts for one's new car!!
Never mind the reductions in excise tax and insurance.
I guess one could pick a powertrain that's been in production for nearly a decade, but you don't know if the PCM programming has been tweaked for the worse, or if some bean counter cheapened a gasket to the point of failure.
There is more risk involved with buying a used car than new. Used car is aged car. Mechanical failure rate is proportional to the age of the service. There is a reason used cars are cheaper. By the time a reasoably used used car that is worthwhile the savings has about 50k and up and all major services are becoming due slowly but surely. Some of the better cars are very expensive and hard to reapir. Short term savings might be good with a used car if you spend the time and energy to find a good one.
If only there were a time machine so we could see how the 2010s are holding out in 2020.
I think I'll wait for the trouble spots to become known, and for someone to take all kinds of pretty pictures and post instructions on a website on how to fix that known issue. And the aftermarket can invent a "problem solver" part that's heavier duty than the original. If I want them there are used parts on ebay and in yards. Look at the VW/Audi ignition coil situation where you couldn't get parts for one's new car!!
Never mind the reductions in excise tax and insurance.
I guess one could pick a powertrain that's been in production for nearly a decade, but you don't know if the PCM programming has been tweaked for the worse, or if some bean counter cheapened a gasket to the point of failure.
There is more risk involved with buying a used car than new. Used car is aged car. Mechanical failure rate is proportional to the age of the service. There is a reason used cars are cheaper. By the time a reasoably used used car that is worthwhile the savings has about 50k and up and all major services are becoming due slowly but surely. Some of the better cars are very expensive and hard to reapir. Short term savings might be good with a used car if you spend the time and energy to find a good one.
My concise answer to the OP is "kinda sorta".
It all depends. In my case, I could have nursed the Malibu along for another couple of years, had I not had some major road trips on the docket this summer. The trucks wouldn't work due to storage considerations, and the Cobalt was not an option, so I would have taken the Malibu. Maybe the trips would have been uneventful, or maybe I would have been camped out on the side of the interstate somewhere waiting for BP Motor Club's towing to come get me and wonder how much I was going to get dinged for whatever repair I had coming. That's not to say that the Sonata will be trouble-free, but I have an 800-number and a warranty to work for me.
But in all honesty, if all I was going to do this summer was commute to the train, I'd have kept the Malibu and taken my chances. Overall I tend to keep my vehicles 11-13 years.
It all depends. In my case, I could have nursed the Malibu along for another couple of years, had I not had some major road trips on the docket this summer. The trucks wouldn't work due to storage considerations, and the Cobalt was not an option, so I would have taken the Malibu. Maybe the trips would have been uneventful, or maybe I would have been camped out on the side of the interstate somewhere waiting for BP Motor Club's towing to come get me and wonder how much I was going to get dinged for whatever repair I had coming. That's not to say that the Sonata will be trouble-free, but I have an 800-number and a warranty to work for me.
But in all honesty, if all I was going to do this summer was commute to the train, I'd have kept the Malibu and taken my chances. Overall I tend to keep my vehicles 11-13 years.
I'm just thinking, I've been driving for almost 40 years, I've had some real junkers (especially in my early days) cars (many that were British!) dating back to as long ago as 1959. I've had car problems that could fill a book. But only once has my car let me down to the extent I've been stranded and that car was new (3 months old)
Quote;[Mechanical failure rate is proportional to the age of the service.]
Not true!, as pointed out earlier, the plot is more Bath-tub shaped.
Quote;[Mechanical failure rate is proportional to the age of the service.]
Not true!, as pointed out earlier, the plot is more Bath-tub shaped.
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I would buy used if people took better care of their cars instead of neglecting them.
Sorry but I will not put my wife and future kids in a car that I do not know the history of. We are are having to commute much farther now than before.
To me, the peace of mind is worth every penny.
Sorry but I will not put my wife and future kids in a car that I do not know the history of. We are are having to commute much farther now than before.
To me, the peace of mind is worth every penny.
Originally Posted By: expat
Quote;[Mechanical failure rate is proportional to the age of the service.]
Not true!, as pointed out earlier, the plot is more Bath-tub shaped.
Well that is the fundamental of wear and tear. If that is argueable IYO than facts are even challenged in here.
Failure by age/service is totally a different concept than by faulty design or neglect. In a used purchase all play a rule. In a new one only manufacturing quality is the dominant factor.
You may buy a used car and feel good about you savings in short run but long run it all depends. I could very well be a hit and miss and end up spending more money for what you get in relative terms otherwise everyone would have stuck to the used cars they have owned.
Quote;[Mechanical failure rate is proportional to the age of the service.]
Not true!, as pointed out earlier, the plot is more Bath-tub shaped.
Well that is the fundamental of wear and tear. If that is argueable IYO than facts are even challenged in here.
Failure by age/service is totally a different concept than by faulty design or neglect. In a used purchase all play a rule. In a new one only manufacturing quality is the dominant factor.
You may buy a used car and feel good about you savings in short run but long run it all depends. I could very well be a hit and miss and end up spending more money for what you get in relative terms otherwise everyone would have stuck to the used cars they have owned.
Quote: Failure by age/service is totally a different concept than by faulty design or neglect.
Either one would leave you standing at the side of the road.
But perhaps not! Failure by age/service will proberbly give you good warning. An ill fitted or faulty part can spontaneously fail.
All machines seem to need some 'shake-down' time.
I know, in industry, we used to breath a sigh of relief if the customer of a piece of equipment did not call in the first two weeks!
Either one would leave you standing at the side of the road.
But perhaps not! Failure by age/service will proberbly give you good warning. An ill fitted or faulty part can spontaneously fail.
All machines seem to need some 'shake-down' time.
I know, in industry, we used to breath a sigh of relief if the customer of a piece of equipment did not call in the first two weeks!
Perhaps a little off topic, but I happen to be goofing off from doing my 2009 Taxes and I happen to have a breakdown of my work truck running costs.
The truck is a very good condition 84 Toyota Extra Cab
Gas $850.62
Insurance $804.00
Oil and repairs $138.73
Depreciation isn't even worth calculating.
This is a typical year for the millage I did.
Last year was:
Gas $1726.57
Insurance $752.00
Oil and repairs $526.79
Now before you all jump in, I'm not suggesting that anyone plan on keeping a vehicle THIS long.
The truck is a very good condition 84 Toyota Extra Cab
Gas $850.62
Insurance $804.00
Oil and repairs $138.73
Depreciation isn't even worth calculating.
This is a typical year for the millage I did.
Last year was:
Gas $1726.57
Insurance $752.00
Oil and repairs $526.79
Now before you all jump in, I'm not suggesting that anyone plan on keeping a vehicle THIS long.
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Quote:
about 15 years or untill major components start failing,
I'd state that as all components, major and minor, start failing. The problem with the minor stuff is that it's so expensive for very little, but vital utility.
Today a very clean Chrysler LHS ..beautiful leather interior ..clean paint... everything, had worn out nylon bushings in the wiper linkage. No bushings available and the linkage arms were about $160. Most of the usual accessory mechanical items are available reman (pump, calipers, CV joints, etc.) but some single piece 12' long corroded fuel line that requires special tools and techniques to "refab" jacks the $2 repair to a $200 repair. While I can live with "work arounds", the average consumer:merchant relationship doesn't allow it and time is at too big a premium in vendor "re-engineering".
Buying used 3 year old stuff and keeping it 5 years is not a bad plan for maximum convenience and reduced costs.
That said, I'll keep my jeeps until I can't afford fuel for them. The parts availability should be well beyond my lifespan otherwise. I can throw any number of trans/t-case/axle combo's under it ..and the rest can be hacked or mod'ed as needed ..as many have done everywhere with ample documentation.
There are "anxiety factors" with some people. My wife is one such anxiety driven being. If there's a problem, she can't stand it. Stuff like getting a rental and whatever far cheaper alternative just isn't in the mix. It "gets in the way" of her otherwise (my term) "saturated" life agenda. I manage to cope with having her drive mine while I manage the "trouble free" existence.
about 15 years or untill major components start failing,
I'd state that as all components, major and minor, start failing. The problem with the minor stuff is that it's so expensive for very little, but vital utility.
Today a very clean Chrysler LHS ..beautiful leather interior ..clean paint... everything, had worn out nylon bushings in the wiper linkage. No bushings available and the linkage arms were about $160. Most of the usual accessory mechanical items are available reman (pump, calipers, CV joints, etc.) but some single piece 12' long corroded fuel line that requires special tools and techniques to "refab" jacks the $2 repair to a $200 repair. While I can live with "work arounds", the average consumer:merchant relationship doesn't allow it and time is at too big a premium in vendor "re-engineering".
Buying used 3 year old stuff and keeping it 5 years is not a bad plan for maximum convenience and reduced costs.
That said, I'll keep my jeeps until I can't afford fuel for them. The parts availability should be well beyond my lifespan otherwise. I can throw any number of trans/t-case/axle combo's under it ..and the rest can be hacked or mod'ed as needed ..as many have done everywhere with ample documentation.
There are "anxiety factors" with some people. My wife is one such anxiety driven being. If there's a problem, she can't stand it. Stuff like getting a rental and whatever far cheaper alternative just isn't in the mix. It "gets in the way" of her otherwise (my term) "saturated" life agenda. I manage to cope with having her drive mine while I manage the "trouble free" existence.
Originally Posted By: CaspianM
You may buy a used car and feel good about you savings in short run but long run it all depends. I could very well be a hit and miss and end up spending more money for what you get in relative terms otherwise everyone would have stuck to the used cars they have owned.
You're hoping everyone is logical. Some simply get bored with their rides or have kids etc or get out of the construction business and no longer need trucks.
Although, yes, the market does seem to flood with lemons under the phenomena you list.
You may buy a used car and feel good about you savings in short run but long run it all depends. I could very well be a hit and miss and end up spending more money for what you get in relative terms otherwise everyone would have stuck to the used cars they have owned.
You're hoping everyone is logical. Some simply get bored with their rides or have kids etc or get out of the construction business and no longer need trucks.
Although, yes, the market does seem to flood with lemons under the phenomena you list.
ls1mike
$50 Site Donor 2026
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Quote:
about 15 years or untill major components start failing,
That said, I'll keep my jeeps until I can't afford fuel for them. The parts availability should be well beyond my lifespan otherwise. I can throw any number of trans/t-case/axle combo's under it ..and the rest can be hacked or mod'ed as needed ..as many have done everywhere with ample documentation.
That is why I keep my 89 1 ton and still tow with it. 454/TH400. I can get everything for it cheap. I can get a really nice TH400 for 1500 bucks and have it swapped in a weekend. You can get just a normal truck TH400 with a 3 year 36,000 mile warranty for 780 bucks shipped to your door. Simplicity rules
Quote:
about 15 years or untill major components start failing,
That said, I'll keep my jeeps until I can't afford fuel for them. The parts availability should be well beyond my lifespan otherwise. I can throw any number of trans/t-case/axle combo's under it ..and the rest can be hacked or mod'ed as needed ..as many have done everywhere with ample documentation.
That is why I keep my 89 1 ton and still tow with it. 454/TH400. I can get everything for it cheap. I can get a really nice TH400 for 1500 bucks and have it swapped in a weekend. You can get just a normal truck TH400 with a 3 year 36,000 mile warranty for 780 bucks shipped to your door. Simplicity rules
Originally Posted By: expat
Perhaps a little off topic, but I happen to be goofing off from doing my 2009 Taxes and I happen to have a breakdown of my work truck running costs.
The truck is a very good condition 84 Toyota Extra Cab
Gas $850.62
Insurance $804.00
Oil and repairs $138.73
Depreciation isn't even worth calculating.
This is a typical year for the millage I did.
Last year was:
Gas $1726.57
Insurance $752.00
Oil and repairs $526.79
Now before you all jump in, I'm not suggesting that anyone plan on keeping a vehicle THIS long.
Attractive numbers in $. My camry 97 (bought new) is still going strong and only once has been in shop for a rack'n pinion replacemet and break job. It needs spark and timing belt.
Perhaps a little off topic, but I happen to be goofing off from doing my 2009 Taxes and I happen to have a breakdown of my work truck running costs.
The truck is a very good condition 84 Toyota Extra Cab
Gas $850.62
Insurance $804.00
Oil and repairs $138.73
Depreciation isn't even worth calculating.
This is a typical year for the millage I did.
Last year was:
Gas $1726.57
Insurance $752.00
Oil and repairs $526.79
Now before you all jump in, I'm not suggesting that anyone plan on keeping a vehicle THIS long.
Attractive numbers in $. My camry 97 (bought new) is still going strong and only once has been in shop for a rack'n pinion replacemet and break job. It needs spark and timing belt.
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I agree about the questionable history issue when buying new cars which is why I usually ask around amongst people I know whether they're looking to sell a car. People tend to be less willing to sell a lemon to someone they're at least somewhat connected to.
I bought my Protege from the daughter of my mother's coworker. It had 162k miles but she said it was well maintained and the car's condition jived with that. A couple new belts and some fluid changes for safety and its running like a champ. I never would buy a car with that many miles from someone I don't know from Adam.
IMO however, if you've had a vehicle for a long time (15+ years say) and it still fits your needs (size, gas mileage) and it needs a major repair, say an engine rebuild that will cost more than the car may be worth, it could still be worth doing. Consider the fact that after said repair, at least that component should be good for another long while. Plus I personally just like to run things (cars, computers, shoes, you name it) until they explode. In the case of my Explorer, it wasn't justified because of how much of a gas hog it is, and I still haven't completely written it off yet, its just "indefinitely decommissioned".
I bought my Protege from the daughter of my mother's coworker. It had 162k miles but she said it was well maintained and the car's condition jived with that. A couple new belts and some fluid changes for safety and its running like a champ. I never would buy a car with that many miles from someone I don't know from Adam.
IMO however, if you've had a vehicle for a long time (15+ years say) and it still fits your needs (size, gas mileage) and it needs a major repair, say an engine rebuild that will cost more than the car may be worth, it could still be worth doing. Consider the fact that after said repair, at least that component should be good for another long while. Plus I personally just like to run things (cars, computers, shoes, you name it) until they explode. In the case of my Explorer, it wasn't justified because of how much of a gas hog it is, and I still haven't completely written it off yet, its just "indefinitely decommissioned".
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I would not buy a used car from a dealer.
I've seen what a dealership can do in their Detail shop, talk about making a Sow's ear purse LOOK like a Silk purse!
You get a much better feed back of the cars history buying private.
People who don't take care of their house or self, proberbly don't care about their car! How old is the PO? (If buying a Honda Civic, do you want to buy it from a kid?) Do they have knowledge of maintenance requirements? Are they the First owners?
Service History (Dealers have been known to Fudge this)
It can be fun, like playing detective
I've seen what a dealership can do in their Detail shop, talk about making a Sow's ear purse LOOK like a Silk purse!
You get a much better feed back of the cars history buying private.
People who don't take care of their house or self, proberbly don't care about their car! How old is the PO? (If buying a Honda Civic, do you want to buy it from a kid?) Do they have knowledge of maintenance requirements? Are they the First owners?
Service History (Dealers have been known to Fudge this)
It can be fun, like playing detective
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